Can we learn something about expansion from Cincy and USF?

[uconNYC]

For all those saying "Yuck" to UCF, ECU, Memphis, etc. Look at Cincy and USF - they were the "Yuck" programs back in 2003. They have become solid members of the BE and have won many high profile games. Cincy has won 2 conference titles.

Given the opportunity, I think some of these CUSA schools could become credible members of the conference. UCF makes the most sense from a purely football standpoint and gives the conference a bit of symmetry (UL/UC. USF/UCF, RU/UC, WVU/TCU). Memphis, need to get their act together in football, but have a good potential fanbase and keeps the basketball conference dominant.

 

[Dann]

i agree. another look at it
ecu-has won games vs bcs teams on the reg. they have also played several close games.
ucf-same^, they best bc up @ bc to boot this year coming off the bowl game last year...
tcu-can hang with anyone, bcs games prove that
those are bball projects, but fball ready which is fine when the bball is 2nd to fball and uconn/lville/cincy/wvu can carry bball for respectablilty.
memphis- bball ready, adds a quality sec mk. they have fedex $ to spend. if they come, they are the next usf but it will take time.
other texas schools-uh/smu could become tcu like with texas roots and the bcs tage. bball project but again...i would also explore navy and if we had to army...

 

[ctchamps]

I'm still betting there will be schools available from the B12.

 

[Dann]

I'm still betting there will be schools available from the B12.

maybe so, but i would bet the b12 becomes the big south again and they get a nice 12 including those there now. that would take those schools and most liley the texas schools loking for the bcs jump off the table.

 

[ctchamps]

OU and OSU head to the PAC. A&M and Mizzou head to the SEC. I'm not sure Kansas and K State still want any part of Texas and might be willing to take offers elsewhere if anyone would have them. Baylor and Iowa St may not have any choice. And Tech is co-joined. And anyone wanting to join these five deserve their fate.

I just don't see this remaining group getting BE teams.

 

[ZooCougar]

None of those schools are as remotely bad as Memphis. You guys are looking at this from 30,000 feet. They've had some basketball success, but ultimately adding Memphis will result in some sort of buyer's remorse guaranteed.

There is only one good reason to add them, and that's because we could probably get a tie in with the Liberty Bowl out of it.

 

[SAMCRO]

The OP is spot on regarding the impact of moving to an AQ league can have for teams ( we are an example of this and too). It unfortunately is one of the big reason why some schools (read big time, long time FB schools) don't want more teams in BCS leagues. Afraid of the competition, diluting their own product.

I posted this on the FB board (or was it on TOS), but I would love to see a relagation system where the bottom few teams from top conferences get relagated to the "mid majors", and the top mid major teams move up into BCS conferences. I realize it will never happen, I just think it would be a good thing.

 

[willie99]

when I've made such suggestions, I'm usually ripped a new one (or at least that's their intent)

if the BE retained it's 7 members including TCU, such an expansion would not be a bad option

however, I do believe we're gone too

 

[huskypantz]

Just imagine what Big East membership could do for a school like Temple.

 

[coachcap]

I'll say it again. UCF (USF is crazy for not wanting them), Houston, SMU in that order. Not only schools with new facilities built or planned, but located in high population or destination areas. That's a MAJOR drawbackfor ECU. They're in a rural, almost inaccessible backwater. AND, they're, at best, the 5th wheel in their own state.
If the Big East even considers elevating more 1-AA schools, it is only elevating it vulnerability threshold. Ditto, any football only additions.
In a utopian dreamworld, Oklahoma & the rest of the Big 12 remainders kiss Texas goodby & merge with the Big East. They get visibility on the East Coast at a decent hour (As opposed to the PAC-12 option) & capture the Coveted NYC Market as the Sooners past exploits & current status is legandary.

 

[coachcap]

Just imagine what Big East membership could do for a school like Temple.

Temple would be the only exemption to my last post. They have finally started to put a decent product on the field, their hoops is palatable, & with Big East membership they could attract a decent fanbase. They do, however, have the stigma of being a doormat for eons, &, once again, there's this creepy perception by outsiders.

 

[mattp]

None of those schools are as remotely bad as Memphis. You guys are looking at this from 30,000 feet. They've had some basketball success, but ultimately adding Memphis will result in some sort of buyer's remorse guaranteed.

There is only one good reason to add them, and that's because we could probably get a tie in with the Liberty Bowl out of it.

what is your problem with Memphis? i don't know much about the school but Memphis is a fantastic city that i wouldn't mind playing a game at every other year. it seems to be a decent school academically, and is considered a high research facility, whatever that means, but they seem about on par with UCF and ECU. athletically they've been good in bball and at times decent in football. i don't see anything that puts them worlds beneath the other reasonable candidates

 

[ZooCougar]

I went to Rhodes College in Memphis. Some parts of the city are fantastic. The University of Memphis is not one of them.

