Creighton Postgame Thread

[sun]

Jana's absence may have led to Serah & Sarah getting 4 fouls each.

 

[freshler40]

Jana's absence may have led to Serah & Sarah getting 4 fouls each.

Me thinks the refs played as a 6th man with many odd calls not seen in some time.

 

[Skeets]

Can I recommend something? Try to convince her that not everything is about winning and losing if you aren't really projected to be the among the best any way. Can you imagine if you had a daughter who was a good but not a great player or a best friend's daughter or even a close friend work colleague that had played against an all-time great; would the conversation be all about whether that person won or how many they lost by?

I had an opportunity to go against a college all-American, Olympic gold medal Winer, and played in the NBA for many years. He destroyed me and it was one of my highlights just as a high school player. It was an honor. I'd be very surprised if Creighton felt any other way. They said it was a rebuilding season for them. Now if this was Texas, that would be different because it would mean more likely they quit.

And for any senior as an example - they may have a child that's watching Sarah Strong and Blanca Quinonez in the WNBA and could tell their kid they played against them in college. And maybe they'd have a story that they blocked a shot of Sarahs or stiole some passes or hit some jumpers over them etc.

It's not all about wins and losses for some teams and some players. school is more important for many. Anything else it's an honor.

Reminds me of when they let pros in the Olympics and the U.S. fielded the "Dream Team". Teams from other countries were coming up to them to get their autographs. So yes, it's not always about winning and losing, sometimes it's about the experience.

 

[VaConnFan11]

I thought I heard someone say a game or so ago, that Serah "thought" that the count starts over if she is passed the ball. What is the rule there?

The 3 second count pauses once you get the ball while you are making a move to shoot. If you don't shoot after making the move, then the count resumes. It only starts over if you leave the lane and reenter.

 

[Sun Dog]

Just wondering if 18 fouls and 21 turnovers will get it done against ND? And, I could make an argument that the second best player on the court was Zediker. Loved her fight!

 

[Phil]

Yes. According to the box score they took one away from Zediker. When the game ended she was credited with 4, now it's 3.

Thanks, I was wondering that myself.

 

[Huskee11]

UConn expanded a 19-14 lead late in the first quarter to a 38-14 lead midway through the second quarter. That was the game. That also is a major theme of this season, the ability of UConn to go on long runs while holding the other team scoreless or almost scoreless, in this case scoreless for over six minutes.

The sloppiness is disconcerting but the bad passes of Sarah, Azzi and Blanca are mostly careless, unforced, long low percentage passes. Seemingly very correctible. Serah is a bit more concerning in that she sometimes gets herself in awkward, off balance positions and her passes are bailout attempts. Her passes are also often low and difficult to handle.

Zediker looked good in the second half, but she only had three points in the first half and by that time UConn was already up by 33 points. Hopefully she stays at Creighton for four years.

Obviously room for improvement, but this was a 41 point win on the road against a quality program that may be down this year, but quality nonetheless, and a seasoned coach that probably knows how to game plan against UConn as well or better than anyone.

 

[Kat]

Ava Zediker is a ballplayer. Reminded me of a tough, talented lanky kid who once plated for the Huskies.

 

[Vancat]

Renee came up with a new moniker which was apparently suggested by her social media followers. When Sarah Strong made a great play (an and-1), Renee called it a "Sarah-mony".

Beware, we may have to get dressed up for future Sarah-monies at Gampel or People's Bank.

Before long, we may even see some Serah-monies. I wonder if those will require an invitation?

Thanks for this! I guess I didn't 'get it' the first time around.

 

[FanSince17]

The 3 second count pauses once you get the ball while you are making a move to shoot. If you don't shoot after making the move, then the count resumes. It only starts over if you leave the lane and reenter.

Not sure that resuming after the move is accurate. If that was the case, there would be violations after almost all aborted moves/scoring attempts. Not sure the rule states this explicitly. I believe the player is given a reasonable opportunity to get out of the lane in this case.
Serah should pup a tent in there. Maybe roast some marshmallows.

