Discussion Topic - not OT

[KnightBridgeAZ]

You are an Athletic Director, and you just hired a new Women's Basketball Coach. You meet with the coach to discuss your expectations. Apart from the obvious clean program, acceptable academics, etc. what are your expectations for success on the court?

- if the team has a history of being in the top 25? or
- if the team is in a power conference but not historically a top 25 school or
- if the team is in a truly weak conference (NEC, Am East, MAAC, etc.)

Just curious what folks would consider "acceptable" success, as viewed by fans of by far the most currently successful program and one of the most successful programs of all time.

 

[Wally East]

- if the team has a history of being in the top 25?

base goal: stay in the top 25, win 1 NCAA game
reach goal: win conference, make Sweet 16, maybe Elite Eight. Make Final Four once in the next 5 years.

- if the team is in a power conference but not historically a top 25 school

base goal: enter top 25.
stretch goal: 25 wins. Make Sweet 16 within next 5 years. After four seasons, stay in top 25 consistently on a seasonal basis

- if the team is in a truly weak conference (NEC, Am East, MAAC, etc.)

base goal: compete for conference championship within four years
stretch goal: win conference tournament. Win 1 NCAA Tournament game within next 5 years. Make top 25.

 

[UcMiami]

I think you can look at CD's and Geno's expectations when they arrived at CT.
1. Be competitive
2. Win more games than you lose
3. Compete for conference championship
4. Get NCAA bid
5. Get to second weekend
6. Get to final four
7. Win NC
8. Dominate!
And you just jump in wherever the program has already reached.
If you are a mid-major, realistically 7 and 8 are probably beyond you and #6 mat be a pipe dream

 

[Icebear]

Geno and staff's only real goal is play the game the way it is meant to be played. Playing against perfection with 100% effort every play and you very likely will catch excellence. The AD should share those same goals.



Or as it is said below in my signature.

 

[Jim]

If you are the AD and you wait until after you hire someone to have that discussion, you should be fired.

 

[Wbbfan1]

I think UCMiami's goals are realistic. IMHO getting to the Final Four is an unrealistic expectation if you're not in one of the Power Conferences. However, winning the Conference Championship is a realistic expectation within 5 or 6 years if not in a Power Conference. I would add recruit and sign all the good local talent. Might lose the Elite Player but sign players ranked in the 50-200 range. By signing the local talent, you should be able to boost attendance and excitement in the program.

I think if the team you coach is in the AAC with UConn, I don't see any team winning the conference Championship in the next five years, if UConn is still in the Conference. UConn has to much advantage for the remaining AAC schools.

IMHO in WBB there are two Elite Teams; ND and UConn. South Carolina may be on the verge of becoming an elite team, if they continue to recruit like they have over the last two years. 2015 probably won't be a great recruiting year for South Carolina, but if they can sign one or two players in the Top 50 that will be enough for them to continue to build the program for the foreseeable future and obtain Elite Status. Even though Stanford hasn't recently won a Championship, I still considered them an Elite team, but now have them falling to just below that status. IMHO they're in danger of no longer dominating the PAC12. This will happen if the Elite California players stay in the PAC12 instead of going East to play College Ball. That seems to be the trend over the last couple of years. Duke has the talent and continues to recruit great players, but they consistently underachieve and are not an elite team until they can get to consecutive Final Fours. The Lady Vols have the potential to get back to Elite Status, but don't think it will happen as long as Holly is their coach. There needs to be a regime change before they get back to Elite Status. They still have the Name, Facilities and Resources to be an Elite Team, but if they don't make a change soon, South Carolina will be the team people will think about when there's talk about the SEC. With Sims' graduation, I no longer consider Baylor an Elite Program as their recruiting has fallen off. Louisville and Baylor may prove me wrong and should be considered as Elite teams. In Summary, I have UConn, ND, South Carolina and Duke as the best overall programs in the WBB for the next couple of years. Lady Vols could get back into the mix and I have doubts if Stanford can continue to be an Elite Program. The other programs that have potential to move up are UCLA, Texas and Cal. Ohio State might be another program if they can follow up their 2014 recruiting class with a great one for 2015. I don't include UNC in the mix because of their Coaching Staff. Now if Sylvia would retire, I would add them to my list.

 

[hjoerring]

A most interesting but very difficult question. As BU is looking for a coach I will put myself in their shoes. Realistically, what commitment does BU have for wbb? That will determine who they go after- Geno, Muffet or Faye Wilson from So Toledo Commun. Coll. This will determine how much money, etc., they are willing to put out: scholarships, facilities, staff. BU might very well be a prototype Univ that very happy to be ranked and overjoyed at being selected among the 64 teams. What is expected is to stay within budget, win more games then you L, and keep the student body engaged. Even at an elite U like Duke, I seriously doubt that the demand is a NC or final 4. Winning consistently, waxing the U image in the public eye, and proper conduct. That is why I laugh when my fellow boneyarders say that coach P will be sacked at Duke for not winning a NC or too few f.4 appearances.

 

[Wally East]

Even though Stanford hasn't won a Championship, I still considered them an Elite team,

I apologize for my need to be pedantic but Stanford hasn't won a championship recently. They have won two titles -- '90 and '92.

Also, I'd consider any team that made 6 of the last 7 Final Fours "elite." I would not remove them from that status until they stopped making the Final Four that reliably.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

- if the team has a history of being in the top 25?

base goal: stay in the top 25, win 1 NCAA game
reach goal: win conference, make Sweet 16, maybe Elite Eight. Make Final Four once in the next 5 years.

