Connie Yori: Game is 'over-coached, under-taught'

[pap49cba]

Geno has been making the same points for years now... LINK

 

[Icebear]

I believe this is absolutely true.

 

[HuskyMJ]

aau basketball like the coach said. 100 games a year, how can you improve your skills? You are just reinforcing whatever good and bad traits you have by playing so much. Not to mention injury factor goes way up, so many ACL tears now a days. Why should kids be playing longer seasons than NBA players when these kids don't get trainers, nutritionists, the best medical staff. 3 games in 1 day is common and it cannot be good.

 

[vtcwbuff]

I have never payed much attention to AAU basketball. Where does the money come from - where does it go?

 

[huskyblooz]

I am now a huge fan of Nebraska basketball, now. She is 100% right.

 

[CBus13]

I've always really been a fan of Yori. Her teams always play well and smart and she gets results even though she never gets a top recruit.

 

[easttexastrash]

Too many players just don't seem to work on shooting. There are many players who are so good at getting to the rim that they don't spend the time working on their shooting.

 

[UcMiami]

Geno has been making the same points for years now... LINK

Nice find.
100 games!!! That is just crazy. And so much of AAU ball is just showing up for tournaments and spending an hour introducing yourself to your teammates.
Geno and a number of other folks involved in the game have beaten this drum, too.
I think some of it is an idea that you have to 'advertise' by being seen everywhere in order to generate interest in scholarship offers. The reality is a player like Chong who played basically only local AAU will generate interest with her skill regardless of being seen. In some ways the HS ranking services perpetuate this infatuation with AAU as that is their primary viewing window and again Chong never gets seen and therefore suffers being unranked or lower ranked than her skill deserves.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Agree with everything said. But I prefer the terminology that so many young players lack the basketball fundamentals. I also suspect, but don't know for sure, that some of what we see at the college level comes from the good player's dominance at the lower levels, so they didn't have to learn to run plays or look for the "best" shot, as any shot by them was the best shot on the team.

In any case, this whole issue is one of the things I blame for the struggles that CVS has in today's game. Not that I claim it has passed her by, as some do, but rather that she struggles to get the players that are fundamentally sound to the degree she expects / needs to run the system she uses, especially on offense (she teaches the defense well).

 

[Icebear]

Agree with everything said. But I prefer the terminology that so many young players lack the basketball fundamentals. I also suspect, but don't know for sure, that some of what we see at the college level comes from the good player's dominance at the lower levels, so they didn't have to learn to run plays or look for the "best" shot, as any shot by them was the best shot on the team.

In any case, this whole issue is one of the things I blame for the struggles that CVS has in today's game. Not that I claim it has passed her by, as some do, but rather that she struggles to get the players that are fundamentally sound to the degree she expects / needs to run the system she uses, especially on offense (she teaches the defense well).

An excellent insight and I believe you have a good amount of truth in it.

 

[stwainfan]

How much of it is players working on thier game? Also how much is being taught the right way?

 

[UcMiami]

Agree with everything said. But I prefer the terminology that so many young players lack the basketball fundamentals. I also suspect, but don't know for sure, that some of what we see at the college level comes from the good player's dominance at the lower levels, so they didn't have to learn to run plays or look for the "best" shot, as any shot by them was the best shot on the team.

In any case, this whole issue is one of the things I blame for the struggles that CVS has in today's game. Not that I claim it has passed her by, as some do, but rather that she struggles to get the players that are fundamentally sound to the degree she expects / needs to run the system she uses, especially on offense (she teaches the defense well).

Good point about CVS and one of the things I think Geno does well in being so selective about who he recruits. It is also points to coaches in college not paying that much attention to fundamentals when they recruit - if they did, I think that pressure might move down the ranks and players would learn to value that.
Kelly is a perfect example being fairly lightly recruited, and underestimated throughout her four years.
Couple of shout outs to BE programs that do not have the kind of Uconn success or win the recruiting battles, but evaluate that second level of talent very well - DePaul and Villanova.

 

[ThisJustIn]

I have never payed much attention to AAU basketball. Where does the money come from - where does it go?