 

[FanSince17]

Let me preface my comment with, my computer password is “Guru of Go”, after the 30 for 30 on Loyola Marymount with Paul Westhead. I love uptempo!!
I think our tempo on offense is too fast. (Not talking about transition O)
Like a band or orchestra that’s a little off. Is tempo the reason orchestras have conductors? Symptom- errors and missed easy shots. My little bit of coaching: tell players to “make all the looks”. Sometimes it takes a count or two for a play to develop.
Ash- missing 4 footers. Shot is too flat. Gotta fix it.
Serah- out of whack
Azzi- I’ve written before with no response, Azzi has to get her looks. Period. 15-18 shots a game. People are saying the Vandy guard will get AA over Azzi. What? Sarah can get hers, Azzi needs to be set up.
I just want to see the best we can be!

 

[oldude]

Let me preface my comment with, my computer password is “Guru of Go”, after the 30 for 30 on Loyola Marymount with Paul Westhead. I love uptempo!!
I think our tempo on offense is too fast. (Not talking about transition O)
Like a band or orchestra that’s a little off. Is tempo the reason orchestras have conductors? Symptom- errors and missed easy shots. My little bit of coaching: tell players to “make all the looks”. Sometimes it takes a count or two for a play to develop.
Ash- missing 4 footers. Shot is too flat. Gotta fix it.
Serah- out of whack
Azzi- I’ve written before with no response, Azzi has to get her looks. Period. 15-18 shots a game. People are saying the Vandy guard will get AA over Azzi. What? Sarah can get hers, Azzi needs to be set up.
I just want to see the best we can be!

To your point, we lost the best symphony conductor in history to the W.

 

[Ozimoto]

We'll just write off the first quarter. If Creighton had shot their normal percentage from three, the game may have looked quite a bit different. The foul totals and turnovers for the Huskies are concerning as there a couple of challenges looming where they will need to play better or they (and us fans) may not like the results.

 

[Stagnant]

This was not the first game to show that, unless the game is completely out of hand, either KK or K9, or both, need to be on the floor. The only real point guards and so quick and tenacious on D.

I really agree with this. I think UConn is a bad version of UConn when KK or K9 is not on the floor.

I thought geno’s first substitution of the game was confusing. UConn was not playing that well and he brought in Allie and Blanca. I like Allie; but she is not going to bring a spark defensively. And Creighton just easily brought the ball up the floor during that stretch.

 

[Centerstream]

Not sure that resuming after the move is accurate. If that was the case, there would be violations after almost all aborted moves/scoring attempts. Not sure the rule states this explicitly. I believe the player is given a reasonable opportunity to get out of the lane in this case.
Serah should pup a tent in there. Maybe roast some marshmallows.

How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

• Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
• Resets: The count resets when:
  • The player leaves the key.
  • A shot is attempted.
  • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.

 

[TheGOAT23]

How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

• Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
• Resets: The count resets when:
  • The player leaves the key.
  • A shot is attempted.
  • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.

Did anything change? Seems to be the same rule as always.

 

[FanSince17]

How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

• Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
• Resets: The count resets when:
  • The player leaves the key.
  • A shot is attempted.
  • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.

Got it. So, player enters the lane, thousand 1 thousand 2. , drives to the basket, count resets. Question I'm tussling with, is the count at zero for entire drive or is it just a fresh count when offensive move begins?
What I'm seeing is all the stuff above and then the player jump stops or gets hung up in the lane, passes out, and then eventually they get out of the lane.
IMO the rule is being bastardized to the point of pure subjectivity by the refs when it could be enforced objectively.

 

[Centerstream]

Did anything change? Seems to be the same rule as always.

No changes, I was replying to a previous post

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

Let me preface my comment with, my computer password is “Guru of Go”, after the 30 for 30 on Loyola Marymount with Paul Westhead. I love uptempo!!
I think our tempo on offense is too fast. (Not talking about transition O)
Like a band or orchestra that’s a little off. Is tempo the reason orchestras have conductors? Symptom- errors and missed easy shots. My little bit of coaching: tell players to “make all the looks”. Sometimes it takes a count or two for a play to develop.
Ash- missing 4 footers. Shot is too flat. Gotta fix it.
Serah- out of whack
Azzi- I’ve written before with no response, Azzi has to get her looks. Period. 15-18 shots a game. People are saying the Vandy guard will get AA over Azzi. What? Sarah can get hers, Azzi needs to be set up.
I just want to see the best we can be!