UM is not even in the same ballpark as Cincy. In fact comparing UM to USF, Cincy, and Louisville is an insult. If we take Memphis over a school like Houston then we are really missing the boat.

 

[SubbaBub]

I also don't get Memphis. What have they done other than the few years the squid was in charge.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

 

[NHUConnfan]

I also don't get Memphis. What have they done other than the few years the squid was in charge.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

Watch their basketball program this year. They'll be back in the upper-tier of programs.

 

[ctchamps]

The only problem with all this gerrymandering isn't that particular options are good or bad. It's because it won't happen. The Pitt and Cuse move put the nail in the coffin. None of the remaining BE football schools trust each other enough to believe someone else won't bolt. UConn has been forthright about this. The other schools are just playing the game of saying one thing but meaning another thing. This is why Navy has backed off.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Cincy isn't a bad university, but is no state flagship. Memphis, Louisville, USF are all well below the academic level that UConn wants to associate itself with. Everyone keeps talking about sports. These are more than athletic conferences, they are associations of universities. You are judged by the company you keep. Ivy League brings and intstant thought, about academics, even though it's an athletic conference. Every single school in the NESCAC is strong academically. UConn has targeted UVA, UNH and Michigan, as the schools to emmulate. There is no way UConn wants to be associated with Memphis. That's why the Big East is looking at the military acadamies. It's not just about how good you are at football or basketball.

 

[ctchamps]

I would think they are looking at the military academies for a lot of reasons of which academics is a minor reason. The more important considerations were perceived national recognition and the willingness of the service schools to play football only.

 

[NHUConnfan]

Cincy isn't a bad university, but is no state flagship. Memphis, Louisville, USF are all well below the academic level that UConn wants to associate itself with. Everyone keeps talking about sports. These are more than athletic conferences, they are associations of universities. You are judged by the company you keep. Ivy League brings and intstant thought, about academics, even though it's an athletic conference. Every single school in the NESCAC is strong academically. UConn has targeted UVA, UNH and Michigan, as the schools to emmulate. There is no way UConn wants to be associated with Memphis. That's why the Big East is looking at the military acadamies. It's not just about how good you are at football or basketball.

Define state flagship. Of course, it isn't the "flagship" university, because tOSU is - and for good reason. But with the size and the ranking of several programs at Cincy (I'm there now, currently at the #6 school of music), it's a very decent school. It's really can be compared to FSU, except on the level of athletic programs where obviously FSU has a much better history (and longer at that).

 

[HuskyHawk]

Define state flagship. Of course, it isn't the "flagship" university, because tOSU is - and for good reason. But with the size and the ranking of several programs at Cincy (I'm there now, currently at the #6 school of music), it's a very decent school. It's really can be compared to FSU, except on the level of athletic programs where obviously FSU has a much better history (and longer at that).

I like Cincy. They have a pretty good law school too. That's why I was suggesting that UConn, Rutgers and Cincy were a cut above the rest of the remianing BE football schools.

 

[freescooter]

My argument for a while has that adding schools to a BCS conference does two things...1st it gives them a leg up on recruiting and program development. But 2nd, it makes them BSC schools. That shouldn't be underestimated. If the Big East had added 2-3 football schools a couple of years ago, those schools would be here and would be "BCS" schools. The league could have much more easily survived this latest mess with 8 or 10 members than it would with 6-7. the question ahs always been "What do they add?" But the answer, stability, wasn't enough.

 

[businesslawyer]

The only problem with all this gerrymandering isn't that particular options are good or bad. It's because it won't happen. The Pitt and Cuse move put the nail in the coffin. None of the remaining BE football schools trust each other enough to believe someone else won't bolt. UConn has been forthright about this. The other schools are just playing the game of saying one thing but meaning another thing. This is why Navy has backed off.

This.

 

[mattp]

I went to Rhodes College in Memphis. Some parts of the city are fantastic. The University of Memphis is not one of them.

UM is not even in the same ballpark as Cincy. In fact comparing UM to USF, Cincy, and Louisville is an insult. If we take Memphis over a school like Houston then we are really missing the boat.

UM may not be as good as cinci, but i'd say it's in the same ballpark as UCF and ECU and those are the realistic contenders. i agree i'd like to see Houston come aboard, but we're probably going to need more than one team.

 

[NEforceUConn]

.................That's a MAJOR drawbackfor ECU. They're in a rural, almost inaccessible backwater. AND, they're, at best, the 5th wheel in their own state...............

ECU does not have a tv market but their fans travel very well. Some of my friends here in NC make a big deal out of UConn's non showing at the Fiesta. I try to explain but to them the only teams that travel well in the BE are WVU and UC (to a lessor degree). ECU would instantly be the 2nd best traveling school fwiw

 

[arnie3]

It's interesting that Temple lost by 4 to PSU, and is playing MD this Saturday. A Temple win there sure would be embarrassing to MD's new coach!