Bonjour: Analyzing UConn’s 2021 class

[HopJim]

Indeed! the main point is it appears that SC will be the most relevant measuring stick over the next few years. This year there may be more legitimate contenders, but next year with tons of returning talent plus both SC and Uconn have great recruiting classes, those two teams will likely separate themselves from the rest of the field.

Uconn and SC the top 2, then a big dropoff to #3. Just like last year when the top 3 were at a different level than the next tier. Both team's had two monster classes, SC in 19 and 21, Uconn in 20 and 21. SC will be right near the top until the Boston class graduates, Uconn the same until Paige's class graduates. If either team adds much in subsequent years their dominance of course can continue well beyond that, but both teams being very very good for the next few years is pretty much baked into the cake.

OldHuskie did a good job focusing the discussion. "Rivalry, measuring stick, etc." are all just semantics. There is always focus and attention paid when the leader is challenged. For years, UConn was the top program in the nation, with South Carolina a good game but little more. Based on how they finished, one could argue SC has taken the #1 position the past few years. Based on recruiting, these will be the top programs for many years to come. As a women's college basketball fan, looking forward to these games.

 

[ConnecticutBB]

South Carolina and UConn isn't a rivalry. All it is right now is a game between 2 really good teams.

Only my opinion ...the rivalry that might be at this point is between Dawn Stanley & Geno....Dawn needs to match Geno's ability to win..until then just one great team playing one good team.

 

[oldhusky]

Only my opinion ...the rivalry that might be at this point is between Dawn Stanley & Geno....Dawn needs to match Geno's ability to win..until then just one great team playing one good team.

Remember one other aspect regarding rivalry, Dawn got a player in Boston that Geno thought he was going to get. If that had gone as anticipated we might not even be debating rivalry at this point.

 

[cbraarj]

Only my opinion ...the rivalry that might be at this point is between Dawn Stanley & Geno....Dawn needs to match Geno's ability to win..until then just one great team playing one good team.

I'm really not sold on Dawns coaching ability.

 

[DefenseBB]

I'm really not sold on Dawns coaching ability.

Umm, ok, so if you are not sold on her coaching then you must have a pretty short list of coaches you do think are solid, maybe a list 1-3 (Geno-11, Kim-3 and Tara-2?) cuz after that the pickings get pretty slim to put ahead of Dawn.
Frequently mentioned on here as Top coaches are Kelly, Doug, Vic, Jeff, Gary Blair (1) and Brenda(1). Many conference titles, a few Final Fours, a few Elite 8's sort of define top coaches and Dawn checks those boxes, plus she has a National Title. There are only 5 other active coaches with Titles so...let us know who she's behind on the coaching list so we can be enlightened.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Wow -- I missed this before. How did I miss this (thank you carnac!!)?

It doesn't make sense?? How so?????????

What doesn't make sense? None of our freshmen have played a single game yet and the 2021 class - is only giving verbals and ofc we don't know exactly how they are going to be or if some may not ever come. It's a verbal from an unproven player to an extent, right?

I could also speak of how the other schools "don't make sense." But that's not a topic I care to entertain.

How is that arguably playing for the greatest wcbb coach ever, along with a chance to compete for titles every year, along with possibly playing along great talent so your game can be better highlighted, along with playing a fastbreak style that fits your game, along with playing one of the toughest schedules in wcbb, along with not having to get beat up because probably you have a lot of talent surrounding you (in which you have had a serious injury prior so getting beat up isn't ideal- not to mention past history that UCONN has had history that they d go the extra mile to take care of their players- recall BHunter) along with playing with your best friend - not make sense?

Playing in big games on National TV in which you won't be limited by crazy gimmick defenses designed specifically to stop you and limit your opportunities thus restricting what you can do/show on the biggest stage "doesn't make sense?"

If Hoopgurlz is right, do you realize what S.C. "is bringing" next year as well? If it makes sense for those players and for Dawn and SC, why doesn't it make sense for UCONN?

If you're a competitor, just know that everyday in practice you're going to be playing against some amazing talent that challenges you and it won't be one game or two a year but just about DAILY!! Sounds pretty good good to me if you want to compete!!!!

 

[Buzzyboy]

I'm really not sold on Dawns coaching ability.

I think Dawn is a great recruiter but that certainly doesn't suggest that she's in the same ballpark as a coach ... she's obviously good but how good?????

 

[Buzzyboy]

Umm, ok, so if you are not sold on her coaching then you must have a pretty short list of coaches you do think are solid, maybe a list 1-3 (Geno-11, Kim-3 and Tara-2?) cuz after that the pickings get pretty slim to put ahead of Dawn.
Frequently mentioned on here as Top coaches are Kelly, Doug, Vic, Jeff, Gary Blair (1) and Brenda(1). Many conference titles, a few Final Fours, a few Elite 8's sort of define top coaches and Dawn checks those boxes, plus she has a National Title. There are only 5 other active coaches with Titles so...let us know who she's behind on the coaching list so we can be enlightened.

