Creighton Postgame Thread | Page 3 | The Boneyard

Creighton Postgame Thread

Let me preface my comment with, my computer password is “Guru of Go”, after the 30 for 30 on Loyola Marymount with Paul Westhead. I love uptempo!!
I think our tempo on offense is too fast. (Not talking about transition O)
Like a band or orchestra that’s a little off. Is tempo the reason orchestras have conductors? Symptom- errors and missed easy shots. My little bit of coaching: tell players to “make all the looks”. Sometimes it takes a count or two for a play to develop.
Ash- missing 4 footers. Shot is too flat. Gotta fix it.
Serah- out of whack
Azzi- I’ve written before with no response, Azzi has to get her looks. Period. 15-18 shots a game. People are saying the Vandy guard will get AA over Azzi. What? Sarah can get hers, Azzi needs to be set up.
I just want to see the best we can be!
 
FanSince17 said:
Let me preface my comment with, my computer password is “Guru of Go”, after the 30 for 30 on Loyola Marymount with Paul Westhead. I love uptempo!!
I think our tempo on offense is too fast. (Not talking about transition O)
Like a band or orchestra that’s a little off. Is tempo the reason orchestras have conductors? Symptom- errors and missed easy shots. My little bit of coaching: tell players to “make all the looks”. Sometimes it takes a count or two for a play to develop.
Ash- missing 4 footers. Shot is too flat. Gotta fix it.
Serah- out of whack
Azzi- I’ve written before with no response, Azzi has to get her looks. Period. 15-18 shots a game. People are saying the Vandy guard will get AA over Azzi. What? Sarah can get hers, Azzi needs to be set up.
I just want to see the best we can be!
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To your point, we lost the best symphony conductor in history to the W.
 
We'll just write off the first quarter. If Creighton had shot their normal percentage from three, the game may have looked quite a bit different. The foul totals and turnovers for the Huskies are concerning as there a couple of challenges looming where they will need to play better or they (and us fans) may not like the results.
 
darkstar1 said:
This was not the first game to show that, unless the game is completely out of hand, either KK or K9, or both, need to be on the floor. The only real point guards and so quick and tenacious on D.
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I really agree with this. I think UConn is a bad version of UConn when KK or K9 is not on the floor.

I thought geno’s first substitution of the game was confusing. UConn was not playing that well and he brought in Allie and Blanca. I like Allie; but she is not going to bring a spark defensively. And Creighton just easily brought the ball up the floor during that stretch.
 
FanSince17 said:
Not sure that resuming after the move is accurate. If that was the case, there would be violations after almost all aborted moves/scoring attempts. Not sure the rule states this explicitly. I believe the player is given a reasonable opportunity to get out of the lane in this case.
Serah should pup a tent in there. Maybe roast some marshmallows.
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How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

  • Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
  • Resets: The count resets when:
    • The player leaves the key.
    • A shot is attempted.
    • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.
 
Centerstream said:

How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

  • Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
  • Resets: The count resets when:
    • The player leaves the key.
    • A shot is attempted.
    • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.
Expand ...
Did anything change? Seems to be the same rule as always.
 
.-.
Centerstream said:

How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

  • Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
  • Resets: The count resets when:
    • The player leaves the key.
    • A shot is attempted.
    • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.
Expand ...
Got it. So, player enters the lane, thousand 1 thousand 2. , drives to the basket, count resets. Question I'm tussling with, is the count at zero for entire drive or is it just a fresh count when offensive move begins?
What I'm seeing is all the stuff above and then the player jump stops or gets hung up in the lane, passes out, and then eventually they get out of the lane.
IMO the rule is being bastardized to the point of pure subjectivity by the refs when it could be enforced objectively.
 
FanSince17 said:
Let me preface my comment with, my computer password is “Guru of Go”, after the 30 for 30 on Loyola Marymount with Paul Westhead. I love uptempo!!
I think our tempo on offense is too fast. (Not talking about transition O)
Like a band or orchestra that’s a little off. Is tempo the reason orchestras have conductors? Symptom- errors and missed easy shots. My little bit of coaching: tell players to “make all the looks”. Sometimes it takes a count or two for a play to develop.
Ash- missing 4 footers. Shot is too flat. Gotta fix it.
Serah- out of whack
Azzi- I’ve written before with no response, Azzi has to get her looks. Period. 15-18 shots a game. People are saying the Vandy guard will get AA over Azzi. What? Sarah can get hers, Azzi needs to be set up.
I just want to see the best we can be!
Expand ...
Agree with your post, except clarifying the bolded and expounding on the underlined:
  • The underlined is a problem of the read and react when several successive possessions tend to find players other than Azzi and Sarah taking a shot; this was part of the problem in the MI game when MI raced to their end after many consecutive ineffective UConn half-court offense that didn’t involve Azzi and Sarah;
  • Paige last year did not allow this to happen as she assumed PG duty during certain times; and Geno called time-outs to draw certain plays (e.g. Azzi’s elevator play).
As for the bolded. Agree that the team can have better composure. But, I do not think increased PACE necessarily leads to a breakdown in composure.

