Butler/Dolson stats comparisons

[winlots]

Took a look at stats for each of Dolson's four years of college ball and for Butler's frosh year.

As frosh, Butler played 50% more minutes per game than Dolson. That's a huge difference. Could be a function of conditioning, caliber of teammates, etc. At the very least, it suggests to me that Butler could provide VERY high energy minutes on the court, figuring that she would be needed for fewer minutes per game at UCONN and could go at a great pace while out there.

Better shooter? Taking into account the difference in minutes played, it looks like Dolson is probably the better shooter (both field goal percentage and foul shot percentage indicate this). Of course, Butler can improve her game there, especially with this absolute blessing of a year to practice with and against the best before resuming her formal competition.

Rebounder? Looks like Butler will bring more to the table there, and bring it earlier in her career.

Shot Blocker? Looks about even.

Turn overs? Slight indication that Butler might take a little better care of the ball, but I was surprised at the high number of TOs she registered this season, given that I always thought this area was not a particularly strong one for Dolson.

In sum: though this was not the sort of sophisticated look that some of our stats wizards provide, it did provide me with a little additional evidence ( on top of the narratives we've read ) that our collective glee over the Butler signing is well-founded. Some if the sharper guys might want to dig more deeply into the available stats just for the fun of it.

 

[diggerfoot]

We've seen over the years that Auriemma adapts his system to his players. It helps that he recruits versatile players to begin with, yet I would still question any comparisons along the line of replacing one player with another. We do it all the time, particularly at the end of the year when one wonders "how to we replace Faris," or "how do we replace "Dolson and Hartley." The answer lies more in replacing one approach with another.

For example, I seriously doubt Butler will screen as well as Dolson, mainly because I know of no one else who does. On the other hand, all signs point to Butler being a better rebounder over the course of her career. You don't replace Dolson's role in last year's system with Butler (or Stokes); rather you replace the system, perhaps so that Butler plays more in the low post, or whatever other ideas the coaching staff has. I suspect Dolson may be a better shooter than Butler, but Butler may end up with a better shooting percentage depending on how she's utilized differently.

 

[DaddyChoc]

Dolson was a 1 of 1... the mold has been broken

 

[Striper69]

We've seen over the years that Auriemma adapts his system to his players. It helps that he recruits versatile players to begin with, yet I would still question any comparisons along the line of replacing one player with another. We do it all the time, particularly at the end of the year when one wonders "how to we replace Faris," or "how do we replace "Dolson and Hartley." The answer lies more in replacing one approach with another.

For example, I seriously doubt Butler will screen as well as Dolson, mainly because I know of no one else who does. On the other hand, all signs point to Butler being a better rebounder over the course of her career. You don't replace Dolson's role in last year's system with Butler (or Stokes); rather you replace the system, perhaps so that Butler plays more in the low post, or whatever other ideas the coaching staff has. I suspect Dolson may be a better shooter than Butler, but Butler may end up with a better shooting percentage depending on how she's utilized differently.

I may be wrong but I think Dolson is getting fouls called for her screens. I know it happened at least once. I'll watch the next game closely. She may have to adjust to the way they call them in the pros.

 

[UcMiami]

It is really hard to compare players across teams - Stef played her whole career surrounded by very good teammates on a team that was winning thirty games a year (and two NCs) while Natalie played her freshman year on a team that was losing twenty games and had very limited talent around her. Because of that, she would be taking more shots since she was one of the two best players on the team leading to perhaps lower shooting percentage but more scoring. She also was only 'competing' against the opponent for most rebounds and not also against good rebounding teammates which probably inflated her rebounding numbers somewhat. As for assists - Stef's teammates were hitting 50% of their shots each year so every two passes to a shooter led to an assist and because of higher skill, probably fewer turnovers. Natalie's freshman teammates shot about .400 so only two out of every five passes led to an assist.

 

[Vowelguy]

Oy ve. Here we go again.
After Maria conlon, this myth developed that any short , slow, unskilled girl could become a championship PG. (1. Not true 2. Not even MC fit that myth.).
Now it seems any 6'5 kid with some promise will be an AA.

DC had it right. Stef was a unique talent that will not be easily duplicated.

Butler played a lot because she was the best player on a mediocre team from a mid major conference. It is not clear how that will translate to playing for the #1 team. I'm just hoping she can be a decent role player. The expectations being discussed here seem way overblown, IMHO.

 

[johnnyc]

Dolson was a 1 of 1... the mold has been broken

I agree. I think Butler will make a name for herself and is AA material.