The fact is that even if "she's not behind someone", she may not be a great coach .... no one is suggesting that she isn't a good coach but being a great coach can be an entirely different thing .... someone could be the best coach out there and still not be a great coach .... one thing no one will deny is that she is an exceptional recruiter and as Geno has said many times, great players can make someone a great coach or at least BE SEEN as a great coach .... I think she's a better recruiter than she is a great coach but then again, that's just my opinion though it seems like there may be some other Boneyarders that agree with my sentiment.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Indeed! the main point is it appears that SC will be the most relevant measuring stick over the next few years. This year there may be more legitimate contenders, but next year with tons of returning talent plus both SC and Uconn have great recruiting classes, those two teams will likely separate themselves from the rest of the field.

Uconn and SC the top 2, then a big dropoff to #3. Just like last year when the top 3 were at a different level than the next tier. Both team's had two monster classes, SC in 19 and 21, Uconn in 20 and 21. SC will be right near the top until the Boston class graduates, Uconn the same until Paige's class graduates. If either team adds much in subsequent years their dominance of course can continue well beyond that, but both teams being very very good for the next few years is pretty much baked into the cake.

South Carolina has finally just started having a little success against UConn and in the recent past, there where times where UConn actually disassembled South Carolina at South Carolina when they were higher ranked so I think it'll take a bit more success on their part before I'm conceding that Staley is anything but a good coach who recruits extraordinarily well .... she does have the benefit of being located nearer some of the best talent in the country in the southeastern part of the country

 

[Adios]

We are 1-0 against ND and SC in football!

Hope the football program rebuilds fast enough.

Geno is a mad scientist in women's basketball. No idea if he would have had success in coaching males. Definitely nowhere as much.

 

[visitingcock]

We are 1-0 against ND and SC in football!

Hope the football program rebuilds fast enough.

Geno is a mad scientist in women's basketball. No idea if he would have had success in coaching males. Definitely nowhere as much.

An opening:

no more Muschamp! What were we thinking?

as to Dawn, time will tell. By the time the 2021 class enrolls she will, for the first time, have depth on a par with Geno. She still doesn’t have the depth to bring a rested Wilson/Boston off the bench for the final five minutes against a top competitor. We’ll see

 

[oldhusky]

An opening:

no more Muschamp! What were we thinking?

as to Dawn, time will tell. By the time the 2021 class enrolls she will, for the first time, have depth on a par with Geno. She still doesn’t have the depth to bring a rested Wilson/Boston off the bench for the final five minutes against a top competitor. We’ll see

Both teams will have outstanding depth by 2021, but I would argue SC's depth will probably be similar to Uconn this year and was far superior last year. SC didn't play any player more than 29 minutes a game, and had 9 averaging around 13 or higher, if i remember correctly. They used their bench a-lot and I believe there were no obvious weak links in the players they used. They all contributed at least in some categories. They lost two to graduation and brought in two top ten recruits so should be similar this year.

This year I think Uconn projects to have a very good top 8 (but certainly unproven) but they are not yet sure if 9 and 10, Mir and Piath can be assets off the bench or not. Last year they were only 6 deep, they used 8 regularly but Kyla and Molly were used out of necessity.

 

[Alydar]

Depth is nice over the course of a season but unnecessary in one game. Look back to the 2014 SC-CT game. S Carolina was No 1 because UConn lost at Stanford in their 2nd game. S Carolina fans were pumped and made a huge point of their depth, which was impressive when you consider they had Wilson White and Coates on their bench as subs. According to their fans prior to the game UConn would be worn down because they had a short bench. S Carolina used their bench for 75 minutes while UConn used 34 mins. I distinctly remember a point midway in the 1st half when S Car called a time out and their players were doubled over trying to catch their breath despite their subbing in. Four UConn starters play between 34 and 38 minutes. UConn won 87-62.

 

[DefenseBB]

So, I find this comment "Dawn is great recruiter but not a great coach" discussion odd as I have asked out loud, name me a "great coach" who ranks ahead of her? I feel pretty knowledgeable on the current crop of D1 coaches and yes, A) there is those who can coach up a player to above their stated skillset, B) those that match the coaching to the players potential and C) those that underperform with the talent they have.

If you want to say Doug Bruno is in the A) category of great coach who coaches up players, sure but he still doesn't get to an Elite 8 regularly. Scott Rueck can coach a bit in my estimation and has been sporadic with great recruiting and has pretty good results.

To me, it is very hard to quantify the difference between "great recruiter" and "great coach" if you win. Dawn not only has won with great recruiting but she did win at Temple to get her the SC job and she won at SC inheriting an abysmal program before she was able to get Wilson. Worse case is she is in the B) category matching the talent with the success. Brenda belongs into this category-numerous Big10 titles, 1 NCAA title and a few Final Fours. Where does Kelly Graves belong- A or B.

What I can tell you is we all see the coaches who fall into the C) category who can recruit but can't coach a lick- see Holly Warlick, see Karen Aston. Kevin McGuff has recruited well but his results seem underwhelming. Joanne P McCallie probably falls here as well.

Saying Dawn can't coach is more of an "emotional argument" against the vocal fans on this forum or her personality (like claiming the #1 mythical championship) than it is of any "evidentiary points" that one could make.
Humbly submitted,
DefenseBB