c7 schools expect to double their tv contract...

[UConnDan97]

I hear you and agree with that SB. But if that is the case for the C7, then what is a hoops league with Uconn (a 3 time National Champion in last 13 years), Cincy, Temple, Memphis, etc PLUS football worth? The top teams in the "NNNBE" are better than the C7 and can provide programming with football from late August to the beginning of March. The C7 deal gives me some hope that our TV deal won't be as bad as we thought - not great mind you, but not as bad as it may have looked a week or two ago.

I agree, and I was also thinking about the fact that the NBE may use the C-7 contract as a watermark, assuming their deal gets done before ours. In other words, if the C-7 lands a 5mil/team contract, we can use it in our negotiations to explain why we are worth 7 to 10 million, rather than the paltry 2-3 million per team that the Mountain West is currently restructuring to. Wouldn't THAT be a kick in the balls to Boise State!

 

[upstater]

We rightly ridicule the G+6, but if you are a TV exec and need MBB content, the G+6 is a tremendous value. With the exception of a short period in the 80's (anyone cares about anything earlier is likely dead and not watching TV) they haven't as a group been good at BB. What they do have, thanks to their BE affiliation, is a level of branding higher than the directional state U's and the sun belt/colonial schools. If ESPN is paying 17M for ACC FB and BB content, then Fox paying 5M for a slate of servicable if not really relevant MBB content is a good buy. On an hourly basis, it's about minimum wage.

Let's do a comparison.

UConn and Georgetown
Cincy and Villanova
Memphis and Marquette
Temple and DePaul
USF and St. John's
UCF and Seton Hall
Houston and Providence

I really don't see a distinct advantage for the CYO7 here.

If $5 million is the base for the current BE teams, that's a great place to start and then add football on top. We are talking $10 million a year here, no?

 

[uconNYC]

Let's do a comparison.

UConn and Georgetown
Cincy and Villanova
Memphis and Marquette
Temple and DePaul
USF and St. John's
UCF and Seton Hall
Houston and Providence

I really don't see a distinct advantage for the CYO7 here.

If $5 million is the base for the current BE teams, that's a great place to start and then add football on top. We are talking $10 million a year here, no?

You are thinking logically. But I don't think the TV execs are as level headed as we might believe them to be. The perception of the C7 conference will be of a fresh and exciting league that is the best basketball-only conference in the country, with urban schools that have a rich basketball history.

The perception of the NNBE will be of a conference made up of a bunch of leftover schools, that are praying for a bigger league to save them, that has no identity and with mediocre football and basketball that is nowhere as good as it once was.

C7 will be a hot stock, NNBE a junk bond. It really makes me feel that UConn should just try to engineer its own deal. As someone argued earlier if Seton Hall is worth $5M - UConn basketball + football + WBB is probably worth $15-20M!

 

[Marty Jackson]

You are thinking logically. But I don't think the TV execs are as level headed as we might believe them to be. The perception of the C7 conference will be of a fresh and exciting league that is the best basketball-only conference in the country, with urban schools that have a rich basketball history.

The perception of the NNBE will be of a conference made up of a bunch of leftover schools, that are praying for a bigger league to save them, that has no identity and with mediocre football and basketball that is nowhere as good as it once was.

C7 will be a hot stock, NNBE a junk bond. It really makes me feel that UConn should just try to engineer its own deal. As someone argued earlier if Seton Hall is worth $5M - UConn basketball + football + WBB is probably worth $15-20M!

if seton hall bb is worth $5M, you should add a zero to your figures...

 

[John Greene]

All of this talk about what an individual school is worth is crazy. The value comes from an attractive schedule. No school on its own has "value". The value is in the schedule. ND has "value" to NBC because as an independent in FB it can schedule a very attractive combination of schools most years. If ND were scheduling ECU, UCF, USF rather than MI, USC, MSU, hell even BCU or UConn it would not have the same "value" to NBC. UConn v Gtown, Cuse,Pitt, Nova, etc was worth more than UConn in the new conference. Even UConn v Prov BB game is worth more than UConn v SMU BB game because more people will watch. Prov v STJ is worth more than ECU v USF for the same reason.

