Don’t Underestimate The Impact of Losing

[Nostical]

Tom Herman on what's he's learned in his first year at Texas: "That three straight losing seasons takes its toll on kids, it really does. The players were overmatched. So were the coaches.”

I’m sure RE could say the same thing.

 

[Hornet22]

Tom Herman on what's he's learned in his first year at Texas: "That three straight losing seasons takes its toll on kids, it really does. The players were overmatched. So were the coaches.”

I’m sure RE could say the same thing.

Maybe it’s just me. Just seems like a different vibe. The kids that are coming in, if they commit to the weight room, will wind up being very good. He knows what he’s doing

 

[noeynox]

Maybe it’s just me. Just seems like a different vibe. The kids that are coming in, if they commit to the weight room, will wind up being very good. He knows what he’s doing

We heard the same gibberish from Diaco. We inherited a mess. P said he arrived to empty cupboards. This is the sorta talk coaches say to boosters. Edsall dropped the numbers from 2010 compared to 2017 to emphasize the crap job Diaco did. Coaches love doing this kind of thing.

 

[History Geek]

We heard the same gibberish from Diaco. We inherited a mess. P said he arrived to empty cupboards. This is the sorta talk coaches say to boosters. Edsall dropped the numbers from 2010 compared to 2017 to emphasize the crap job Diaco did. Coaches love doing this kind of thing.

Point well taken. I believe it this time though. There is something different about it. Yes, I’m still in wait and see mode after the last guys, but Ihave liked what I have seen out of HCRE2.0 so far. I think he has two more yeats to demonstrate the program is improving.

 

[whaler11]

Tom Herman on what's he's learned in his first year at Texas: "That three straight losing seasons takes its toll on kids, it really does. The players were overmatched. So were the coaches.”

I’m sure RE could say the same thing.

It’s more likely that Tom Herman believes in Santa than he believes he was overmatched this season.

 

[RSTuthill]

We heard the same gibberish from Diaco. We inherited a mess. P said he arrived to empty cupboards. This is the sorta talk coaches say to boosters. Edsall dropped the numbers from 2010 compared to 2017 to emphasize the crap job Diaco did. Coaches love doing this kind of thing.

Yeah, but data always beats BS. Every time. The only thing you might question with the Edsall data is where he drew the parse lines. I like to see distributions. Mean, median, standard deviation for each group of positions requiring similar skills. But Randy gave us much more than we ever had before.

 

[Nostical]

It’s more likely that Tom Herman believes in Santa than he believes he was overmatched this season.

I took his comment to mean before he came on board.

 

[gioff23]

I took his comment to mean before he came on board.

I think Tom Herman did what a good coach does - saying the kids were overmatched and leaving it at that puts it all on the kids. He said the coaches were overmatched so the kids knew he was all in with them.

 

[RedSoloCup]

We heard the same gibberish from Diaco. We inherited a mess. P said he arrived to empty cupboards. This is the sorta talk coaches say to boosters. Edsall dropped the numbers from 2010 compared to 2017 to emphasize the crap job Diaco did. Coaches love doing this kind of thing.

But in Edsall's case, he has seen the results of the work, and has developed players that have had further success.

I give an experienced coach with some success a bit more credibility than a snake oil salesman on his first gig. Both are in sales mode. One will take the time to show you proof.

 

[RSTuthill]

But in Edsall's case, he has seen the results of the work, and has developed players that have had further success.

I give an experienced coach with some success a bit more credibility than a snake oil salesman on his first gig. Both are in sales mode. One will take the time to show you proof.

Or at least the supporting evidence that led to his conclusions if not actual proof. I like his analytical approach although you gotta think that all top coaches have to have that stuff at their fingertips. In Randy's case he has a good solid baseline (2010) with which to make a valid comparison. The other two guys did not have that although you would have to think that they could have gotten some data from other places to use as a baseline. Aren't there coaching books out there that document team statistical profiles needed to be successful at certain levels?

 

[Hornet22]

Or at least the supporting evidence that led to his conclusions if not actual proof. I like his analytical approach although you gotta think that all top coaches have to have that stuff at their fingertips. In Randy's case he has a good solid baseline (2010) with which to make a valid comparison. The other two guys did not have that although you would have to think that they could have gotten some data from other places to use as a baseline. Aren't there coaching books out there that document team statistical profiles needed to be successful at certain levels?

It’s all fluff until the team reports for Spring/Fall camp and get to work. What I am a fan of is body type. Clearly RE2 recruited a certain body type for various positions. Bigger guys in the box. Speed and athleticism come next. We have some of that with our incomin skill guys. Third is football smarts. That’s the intangible that we can’t truly measure from a highlight tape, however, I trust that RE2 watched enough game film to measure how these kids adapt to different situations throughout the course of the entire game.
Time will tell how these kids adapt to the college level

 

[Palatine]

A losing culture didn't bother Scott Frost any.

 

[RSTuthill]

It’s all fluff until the team reports for Spring/Fall camp and get to work. What I am a fan of is body type. Clearly RE2 recruited a certain body type for various positions. Bigger guys in the box. Speed and athleticism come next. We have some of that with our incomin skill guys. Third is football smarts. That’s the intangible that we can’t truly measure from a highlight tape, however, I trust that RE2 watched enough game film to measure how these kids adapt to different situations throughout the course of the entire game.
Time will tell how these kids adapt to the college level

Yup, you can't really judge speed well on film unless you look at one guy for a LOT of games. But you can judge agility pretty easily. Awkwardness and first step quickness has a way of standing out.