 

[huskeynut]

Geno will adapt the system to fit the skill level of his players.

As to Butler, we can all speculate on how she will fit it and what the offense will look like with her in the post. But the concept of melding the talent will be a process. And Natalie has a whole year to practice and learn Geno's system.

Given the 2015 - 2016 roster, Natalie will be one piece of the puzzle. She doesn't have to be "all world", just good and consistent. There will be plenty of players to rebound and block shots. This is not to say she will not be a force, she will, but she will be surrounded by talent. At any given game, our opponents still will have to worry as to which player or players is going to "be hot."

It's going to be fun watching Natalie develop!

 

[diggerfoot]

Oy ve. Here we go again.
After Maria conlon, this myth developed that any short , slow, unskilled girl could become a championship PG. (1. Not true 2. Not even MC fit that myth.).
Now it seems any 6'5 kid with some promise will be an AA.

DC had it right. Stef was a unique talent that will not be easily duplicated.

Butler played a lot because she was the best player on a mediocre team from a mid major conference. It is not clear how that will translate to playing for the #1 team. I'm just hoping she can be a decent role player. The expectations being discussed here seem way overblown, IMHO.

??? I challenged the OP comparing players, just as DC and others did, just as you are (presumably). Yet in his defense no where do I see these inferences being made in this particular thread. Do you two have some kind of history? Otherwise, this seems a bit out in left field.

 

[reno tony]

Do we need another Stef? I understand it's hard not to compare but I think Geno will use whatever set of skills she has to benefit the team the most. When all else fails, trust in Geno.

45 TO GO​

 

[UcMiami]

If you look at championship teams we have had Jessica Moore and Schumacher as center, it isn't always Tina or Stef. It is a team game and Uconn does that better than anyone. Butler doesn't have to be an AA to be extremely effective.
No idea where she will fall in the range of possibilities, but I like what I have heard about her and she provides the team with height which in 2015 will be in short supply. Yes teams can win with 6'2" players, but it is harder, and this is not 2002 in terms of the overall talent around the college scene- there are more and more highly skilled F/Ps in the game as well as better slashers to the basket. Having 6'5" waiting in the lane helps.

 

[johnnyc]

The expectations being discussed here seem way overblown, IMHO.

Fans being fans.....go figure.

 

[FairView]

Oy ve. Here we go again.
After Maria conlon, this myth developed that any short , slow, unskilled girl could become a championship PG. (1. Not true 2. Not even MC fit that myth.).
Now it seems any 6'5 kid with some promise will be an AA.

DC had it right. Stef was a unique talent that will not be easily duplicated.

Butler played a lot because she was the best player on a mediocre team from a mid major conference. It is not clear how that will translate to playing for the #1 team. I'm just hoping she can be a decent role player. The expectations being discussed here seem way overblown, IMHO.

I really liked Maria Conlon.

 

[choochoo]

I saw a great video of the Butler family farm and their work ethic etc. Does anyone have that link I have looked but can not find it again on youtube or else where.

 

[cohenzone]

I think Butler will serve very well.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Oy ve. Here we go again.
After Maria conlon, this myth developed that any short , slow, unskilled girl could become a championship PG. (1. Not true 2. Not even MC fit that myth.).
Now it seems any 6'5 kid with some promise will be an AA.

DC had it right. Stef was a unique talent that will not be easily duplicated.

Butler played a lot because she was the best player on a mediocre team from a mid major conference. It is not clear how that will translate to playing for the #1 team. I'm just hoping she can be a decent role player. The expectations being discussed here seem way overblown, IMHO.

I don't really care how much Butler played! What matters is how well she played against the same Big East opponents (minus ND and Louisville) who Stef played against for three of her four years at UConn. Butler compiled some pretty impressive statistics against those opponents and won the praise of a couple of pretty sharp coaches who are good friends of Geno's and spoke extraordinarily highly of her skill level. I think that has to MEAN SOMETHING! I find it hard to understand how you could make her into a journeyman type player without knowing anything about her. I would trust the words (and praise) of DePaul's coach over the opinion of someone who's never really even seen her play and yet seemingly casts her as a "role player". I think that people expecting her to come in and instantly be a reincarnation of Stef will likely be a little disappointed but conversely, I think people who try to trivialize what she's done in her freshman year in the Big East (despite the loss of the big three, UConn, ND and Louisville) show her no respect at all. She did accomplish some very nice things against some decent competition and she should be shown some respect for that! People are apt to remember the Stef of 2013 and 2014 but the Stef from her freshman season was just a shell of the product that we just saw graduate. People have to take that into account. If Stef, this year played at the same skill level that she did in her freshman year, some people on this Boneyard probably would want her benched or playing in a radically reduced role. I think we'll all be very happy at our good fortune for getting Butler when the day comes that she is ready to graduate and leave Storrs.