Agree with your post, except clarifying the bolded and expounding on the underlined:

• The underlined is a problem of the read and react when several successive possessions tend to find players other than Azzi and Sarah taking a shot; this was part of the problem in the MI game when MI raced to their end after many consecutive ineffective UConn half-court offense that didn’t involve Azzi and Sarah;
• Paige last year did not allow this to happen as she assumed PG duty during certain times; and Geno called time-outs to draw certain plays (e.g. Azzi’s elevator play).

As for the bolded. Agree that the team can have better composure. But, I do not think increased PACE necessarily leads to a breakdown in composure.

Increased PACE (PACE = 74.1) along with more and better quality mix-match, is part of Geno and CD’s way to manage and exploit its deep quality roster;

• having several BBIQ ball handlers (a BY topic this past summer) is a prerequisite and this team has them in spades;
• Contender teams with deep quality rosters have similar PACE: South Carolina (74.5), UCLA (70.5), TX (74.1).

Are turnovers a necessary cost of playing this PACE? In the Creighton game, Serah (6) and Blanca (4) — two new Top Rotation players committed half of them; Azzi (3) and Sarah (2) had uncharacteristic TOs; it’s the 17th game (of 31 regular season games), a game within the “metamorphosis” period;

• it will be corrected, as Huskee11 noted.

The fast PACE has enabled &1 quality bench development time in addition to a faster ramp for the key rotation players:

• Preparation for March/ April (“Winning Time Rotations” + “Pocket Bridge Rotations”): 7:52 hours (69.46%);
• Bench Development (“Top Bridge Rotations” + “Bottom Bridge Rotations”): 3:27 hours (30.54%).

And this year’s team, in mid-season, is increasingly becoming comparable to the better UConn teams.

 

[FanSince17]

Agree with your post, except clarifying the bolded and expounding on the underlined:

• The underlined is a problem of the read and react when several successive possessions tend to find players other than Azzi and Sarah taking a shot; this was part of the problem in the MI game when MI raced to their end after many consecutive ineffective UConn half-court offense that didn’t involve Azzi and Sarah;
• Paige last year did not allow this to happen as she assumed PG duty during certain times; and Geno called time-outs to draw certain plays (e.g. Azzi’s elevator play).

As for the bolded. Agree that the team can have better composure. But, I do not think increased PACE necessarily leads to a breakdown in composure.

Increased PACE (PACE = 74.1) along with more and better quality mix-match, is part of Geno and CD’s way to manage and exploit its deep quality roster;

• having several BBIQ ball handlers (a BY topic this past summer) is a prerequisite and this team has them in spades;
• Contender teams with deep quality rosters have similar PACE: South Carolina (74.5), UCLA (70.5), TX (74.1).

Are turnovers a necessary cost of playing this PACE? In the Creighton game, Serah (6) and Blanca (4) — two new Top Rotation players committed half of them; Azzi (3) and Sarah (2) had uncharacteristic TOs; it’s the 17th game (of 31 regular season games), a game within the “metamorphosis” period;

• it will be corrected, as Huskee11 noted.

The fast PACE has enabled &1 quality bench development time in addition to a faster ramp for the key rotation players:

• Preparation for March/ April (“Winning Time Rotations” + “Pocket Bridge Rotations”): 7:52 hours (69.46%);
• Bench Development (“Top Bridge Rotations” + “Bottom Bridge Rotations”): 3:27 hours (30.54%).

And this year’s team, in mid-season, is increasingly becoming comparable to the better UConn teams.

Thanks for that!
I'm emphasizing a subtle slowing down of tempo in the half-court. Like the metronome on the top of your piano. Can't you adjust that to the tempo you want. Isn't that a big factor in a piece of music. I love those Sarah touch passes, no look but you add like a count before a decision is made. Too rushed and you miss a cutter. You don't give a cutter a chance to get there. You don't see an opening. You rush. You force something in order to play to the pace. What did Wooden say, "go fast but don't hurry".

 

[Bone Dog]

How the Rule Works​

Timing of the Count​

• Starts: The count begins when one foot enters the key.
• Resets: The count resets when:
  • The player leaves the key.
  • A shot is attempted.
  • The player receives the ball and makes an active move to score.

I think Serah runs afoul of this rule in some refs' eyes because her "move" is often a dipsy-doodle or over-under move that takes a bit of time to unfold. She wants to fake right, pivot back left and then slip back to the right under the opponent's block. If she doesn't release a shot until the end of this little dance, a ref may well have decided it wasn't a shot and already blown the whistle halfway through.