Parents and sponsors - to the clubs for travel, gear, insurance, housing and such. It's plenty fun to point to the problems, but I'm waiting for solutions. There was a move a while back for the NCAA to move in to youth basketball trough hoops, which had many AAU folks crying foul.

Interesting: A quick google shows that iHoops To Be Integrated Into USA Basketball; NBA And NCAA To Continue Funding


NBA and NCAA-owned iHoops is reorganizing with its operations to be integrated into USA Basketball’s management structure. It will be led by USA Basketball Chair Jerry Colangelo. iHoops will move its operations from Indianapolis to USA Basketball’s Colorado Springs HQs in mid-January. The iHoops name will remain at least in the short term but all programming and operations will go under the USA Basketball banner. The iHoops CEO position will be eliminated with current iHoops CEO Derrick Godfrey to remain as a consultant through the transition. iHoops was created in '08 as a joint venture between the NBA and the NCAA to develop youth basketball training and educational programs. Both the NBA and the NCAA will continue their joint funding of iHoops. The seven-member iHoops staff may be offered the chance to relocate to Colorado Springs. USA Basketball will also look to add to the iHoops staff. "USA Basketball has the brand recognition and partner relationships to make this a good fit," Colangelo said. "It will add to our youth development program and we are interested in growing our base."

As for more details about AAU, it's been a while since this was published, but I'm guessing the details hold true:

Culture Clash: High School and AAU Basketball

 

[ThisJustIn]

How much of it is players working on thier game? Also how much is being taught the right way?

Couple of things -- do you have enough people "teaching" the right way. I'm not dismissing any coaches skills -- 'cause we know there are AAU coaches who stink and high school coaches who are great, and vice verse. The best words I've heard out of an AAU coach is that high school coaches do the hard work -- the day in, day out teaching of skills. AAU coaches do the other hard work -- organizing travel and quick practices of players coming from all around (some drive 4 hrs for a game).

And, how many high school kids have the internal discipline to work on their game on their own. We've heard coaches talk about the difference between girls and boys bball around just playing (Boys will go to the corner and set up a pick up game, girls will wait for it to be organized) but actual repetitive skill building?

And, as always, let's remember this doesn't simply apply to basketball -- but any skill, from birdwatching to writing to cooking.

 

[stwainfan]

Couple of things -- do you have enough people "teaching" the right way. I'm not dismissing any coaches skills -- 'cause we know there are AAU coaches who stink and high school coaches who are great, and vice verse. The best words I've heard out of an AAU coach is that high school coaches do the hard work -- the day in, day out teaching of skills. AAU coaches do the other hard work -- organizing travel and quick practices of players coming from all around (some drive 4 hrs for a game).

And, how many high school kids have the internal discipline to work on their game on their own. We've heard coaches talk about the difference between girls and boys bball around just playing (Boys will go to the corner and set up a pick up game, girls will wait for it to be organized) but actual repetitive skill building?

And, as always, let's remember this doesn't simply apply to basketball -- but any skill, from birdwatching to writing to cooking.

I think what separates some high school players is how much they work on thier game. I have heard from coach and her mom that Mercedes Russell works on her game a lot. That's why she is as good as she is. I wonder how many high school coaches talk to the players about getting up shots outside of practice.

 

[rocky rococo]

How much of it is players working on thier game? Also how much is being taught the right way?

Taught the right way is a great question. One of the things that grabbed me right away about Kelly Faris is that she showed up as a freshman playing defense with her feet. That's the right way, but how often do you actually see that, even among the very top tier of recruits? And that opened up that question about how much is being taught the right way for me four years ago. Why should it be such a rarity that Kelly comes to collge playing defense with her feet?

 

[stwainfan]

Taught the right way is a great question. One of the things that grabbed me right away about Kelly Faris is that she showed up as a freshman playing defense with her feet. That's the right way, but how often do you actually see that, even among the very top tier of recruits? And that opened up that question about how much is being taught the right way for me four years ago. Why should it be such a rarity that Kelly comes to collge playing defense with her feet?

Yeah a lot of fouls are by either reaching or playing with hands. It seems like a lot of players have to be taught that when they get to college.