Increased PACE (PACE = 74.1) along with more and better quality mix-match, is part of Geno and CD’s way to manage and exploit its deep quality roster;
  • having several BBIQ ball handlers (a BY topic this past summer) is a prerequisite and this team has them in spades;
  • Contender teams with deep quality rosters have similar PACE: South Carolina (74.5), UCLA (70.5), TX (74.1).
Are turnovers a necessary cost of playing this PACE? In the Creighton game, Serah (6) and Blanca (4) — two new Top Rotation players committed half of them; Azzi (3) and Sarah (2) had uncharacteristic TOs; it’s the 17th game (of 31 regular season games), a game within the “metamorphosis” period;
  • it will be corrected, as Huskee11 noted.
The fast PACE has enabled &1 quality bench development time in addition to a faster ramp for the key rotation players:
  • Preparation for March/ April (“Winning Time Rotations” + “Pocket Bridge Rotations”): 7:52 hours (69.46%);
  • Bench Development (“Top Bridge Rotations” + “Bottom Bridge Rotations”): 3:27 hours (30.54%).
And this year’s team, in mid-season, is increasingly becoming comparable to the better UConn teams.
 
NycUcWbbFan said:
Agree with your post, except clarifying the bolded and expounding on the underlined:
  • The underlined is a problem of the read and react when several successive possessions tend to find players other than Azzi and Sarah taking a shot; this was part of the problem in the MI game when MI raced to their end after many consecutive ineffective UConn half-court offense that didn’t involve Azzi and Sarah;
  • Paige last year did not allow this to happen as she assumed PG duty during certain times; and Geno called time-outs to draw certain plays (e.g. Azzi’s elevator play).
As for the bolded. Agree that the team can have better composure. But, I do not think increased PACE necessarily leads to a breakdown in composure.

Increased PACE (PACE = 74.1) along with more and better quality mix-match, is part of Geno and CD’s way to manage and exploit its deep quality roster;
  • having several BBIQ ball handlers (a BY topic this past summer) is a prerequisite and this team has them in spades;
  • Contender teams with deep quality rosters have similar PACE: South Carolina (74.5), UCLA (70.5), TX (74.1).
Are turnovers a necessary cost of playing this PACE? In the Creighton game, Serah (6) and Blanca (4) — two new Top Rotation players committed half of them; Azzi (3) and Sarah (2) had uncharacteristic TOs; it’s the 17th game (of 31 regular season games), a game within the “metamorphosis” period;
  • it will be corrected, as Huskee11 noted.
The fast PACE has enabled &1 quality bench development time in addition to a faster ramp for the key rotation players:
  • Preparation for March/ April (“Winning Time Rotations” + “Pocket Bridge Rotations”): 7:52 hours (69.46%);
  • Bench Development (“Top Bridge Rotations” + “Bottom Bridge Rotations”): 3:27 hours (30.54%).
And this year’s team, in mid-season, is increasingly becoming comparable to the better UConn teams.
Expand ...
Thanks for that!
I'm emphasizing a subtle slowing down of tempo in the half-court. Like the metronome on the top of your piano. Can't you adjust that to the tempo you want. Isn't that a big factor in a piece of music. I love those Sarah touch passes, no look but you add like a count before a decision is made. Too rushed and you miss a cutter. You don't give a cutter a chance to get there. You don't see an opening. You rush. You force something in order to play to the pace. What did Wooden say, "go fast but don't hurry".
 
Centerstream said:

How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

  • Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
  • Resets: The count resets when:
    • The player leaves the key.
    • A shot is attempted.
    • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.
Expand ...
I think Serah runs afoul of this rule in some refs' eyes because her "move" is often a dipsy-doodle or over-under move that takes a bit of time to unfold. She wants to fake right, pivot back left and then slip back to the right under the opponent's block. If she doesn't release a shot until the end of this little dance, a ref may well have decided it wasn't a shot and already blown the whistle halfway through.

I think Serah is still thinking in UW terms, where she was often the only or at least the primary scoring threat on the floor. Under those conditions, a more complex move might have been necessary most of the time. But when Sarah or Azzi get her the ball in the low post, it's usually because she's got single coverage and can simply go straight up without any fancy footwork. or at least without so much of it. As the season has progressed, she seems to have recognized this, but old habits die hard.