I think Serah is still thinking in UW terms, where she was often the only or at least the primary scoring threat on the floor. Under those conditions, a more complex move might have been necessary most of the time. But when Sarah or Azzi get her the ball in the low post, it's usually because she's got single coverage and can simply go straight up without any fancy footwork. or at least without so much of it. As the season has progressed, she seems to have recognized this, but old habits die hard.

It must be a revelation for Serah to find herself on a team with the most advanced guard play in D1. She carried UW as far as they could go in her flat two seasons, and it was a heavy burden. In Storrs, there are other shoulders to share the load with her.

 

[Bills Fan]

Me thinks the refs played as a 6th man with many odd calls not seen in some time.

One of the worst was the call against Sarah around midcourt when she did her classic Sarah move reaching behind the player to strip of the ball while on the dribble. The ref was so far out of position to make that call, both distance and angle wise, that it would have been impossible to actually see, to make the call.
My other evidence is the reaction of Sarah. Of all the games I have seen her play in a year and a half, I have never seen her respond like she did. She just doesn't react to a bad (or even marginal) foul call as we have often seen coming from Ash or KK, but she did to this call.

 

[Centerstream]

I think Serah runs afoul of this rule in some refs' eyes because her "move" is often a dipsy-doodle or over-under move that takes a bit of time to unfold. She wants to fake right, pivot back left and then slip back to the right under the opponent's block. If she doesn't release a shot until the end of this little dance, a ref may well have decided it wasn't a shot and already blown the whistle halfway through.

I think Serah is still thinking in UW terms, where she was often the only or at least the primary scoring threat on the floor. Under those conditions, a more complex move might have been necessary most of the time. But when Sarah or Azzi get her the ball in the low post, it's usually because she's got single coverage and can simply go straight up without any fancy footwork. or at least without so much of it. As the season has progressed, she seems to have recognized this, but old habits die hard.

It must be a revelation for Serah to find herself on a team with the most advanced guard play in D1. She carried UW as far as they could go in her flat two seasons, and it was a heavy burden. In Storrs, there are other shoulders to share the load with her.

I may have to watch the games again but I think that most of the calls happened when she had at least two defenders around her.
I think by the time Serah sets her first foot into the lane, the ball should be incoming. No need to go into the lane unless the person with the ball sees you.

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

Thanks for that!
I'm emphasizing a subtle slowing down of tempo in the half-court. Like the metronome on the top of your piano. Can't you adjust that to the tempo you want. Isn't that a big factor in a piece of music. I love those Sarah touch passes, no look but you add like a count before a decision is made. Too rushed and you miss a cutter. You don't give a cutter a chance to get there. You don't see an opening. You rush. You force something in order to play to the pace. What did Wooden say, "go fast but don't hurry".

Hence the bolded composure. You used the word tempo which, in basketball, is PACE.

• Just clarifying that you want better composure (cadence) and are ok with the PACE.

 

[Bone Dog]

I may have to watch the games again but I think that most of the calls happened when she had at least two defenders around her.
I think by the time Serah sets her first foot into the lane, the ball should be incoming. No need to go into the lane unless the person with the ball sees you.

You may be right. I didn’t do a film study of this, merely generalized from what I’ve noticed here and there. In any event, several times she was initially open and then she’s not. Serah has to expect to be double teamed shortly after she gets the ball in the low post even if it’s initially single coverage. I have to think Geno wants her to recognize where the help defender comes from in each case and then pass accordingly if she can’t make a quick move.

Much of this is pattern recognition and requires practice to respond to. For example, if the entry pass comes from Azzi on the wing, and Sarah is standing at the high post, their defenders are not likely to drop down to help. Then it will likely be weak side help and Ash or Allie will be open on the opposite wing. The defense will then rotate to compensate and create an opening somewhere else. Part of the point of a post entry pass is to force the defense to rotate and maybe make a mistake. And the crisper the perimeter passing game is, the harder this play is on them.

I ended up going down this rabbit hole because I was thinking about the 3-second calls on Serah and the possibility they are an artifact of her adjusting to UConn’s schemes after having spent three years at IW where the passing game is not nearly so crisp. Sometimes these rabbit holes lead nowhere.