 

[Bestiarius]

Correct early training is critical to the development of a player. How much practicing is done is less important than practicing the right way. Take shooting for instance. There is an optimum way to shoot the ball. If your technique is poor, and you practice a lot you're basically teaching yourself how not to succeed. My #1 rule is Don't Practice Your Mistakes!!

Musicians know this principle. Proper technique is key. Play very slowly, slow enough so that you can play the practice piece perfectly. If you make a mistake, go slower, otherwise you're just learning your mistakes. Speed and accuracy will come with practice if you initially play perfectly.

By the time an athlete has several years under the belt, bad habits are so ingrained that it is almost impossible to correct them. It's much more difficult to correct a poorly executed task than it is to learn a new task from scratch.

One of my peccadillos is noticing when peoples shoe laces are tied incorrectly. I'll ask these individuals if their shoes come loose 15 or 20 times a day. They look shocked as they usually say, "yes." The fix is simple, just start tying the first part of the knot going the opposite way. A majority of these people cannot make this simple adjustment after tying their shoes incorrectly their whole life. They just continue to double knot their shoes or suffer the multiple retying.

Unfortunately, it's not easy to find coaches that know how to train players. Plus, it's more fun to play a game than to practice fundamentals, so there is little interest in doing so.

Many players become successful despite their poor techniques. They just don't realize how much better they could have been.

 

[Moose]

Given the title, I was expecting this article to make a different point. The article describes kids playing too many games at the expense of practicing skills. Why is this 'over coaching'? I thought that over coaching would mean that too much time is spent learning complex offences and defences. Similarly, I thought that under teaching would mean not teaching players general principles, for example how to read what the defence is giving you.

 

[vtcwbuff]

Parents and sponsors - to the clubs for travel, gear, insurance, housing and such. It's plenty fun to point to the problems, but I'm waiting for solutions. There was a move a while back for the NCAA to move in to youth basketball trough hoops, which had many AAU folks crying foul.

Interesting: A quick google shows that iHoops To Be Integrated Into USA Basketball; NBA And NCAA To Continue Funding


NBA and NCAA-owned iHoops is reorganizing with its operations to be integrated into USA Basketball’s management structure. It will be led by USA Basketball Chair Jerry Colangelo. iHoops will move its operations from Indianapolis to USA Basketball’s Colorado Springs HQs in mid-January. The iHoops name will remain at least in the short term but all programming and operations will go under the USA Basketball banner. The iHoops CEO position will be eliminated with current iHoops CEO Derrick Godfrey to remain as a consultant through the transition. iHoops was created in '08 as a joint venture between the NBA and the NCAA to develop youth basketball training and educational programs. Both the NBA and the NCAA will continue their joint funding of iHoops. The seven-member iHoops staff may be offered the chance to relocate to Colorado Springs. USA Basketball will also look to add to the iHoops staff. "USA Basketball has the brand recognition and partner relationships to make this a good fit," Colangelo said. "It will add to our youth development program and we are interested in growing our base."

As for more details about AAU, it's been a while since this was published, but I'm guessing the details hold true:

Culture Clash: High School and AAU Basketball

Thanks for the Link. I feel a bit smarter now but after reading the article one comment seemed to sum it all up - " . . and while refreshingly democratic, the lack of direct supervision and accountability opens AAU up to criticism."

So all one has to do is send the AAU a check for 20 bucks or so and then sucker some parents/players into thinking you have the kid's best interest in mind and voila' "I'm a basketball coach". Nobody checking your qualifications, skills or criminal record.

Any idea what kind of money these guys make?

 

[DaddyChoc]

I have never payed much attention to AAU basketball. Where does the money come from - where does it go?

start-up money normally comes from the owner of the team (jerseys, gym rental etc.)

then he host his own Tourney "DaddyChoc's "This Is My House" Easter Bash... collecting $350-$500 per team from atleast 12 teams

at his "Easter Bash" he sells... chips, Gatorade, water, hotdogs etc.

he/she has tons of volunteers who want to give back to the community so they're not looking to get paid for their time

over time, if your team(s) are good enough you will get sponsors (locally and regionally).

It takes a lot of time and effort to run a quality team and tournament. It helps if you have a big shot player on your team.