It must be a revelation for Serah to find herself on a team with the most advanced guard play in D1. She carried UW as far as they could go in her flat two seasons, and it was a heavy burden. In Storrs, there are other shoulders to share the load with her.
 
freshler40 said:
Me thinks the refs played as a 6th man with many odd calls not seen in some time.
Expand ...
One of the worst was the call against Sarah around midcourt when she did her classic Sarah move reaching behind the player to strip of the ball while on the dribble. The ref was so far out of position to make that call, both distance and angle wise, that it would have been impossible to actually see, to make the call.
My other evidence is the reaction of Sarah. Of all the games I have seen her play in a year and a half, I have never seen her respond like she did. She just doesn't react to a bad (or even marginal) foul call as we have often seen coming from Ash or KK, but she did to this call.
 
.-.
Bone Dog said:
I think Serah runs afoul of this rule in some refs' eyes because her "move" is often a dipsy-doodle or over-under move that takes a bit of time to unfold. She wants to fake right, pivot back left and then slip back to the right under the opponent's block. If she doesn't release a shot until the end of this little dance, a ref may well have decided it wasn't a shot and already blown the whistle halfway through.

I think Serah is still thinking in UW terms, where she was often the only or at least the primary scoring threat on the floor. Under those conditions, a more complex move might have been necessary most of the time. But when Sarah or Azzi get her the ball in the low post, it's usually because she's got single coverage and can simply go straight up without any fancy footwork. or at least without so much of it. As the season has progressed, she seems to have recognized this, but old habits die hard.

It must be a revelation for Serah to find herself on a team with the most advanced guard play in D1. She carried UW as far as they could go in her flat two seasons, and it was a heavy burden. In Storrs, there are other shoulders to share the load with her.
Expand ...
I may have to watch the games again but I think that most of the calls happened when she had at least two defenders around her.
I think by the time Serah sets her first foot into the lane, the ball should be incoming. No need to go into the lane unless the person with the ball sees you.
 
FanSince17 said:
Thanks for that!
I'm emphasizing a subtle slowing down of tempo in the half-court. Like the metronome on the top of your piano. Can't you adjust that to the tempo you want. Isn't that a big factor in a piece of music. I love those Sarah touch passes, no look but you add like a count before a decision is made. Too rushed and you miss a cutter. You don't give a cutter a chance to get there. You don't see an opening. You rush. You force something in order to play to the pace. What did Wooden say, "go fast but don't hurry".
Expand ...
Hence the bolded composure. You used the word tempo which, in basketball, is PACE.
  • Just clarifying that you want better composure (cadence) and are ok with the PACE.
 
Centerstream said:
I may have to watch the games again but I think that most of the calls happened when she had at least two defenders around her.
I think by the time Serah sets her first foot into the lane, the ball should be incoming. No need to go into the lane unless the person with the ball sees you.
Expand ...
You may be right. I didn’t do a film study of this, merely generalized from what I’ve noticed here and there. In any event, several times she was initially open and then she’s not. Serah has to expect to be double teamed shortly after she gets the ball in the low post even if it’s initially single coverage. I have to think Geno wants her to recognize where the help defender comes from in each case and then pass accordingly if she can’t make a quick move.

Much of this is pattern recognition and requires practice to respond to. For example, if the entry pass comes from Azzi on the wing, and Sarah is standing at the high post, their defenders are not likely to drop down to help. Then it will likely be weak side help and Ash or Allie will be open on the opposite wing. The defense will then rotate to compensate and create an opening somewhere else. Part of the point of a post entry pass is to force the defense to rotate and maybe make a mistake. And the crisper the perimeter passing game is, the harder this play is on them.

I ended up going down this rabbit hole because I was thinking about the 3-second calls on Serah and the possibility they are an artifact of her adjusting to UConn’s schemes after having spent three years at IW where the passing game is not nearly so crisp. Sometimes these rabbit holes lead nowhere.
 
NycUcWbbFan said:
Hence the bolded composure. You used the word tempo which, in basketball, is PACE.
  • Just clarifying that you want better composure (cadence) and are ok with the PACE.
Expand ...
Come on! You use your words, I use mine. I use analogies a lot in order to explain myself.
If I take a drumstick and tap it on a table to a specific beat. That tapping can be slowed down or sped up. I am encouraging our half-court O to be slowed down slightly in order to take better advantage of the team’s strengths.
This is not semantics. I’ve explained my position sufficiently.
 
Predicting Creighton a Top20 team next year. While I don't know how anyone can get kids to go to Nebraska, Flannery does a good job each year with recruiting and overall coaching. He has a good foundation today and with 1-2 strong additions will have a nice team next year.
 