It remains to be seen what the new schedule will bring, and I hope it is more than any of us expect, but at the same time I have my fears that many will be badly disapointed.

 

[upstater]

You are thinking logically. But I don't think the TV execs are as level headed as we might believe them to be. The perception of the C7 conference will be of a fresh and exciting league that is the best basketball-only conference in the country, with urban schools that have a rich basketball history.

The perception of the NNBE will be of a conference made up of a bunch of leftover schools, that are praying for a bigger league to save them, that has no identity and with mediocre football and basketball that is nowhere as good as it once was.

C7 will be a hot stock, NNBE a junk bond. It really makes me feel that UConn should just try to engineer its own deal. As someone argued earlier if Seton Hall is worth $5M - UConn basketball + football + WBB is probably worth $15-20M!

Good for the CYO7 then because you can bet that perception will change quickly with UConn, Temple, Memphis and Cincy fighting it out in a 10 team league (which is what I'm hoping for). I see some excitement created by those 4 teams.

 

[upstater]

All of this talk about what an individual school is worth is crazy. The value comes from an attractive schedule. No school on its own has "value". The value is in the schedule. ND has "value" to NBC because as an independent in FB it can schedule a very attractive combination of schools most years. If ND were scheduling ECU, UCF, USF rather than MI, USC, MSU, hell even BCU or UConn it would not have the same "value" to NBC. UConn v Gtown, Cuse,Pitt, Nova, etc was worth more than UConn in the new conference. Even UConn v Prov BB game is worth more than UConn v SMU BB game because more people will watch. Prov v STJ is worth more than ECU v USF for the same reason.

It remains to be seen what the new schedule will bring, and I hope it is more than any of us expect, but at the same time I have my fears that many will be badly disapointed.

You sound like you're dismissing the unfamiliar. Just because UConn-Memphis has no juice now, doesn't mean it won't in the future. It could easily beat G'town-Villanova in the future. I wasn't thrilled with UConn-Cincy initially either, but that's a nice game now.

 

[John Greene]

You sound like you're dismissing the unfamiliar. Just because UConn-Memphis has no juice now, doesn't mean it won't in the future. It could easily beat G'town-Villanova in the future. I wasn't thrilled with UConn-Cincy initially either, but that's a nice game now.

Don't mean to dismiss anything. If we are forced to stay where we are I hope you are correct and some of the our new match ups equal or surpass our old ones. Unfortunately that does not help us with the current contract. We are in the position of asking networks to put up money on a schedule that is not proven. This is much harder than selling a product with a history of success. It is not impossible, just a hell of a lot more difficult.

 

[alexd]

Don't mean to dismiss anything. If we are forced to stay where we are I hope you are correct and some of the our new match ups equal or surpass our old ones. Unfortunately that does not help us with the current contract. We are in the position of asking networks to put up money on a schedule that is not proven. This is much harder than selling a product with a history of success. It is not impossible, just a hell of a lot more difficult.

At the same time....what were the "proven" matchups in the old BE?....Cuse/Uconn...Cuse/GU...Lville/Pitt....Pitt/Cuse...ND vs Cuse or UCONN or Lville or PITT......Where exactly is the history of success in the CYO league? GU vs. whom???...Butler and X, if they join, have NO history against any of the former BE schools...are they counting on GU/SJU or GU/Nova?....this isn't 1986....GU is the only "name" program still doing anything of the 7 schools. MU is still a regional success. Nova has fallen off the face of the map....

 

[John Greene]

At the same time....what were the "proven" matchups in the old BE?....Cuse/Uconn...Cuse/GU...Lville/Pitt....Pitt/Cuse...ND vs Cuse or UCONN or Lville or PITT......Where exactly is the history of success in the CYO league? GU vs. whom???...Butler and X, if they join, have NO history against any of the former BE schools...are they counting on GU/SJU or GU/Nova?....this isn't 1986....GU is the only "name" program still doing anything of the 7 schools. MU is still a regional success. Nova has fallen off the face of the map....

Don't really care about the C7 and their future. I doubt they will get a big payday. ND figured that out pretty quickly or they would have stayed with them. My point is our future versus our past. In the past the networks usually pushed for just the games you listed. Those will soon be gone to be replaced with what I think is a less attractive product. It may become more attractive in a few years but that does not help with the current contract.