 

[Woof 101]

Nothing aginst the OP here but the only stat needed on this one is "In Geno We Trust".
http://www.courant.com/sports/uconn...nn-women-butler-0522-20140521,0,5828869.story
He says "so I think she's got a chance to really, really have a huge impact on our program". He goes on to say "we don't do this."

Under Geno's tutelage many a big did not show a lot of promise as a frosh or soph. A proven track record, they develop well here.
I convey a warm welcome to The Butler as she will serve the program just fine...Geno said so...

 

[rocky rococo]

JMO, but...If you come in as a frosh, and average 13 rebounds a game in Div I, I don't care what conference you play in, you've got board skills. Her work ethic and desire to improve are obvious, and nowhere can those things be fulfilled as well as at Storrs, under the tutelage of this remarkable staff.

 

[Zorro]

My expectation is that we will win three NCs with Butler. As has been pointed out, she dos not have to be all=world for this to happen. All she has to be is solid, and that seems pretty much assured. Anything else is frosting.

 

[Vowelguy]

... yet seemingly casts her as a "role player"...

I did no such thing.

Stef was a great player and valued Husky. I make no apology for cringing at the thought that a new player - one whom most have never seen play either - is already being implied to be better than her.

 

[UCONNfan1]

It's funny - I see her as much more than a "role" player. Or I should say "I hope she's much more than a role player". Kiah Stokes was a role player for the first 2.5 years of her college experience. But the 2nd half of last year, when UCONN basically went 6 deep, she was much more than a "role" player even tho she came off the bench.

When I think of role players, I think of kids like McClaren, or Gardler, or Dixon. But when I hear the head coach say "she has a chance to be really really good", for better or worse, my expectations from the player in question go way up...

 

[housekeys]

It's funny - I see her as much more than a "role" player. Or I should say "I hope she's much more than a role player". Kiah Stokes was a role player for the first 2.5 years of her college experience. But the 2nd half of last year, when UCONN basically went 6 deep, she was much more than a "role" player even tho she came off the bench.

When I think of role players, I think of kids like McClaren, or Gardler, or Dixon. But when I hear the head coach say "she has a chance to be really really good", for better or worse, my expectations from the player in question go way up...

Firstly, to VG's point, Butler is anything but just another 6'5 player. She has separated herself nicely in her freshman year. She may or may not become an AA, or better than Dolson in the long run. She has a good chance according to Geno and Bruno, and that is good enough for most fans. Finally, I think she will be a role player, except. you know what? Every player at UConn is a role player. That is what a team is, and we first and foremost are a team. Ok, those role players develop more than one role and play those roles well; that's what makes us so hard to beat. At UConn, Butler and all our recruits pick up skills and learn new roles all the time. Every player writes their own legacy, and Butler will write hers, independently and without peeking at Dolson's.

 

[rocky rococo]

My expectation is that we will win three NCs with Butler. As has been pointed out, she dos not have to be all=world for this to happen. All she has to be is solid, and that seems pretty much assured. Anything else is frosting.

The one other thing she needs to be beside solid is healthy. the center position is the one spot on this emerging roster where there is no depth. People sometimes try to make it simply about height, but it's not. It's more about who is comfortable and competent in the post at both ends of the court. On the 2002 team, although their main front line players were all 6-2, both Tamika and Asjha were comfortable working inside, and more, had JMo for backup. There are some 6-2 and 6-3 players coming in, but seem mostly to be true wings; I'm not sure about DJ.

 

[intlzncster]

I did no such thing.

Stef was a great player and valued Husky. I make no apology for cringing at the thought that a new player - one whom most have never seen play either - is already being implied to be better than her.

This isn't a flier on some high schooler though. She dominated as a freshman in D1, avg 13.9/13.4. Conference FOY no less. 2nd Team all conference. She's got a 18 months to work on her game at UCONN, and is by all accounts a very hard worker. She's probably going to dominate at UCONN too.

She'll be BETTER playing with superior players and a coach who knows what he's doing. Not worse.

 

[chrissaran]

vowelguy, just think how much better Natalie will be when playing with a team full of All Americans. I haven't seen any tape, but I can almost bet that she was doubled and triple teamed often, being the best player on her team, and she still put up solid numbers in scoring and much more than that in rebounding.