HopJim said:
Predicting Creighton a Top20 team next year. While I don't know how anyone can get kids to go to Nebraska, Flannery does a good job each year with recruiting and overall coaching. He has a good foundation today and with 1-2 strong additions will have a nice team next year.
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Omaha’s OK, particularly if you’re interested in a good steak. Now 20 miles outside of Omaha it gets a little boring as there’s nothing but miles & miles of corn, soybeans, sorghum and a few scarecrows.
 
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Just watched the game. Creighton was playing well to start the game. They've gotta helluva player in Zediker. I know that last quarter we had our bench in there, but man that stretch late in the game was really impressive by Ava.

Very pleased with how well Blanca and K9 are playing now. Their progress from the beginning of the season to now has been dramatic. K9 is so aggressive and plays so hard and if she can hit the 3, well watch out. She's starting to become one of my favorites on the team. Blanca's athleticism to the basket is much watch TV. Looking forward to the next two games against Villanova (one of the best teams in BE) and ND who beat a ranked UNC team.
 
I just rewatched the game also, and paid more attention to Zediker. I particularly noted how she was able to drive right past KK on at least two occasions. That was very surprising, and suggests that other not-overly-quick guards may be able to do the same. (Maybe KK didn't respect her enough, or thought she wasn't as fast as she was?) I was also surprised not to see help defense when that was happening. Was that because everyone expected KK to have Zediker under control, and they were intentionally not helping and thereby leaving a defensive hole open elsewhere?

For the entire season, I don't recall anyone being able to drive past KK seemingly without much difficulty.
 
JoePgh said:
I just rewatched the game also, and paid more attention to Zediker. I particularly noted how she was able to drive right past KK on at least two occasions. That was very surprising, and suggests that other not-overly-quick guards may be able to do the same. (Maybe KK didn't respect her enough, or thought she wasn't as fast as she was?) I was also surprised not to see help defense when that was happening. Was that because everyone expected KK to have Zediker under control, and they were intentionally not helping and thereby leaving a defensive hole open elsewhere?

For the entire season, I don't recall anyone being able to drive past KK seemingly without much difficulty.
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I just watched the replay too. Of the two occasions you mentioned, I know for sure that KK played the matador defense when Zediker drove down the left side of the lane for an easy basket right after KK picked up her second (or possibly third) foul. It was a smart play by Creighton to go right at KK in that moment.
 
I can't help but think that KK is somewhat affected by her injury, I imagine that with her high level of activity on the court that it must affect her to some degree, however small. That could mean that she's not functioning at 100%.
 
I agree with Centerstream. KK picked up two quick fouls. She became much less aggressive defensively. Zediker is going to be good. Hopefully Flannery can keep her and the other freshman together.
 
sun said:
I can't help but think that KK is somewhat affected by her injury, I imagine that with her high level of activity on the court that it must affect her to some degree, however small. That could mean that she's not functioning at 100%.
Expand ...
KK expected help. I expected help. Where was the weak-side big? Serah- reacting slow?
 
.-.
sun said:
I can't help but think that KK is somewhat affected by her injury, I imagine that with her high level of activity on the court that it must affect her to some degree, however small. That could mean that she's not functioning at 100%.
Expand ...
Especially when she seems to be getting hit on her face, unintentionally, most every game now.
 
Centerstream said:
I just watched the replay too. Of the two occasions you mentioned, I know for sure that KK played the matador defense when Zediker drove down the left side of the lane for an easy basket right after KK picked up her second (or possibly third) foul. It was a smart play by Creighton to go right at KK in that moment.
Expand ...
Nine seconds into the 3rd quarter KK picked up her 3rd foul on a Zediker drive and score, thn on Creightons next possession she definitely played a matador defense to avoid picking up her 4th. She subbed out a couple minutes later and didn't return until there was abt a minute left in the quarter and I don’t believe she played any of the 4th. Zediker scored 23 points and as far as I saw only 8 came while KK was defending her. All in all it was a average KK game 5 pts 4 assists 4 steals and no TOs...oh and 2 whacks on the mask. I also noticed that Creighton only had 10 players listed and 8 are as guards. Highly unusual.
 
Dogstar said:
Zediker scored 23 points and as far as I saw only 8 came while KK was defending her. All in all it was a average KK game 5 pts 4 assists 4 steals and no TOs...oh and 2 whacks on the mask. I also noticed that Creighton only had 10 players listed and 8 are as guards. Highly unusual.
Expand ...
Zediker scored 14 of her 23 points in the 4th quarter, and as you said, most came with KK on the bench.
 
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