 

[Hornet22]

Yup, you can't really judge speed well on film unless you look at one guy for a LOT of games. But you can judge agility pretty easily. Awkwardness and first step quickness has a way of standing out.

Let’s face it. And maybe you guys can speak to this even better. The secondary was atrocious right? Well all of these guys, albeit young and unproven, are all 6 ft and better and when you watch them on film not one looked like they didn’t belong on the field. That’s exciting to me. I say that because the DLine probably won’t get a major pass rush leaving lots of pressure on the backers and back 5. Longer, faster and more aggressive guys will surely help. Especially in those jump ball situations. I rewatched the Cincy game last night and with all due respect Fortt looked so unaggressive it was sad. Swann looks like the best DB coming back.

 

[ShakyTheMohel]

A losing culture didn't bother Scott Frost any.

One bad year does not make a losing culture. They were 31-9 the 3 seasons prior to 0-12. A little better than the 11-26 record that Bobby D had in his 3 seasons prior to RE 2.0.

 

[Hornet22]

One bad year does not make a losing culture. They were 31-9 the 3 seasons prior to 0-12. A little better than the 11-26 record that Bobby D had in his 3 seasons prior to RE 2.0.

Look at what Fresno did from last year to this year?
When you recruit good players and have a solid set of coaches that all buy in to one vision special things can happen.
RE2 is gonna turn this thing around.

 

[businesslawyer]

We heard the same gibberish from Diaco. We inherited a mess. P said he arrived to empty cupboards. This is the sorta talk coaches say to boosters. Edsall dropped the numbers from 2010 compared to 2017 to emphasize the crap job Diaco did. Coaches love doing this kind of thing.

Yes. But what is your point? You don't believe last year's team wasn't as fast or as strong as the Fiesta Bowl team? Really?

 

[noeynox]

Yes. But what is your point? You don't believe last year's team wasn't as fast or as strong as the Fiesta Bowl team? Really?

Did I say that?

My comment was to Herman saying what every coach that comes in and says. The last coach left him a mess. We know Diaco left Edsall a mess. Diaco claimed P left him a mess. Edsall said Diaco and Fridge left him a mess. P claimed Edsall left him empty cupboards. This is what coaches do. Had Herman gone 12-1, like he did at Houston his 1st year he wouldn't be singing that tune.

You're always trying to read more into things than what is said. It was a comment about coachspeak being self serving.

 

[whaler11]

One bad year does not make a losing culture. They were 31-9 the 3 seasons prior to 0-12. A little better than the 11-26 record that Bobby D had in his 3 seasons prior to RE 2.0.

Don’t ruin a one off special situation for Pal to use as a standard to whine about all season.

 

[ZooCougar]

Tom Herman on what's he's learned in his first year at Texas: "That three straight losing seasons takes its toll on kids, it really does. The players were overmatched. So were the coaches.”

I’m sure RE could say the same thing.

100% #coachspeak. Hey Herman. We get it.

The coach who doesn’t say that sort of thing impresses me more.

 

[weyuo]

Scott Frost took a losing culture and improved it because he was right in the middle of fertile recruiting grounds. Different story up here in soccer mom heaven.

 

[Hornet22]

Did I say that?

My comment was to Herman saying what every coach that comes in and says. The last coach left him a mess. We know Diaco left Edsall a mess. Diaco claimed P left him a mess. Edsall said Diaco and Fridge left him a mess. P claimed Edsall left him empty cupboards. This is what coaches do. Had Herman gone 12-1, like he did at Houston his 1st year he wouldn't be singing that tune.

You're always trying to read more into things than what is said. It was a comment about coachspeak being self serving.

With all due respect, your reply to my initial post made it seem like I was pointing out the self serving coachspeak aspect of Edsall. I was merely pointing out that if these players, with their potential, commit to the weightroom they can be very good. It has been proven that RE has an eye for kids with high upside.

 

[noeynox]

With all due respect, your reply to my initial post made it seem like I was pointing out the self serving coachspeak aspect of Edsall. I was merely pointing out that if these players, with their potential, commit to the weightroom they can be very good. It has been proven that RE has an eye for kids with high upside.

See zoocougar post. Edsall is not excluded from the self serving coach speak crowd. That's the point. I'm impressed by the coach who goes out and turns things around without needing to remind everyone of the mess they inherited. The people they're talking to, the ones who watch the games and would listen to their press conferences, know this. If a coach was not inheriting a mess, the previous coach wasn't fired.

 

[Hornet22]

See zoocougar post. Edsall is not excluded from the self serving coach speak crowd. That's the point. I'm impressed by the coach who goes out and turns things around without needing to remind everyone of the mess they inherited. The people they're talking to, the ones who watch the games and would listen to their press conferences, know this. If a coach was not inheriting a mess, the previous coach wasn't fired.

Can’t argue that point.
Duly noted

 

[businesslawyer]

Did I say that?

My comment was to Herman saying what every coach that comes in and says. The last coach left him a mess. We know Diaco left Edsall a mess. Diaco claimed P left him a mess. Edsall said Diaco and Fridge left him a mess. P claimed Edsall left him empty cupboards. This is what coaches do. Had Herman gone 12-1, like he did at Houston his 1st year he wouldn't be singing that tune.

You're always trying to read more into things than what is said. It was a comment about coachspeak being self serving.

O.K. I fully agree that most everything coaches say -- heck, everything most people say -- is self serving.

Unfortunately, in this case I fear that it is 100% true.