 

[RS9999X]

If the Catholic league goes with 12 and a tourney they've got content. It's that simple. Basketball is highly regional and plays well in sports bars and fits into the new Fox model trying to pitch two new All Sports Channels out of the box. They can spread that content through Fox Sports 1 and Sports 2 and pretty much guarantee Continued placement while raising carrier fees and packaging advertising deals. In that sense the NNBE compliments that shake and bake strategy.

Al Gore's Current and their 44,ooo peak prime time viewers sold for what $500 million ? It had $100 mil in revenues based on 10 cents a month and ads in 44 million homes that didn't even watch the thing.

 

[upstater]

Don't mean to dismiss anything. If we are forced to stay where we are I hope you are correct and some of the our new match ups equal or surpass our old ones. Unfortunately that does not help us with the current contract. We are in the position of asking networks to put up money on a schedule that is not proven. This is much harder than selling a product with a history of success. It is not impossible, just a hell of a lot more difficult.

I was not speaking from the fan's perspective, not TV perspective. I'm sure the TV guys are much more capable of looking at UConn-Memphis and compare it to UConn-Georgetown.

Our old ones against Cuse and Pitt will not be surpassed, but honestly Nova and G'town don't do it for me like Cuse and Pitt did. I liked playing those teams, but I don't see why they can't be replaced.

History of success? I compared the different schools above. Why do you say they have a history of success but we don't? I'm not getting you.

 

[upstater]

Don't really care about the C7 and their future. I doubt they will get a big payday. ND figured that out pretty quickly or they would have stayed with them. My point is our future versus our past. In the past the networks usually pushed for just the games you listed. Those will soon be gone to be replaced with what I think is a less attractive product. It may become more attractive in a few years but that does not help with the current contract.

I don't disagree with you here. All we're saying is that if G'town and the 6 dwarves are worth $5 million a year, UConn bball is worth at least that. AT LEAST.

 

[RS9999X]

UConn bball is worth at least that. AT LEAST.

Are Tulane and ECU?

 

[upstater]

Are Tulane and ECU?

Oh, sorry, I didn't realize that only Georgetown was earning $5m. I thought Dayton and Seton hall were making $5m as well.

 

[Vuce]

Are Tulane and ECU?

Is DePaul?

 

[SubbaBub]

I hear you and agree with that SB. But if that is the case for the C7, then what is a hoops league with Uconn (a 3 time National Champion in last 13 years), Cincy, Temple, Memphis, etc PLUS football worth? The top teams in the "NNNBE" are better than the C7 and can provide programming with football from late August to the beginning of March. The C7 deal gives me some hope that our TV deal won't be as bad as we thought - not great mind you, but not as bad as it may have looked a week or two ago.

No one is going to like this, but the NNBE as constituted while worth more than the 3-5M per the C7 is reportedly getting, it's not worth that much more. As a conference in both FB and BB, the NNBE is worth more as filler than as marquee programming. Sure, UConn games will be a premium and maybe the odd Cincy game, but the rest aren't primetime fodder, unless they are paired with a big time program. When was the last time Temple was the CBS Saturday afternoon game? As a league brand, the old BE was worth more than the sum of it's parts and you could promote a Marquette/Villanova game to the whole country. The new leagues, not so much as the rights holders (ESPN) will start pumping how good a league the B1G is and how every road game in the B1G is a tough one. The legacy of the old BE teams will fade away. Wait..What? You mean ESPN is already pumping the other power 5 leagues?

 

[specialisthusky]

No one is going to like this, but the NNBE as constituted while worth more than the 3-5M per the C7 is reportedly getting, it's not worth that much more. As a conference in both FB and BB, the NNBE is worth more as filler than as marquee programming. Sure, UConn games will be a premium and maybe the odd Cincy game, but the rest aren't primetime fodder, unless they are paired with a big time program. When was the last time Temple was the CBS Saturday afternoon game? As a league brand, the old BE was worth more than the sum of it's parts and you could promote a Marquette/Villanova game to the whole country. The new leagues, not so much as the rights holders (ESPN) will start pumping how good a league the B1G is and how every road game in the B1G is a tough one. The legacy of the old BE teams will fade away. Wait..What? You mean ESPN is already pumping the other power 5 leagues?

temple is actually beating Kansas right now on CBS....I think your point completely stands though. Just wanted to point that out as this is probably the first time the Owls have been on CBS since Chaney retired.