- if the team is in a power conference but not historically a top 25 school

base goal: enter top 25.
stretch goal: 25 wins. Make Sweet 16 within next 5 years. After four seasons, stay in top 25 consistently on a seasonal basis

- if the team is in a truly weak conference (NEC, Am East, MAAC, etc.)

base goal: compete for conference championship within four years
stretch goal: win conference tournament. Win 1 NCAA Tournament game within next 5 years. Make top 25.

I agree, recognizing that not everyone can make the stretch goal - more teams than opportunities.

Except for the weak conference teams where the stretch goal is virtually impossible - you can count on one hand the teams that have achieved winning NCAA games and made the top 25 out of over 150 teams.

There are teams that don't fall in any of my categories, for simplification purposes.

 

[Wbbfan1]

One I don't consider 22 & 24 years as recently as both were both Geno won his first one. I am predicting a downturn for Stanford's future, so I have no problem if anyone decides to keep them as an elite program. Tara may prove to more resilient that I think she will be. Because of its deserved Academic Reputation and Location Stanford is able to recruit enough players to keep them relevant. However, because of their Academic Requirements I'm not sure they can recruit enough Elite players to win multiple National Championships, never mind one. Is there a player on Stanford's roster today this is the equal in the abilities of either Nneka or Chiney? IMHO there is not. We'll have to see if Tara can get one in the 2015 Recruiting Class.

I apologize for my need to be pedantic but Stanford hasn't won a championship recently. They have won two titles -- '90 and '92.

Also, I'd consider any team that made 6 of the last 7 Final Fours "elite." I would not remove them from that status until they stopped making the Final Four that reliably.

I apologize for my need to be pedantic but Stanford hasn't won a championship recently. They have won two titles -- '90 and '92.

Also, I'd consider any team that made 6 of the last 7 Final Fours "elite." I would not remove them from that status until they stopped making the Final Four that reliably.

 

[Buzzyboy]

I apologize for my need to be pedantic but Stanford hasn't won a championship recently. They have won two titles -- '90 and '92.

Also, I'd consider any team that made 6 of the last 7 Final Fours "elite." I would not remove them from that status until they stopped making the Final Four that reliably.

They made those Final Four runs on the backs of the two Obuimike sisters who are now gone. They were the players that gave Stanford that extra edge to break through into the Final Four and without them or someone like them, they'll struggle to return anytime soon.

 

[Wally East]

They made those Final Four runs on the backs of the two Obuimike sisters who are now gone. They were the players that gave Stanford that extra edge to break through into the Final Four and without them or someone like them, they'll struggle to return anytime soon.

Sure and everyone knew that Notre Dame would struggle without Skylar.

 

[Wally East]

One I don't consider 22 & 24 years as recently

This was my point, exactly. You needed to added the "recently" to your statement. Because, yes, they have won two titles.

Those academic requirements aren't new. They will continue to get good recruits just as they have. Tara is an excellent coach and you can't ever dismiss a team of good players that have a great coach.

 

[Wbbfan1]

Thanks, when I originally wrote my post, "recently" was in my thought process, and can't believe I left it out as I knew Stanford had won Championships. I think Stanford will continue to be a good WBB program, but not as great as they have been over the last 20 years. Time will tell if I'm right or not.

This was my point, exactly. You needed to added the "recently" to your statement. Because, yes, they have won two titles.

Those academic requirements aren't new. They will continue to get good recruits just as they have. Tara is an excellent coach and you can't ever dismiss a team of good players that have a great coach.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Sure and everyone knew that Notre Dame would struggle without Skylar.

If you've read any of my posts you'd know that I think that Skylar leaving allowed the other very talented kids like Jewel Lloyd and McBride and their injured Canadian center (whose name eludes me) to play great team basketball. Skylar all too often kept possession of the ball too often at the detriment of the team in key situations. For a team to excel, they need to have at least one exception player and I don't see Stanford having anyone that can be that person on their roster or coming in anytime soon. You're right that there was a sentiment that Notre Dame wouldn't be the team they ended up being and I'll concede that I thought they'd have a dropoff but I knew they'd still be good because of their returning talent. The big concern for a lot of people was the freshman point guard who contributed nicely. I stand by my statement regarding Stanford. With other Pac10 teams getting better, with a nice influx of talent, they are going to have a much harder road to try and win their conference. The likelihood of them making the Final Four over the next few seasons is miniscule.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

They made those Final Four runs on the backs of the two Obuimike sisters who are now gone. They were the players that gave Stanford that extra edge to break through into the Final Four and without them or someone like them, they'll struggle to return anytime soon.

Technically, they made the national championship game in 2008 with Candice Wiggins, before either Ogwumike had arrived on campus.

But your overall point is still the same - Stanford has been led, in recent years, by a major superstar and has ridden that horse (pardon the expression) to elite status (Final Four berths, appearances in the national title game).

No such player is on Stanford's roster next year.

 

[Wally East]

I am predicting a downturn for Stanford's future, so I have no problem if anyone decides to keep them as an elite program. Tara may prove to more resilient that I think she will be. Because of its deserved Academic Reputation and Location Stanford is able to recruit enough players to keep them relevant. However, because of their Academic Requirements I'm not sure they can recruit enough Elite players to win multiple National Championships, never mind one. Is there a player on Stanford's roster today this is the equal in the abilities of either Nneka or Chiney? IMHO there is not. We'll have to see if Tara can get one in the 2015 Recruiting Class.

Okay, then. So noted