 

[SubbaBub]

temple is actually beating Kansas right now on CBS....I think your point completely stands though. Just wanted to point that out as this is probably the first time the Owls have been on CBS since Chaney retired.

sniffing out the real BB fans. But, note they are playing Kansas. Temple/Cincy isn't seeing CBS unless they're both top 10.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

 

[upstater]

No one is going to like this, but the NNBE as constituted while worth more than the 3-5M per the C7 is reportedly getting, it's not worth that much more. As a conference in both FB and BB, the NNBE is worth more as filler than as marquee programming. Sure, UConn games will be a premium and maybe the odd Cincy game, but the rest aren't primetime fodder, unless they are paired with a big time program. When was the last time Temple was the CBS Saturday afternoon game? As a league brand, the old BE was worth more than the sum of it's parts and you could promote a Marquette/Villanova game to the whole country. The new leagues, not so much as the rights holders (ESPN) will start pumping how good a league the B1G is and how every road game in the B1G is a tough one. The legacy of the old BE teams will fade away. Wait..What? You mean ESPN is already pumping the other power 5 leagues?

I hope you realize that $5m is a LOT for basketball.
A heckuva lot. You add $5 for football, and you're at $10 million. If someone is going to offer the NBE schools $10 million a year, BRING IT ON!!

 

[Vuce]

And just to be clear if we take an average of this reported deal it is really closer to 4.1 mil per year per school with 10 schools and 3.5 mil per year per school with 12 schools. The 5 mil is only coming up if they divide it unevenly.

 

[SubbaBub]

And just to be clear if we take an average of this reported deal it is really closer to 4.1 mil per year per school with 10 schools and 3.5 mil per year per school with 12 schools. The 5 mil is only coming up if they divide it unevenly.

Compared to the older deals, maybe. In a world where the BCS playoff gets $500B, it is not. Especially when you think about the amount of content a 12 team BB conference generates. Even at a 0.2 rating it beats the filler currently running on Speed and FSC.

The new cable channel would get over 250 hours of programming for $60M.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

 

[mattp]

Good for the CYO7 then because you can bet that perception will change quickly with UConn, Temple, Memphis and Cincy fighting it out in a 10 team league (which is what I'm hoping for). I see some excitement created by those 4 teams.

I agree with you, I don't know why so many want the NNBE to be a huge conference. I'd rather 9 or 10. Realistically there aren't 3 or 4 more teams we can add that won't be simply diluting revenues. UConn, Temple, Cinci, Memphis, SDState, Houston, SMU, USF, UCF, ECU and I guess Tulane isn't a bad all around sports conference. I think a conference championship would be a bad thing. Since the winner wouldn't be guaranteed a spot anywhere all it would do is provide a potential land mine for our best team to making the play off. It's too bad we can't trim back Tulane.

 

[CL82]

Who loves how espn pumps that the catholic 7 could get 5 million a year per team but our contract would be lucky to get 60 million. It's laughable the politics in everything. I think if everything holds together, aresco pulls a rabbit out of the hat.

I agree. Now, it may be scrawny rabbit, covered in mange, with no tail and only three legs, but he'll find us a bunny!

 

[CL82]

We are really coming across as jealous ex-girlfriends in threads like this.

I am disappointed that the C7 are leaving, but I understand and even agree with their reasons. It was time. They will be fine in a new league, and I expect the average revenue per school after all TV and NCAA units to be very healthy and all the programs to be very profitable. I also expect Butler and Xavier to tell them to pound sand if they think that Seton Hall and Providence are going to to get twice the conference share that the new schools get.

I don't know about jealousy. Say you have tape worm. Day after day it grows longer and longer. Finally you go to doctor, and get it removed. While you are glad it's gone, you kind of miss how much you used to be able to eat without gaining weight. Parasites can be like that. You never really like them, but when you've been living with them a couple of decades you do get used to them.