Big East Considering Bubble | Page 5 | The Boneyard

Big East Considering Bubble

thatguyed said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't college students actually have things called classes?
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Like Allen Iverson, Zion, and probably most of the UNC MBB program etc?
There are tons of NCAA mens basketball players who never stepped into a classroom
It's totally wrong but its reality
 
FatElvis said:
So what you're telling me is college kids, who are mini celebrities on campus, are really going to sequester themselves from the rest of the world so they can play basketball for free?

Yeah sure. And I've got a big beautiful wall down south for sale if anyone's interested.
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Not playing for free. Remember, they are on a full scholarship to a major university. Give that same opportunity, to some kid working his or her butt off to pay for school and watch how quickly many of them submit to sequester and the opportunity to play basketball. People gotta stop lobbying for the players. They are getting a free college education. So just do it or pay your own way in college.
 
gtcam said:
Like Allen Iverson, Zion, and probably most of the UNC MBB program etc?
There are tons of NCAA mens basketball players who never stepped into a classroom
It's totally wrong but its reality
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Add Melo to that list, heard a few stories.
 
TouchdownHusky said:
Not playing for free. Remember, they are on a full scholarship to a major university. Give that same opportunity, to some kid working his or her butt off to pay for school and watch how quickly many of them submit to sequester and the opportunity to play basketball. People gotta stop lobbying for the players. They are getting a free college education. So just do it or pay your own way in college.
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Technically speaking, you're right. But let's not pretend the university hasn't gotten a nice return from those scholarships over the years.

Any lobbying I'm doing here involves putting common sense first and offering support for them as people. Just because you want to essentially force them to play, they're still the ones taking on all the risks for your enjoyment. Either way, their scholarship will be honored. Going on a tangent about how others with less options would trade places isn't really relevant here.
 
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PChoops said:
Add Melo to that list, heard a few stories.
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Now they habe academic incentives to do well in school too! Benefits for cracking the books. Okafor is probably scratching his head. Kid graduated in 3 years in Finance with a 3.8.
 
FatElvis said:
Technically speaking, you're right. But let's not pretend the university hasn't gotten a nice return from those scholarships over the years.

Any lobbying I'm doing here involves putting common sense first and offering support for them as people. Just because you want to essentially force them to play, they're still the ones taking on all the risks for your enjoyment. Either way, their scholarship will be honored. Going on a tangent about how others with less options would trade places isn't really relevant here.
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If you or I work for Amazon, we get paid a salary (take it or leave it). That salary comes nowhere near the "nice return" from our work over the years. The point: it doesn't matter what ROI the owners and upper management make off our labor (it will never be justified). All that matters for us is that we agree to exchange our labor for the salary they are offering. If we don't think it's worth it, then we are free to look elsewhere for better money - if we can find it.

A full scholarship is worth a lot of money, but players are free not to accept the offer. I am sure the university could find others willing to accept it and submit to a bubble existence for a few months.
 
FatElvis said:
Technically speaking, you're right. But let's not pretend the university hasn't gotten a nice return from those scholarships over the years.

Any lobbying I'm doing here involves putting common sense first and offering support for them as people. Just because you want to essentially force them to play, they're still the ones taking on all the risks for your enjoyment. Either way, their scholarship will be honored. Going on a tangent about how others with less options would trade places isn't really relevant here.
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And . . . I don't want to force them to play. I agree, you have to put common sense first. But if the university and the conference deem that they will play in a bubble, then the players have a choice: do it (and accept the scholarship) or don't and pay your own way as a regular college student.
 
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TouchdownHusky said:
They are receiving compensation, a free college education.
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Ah yes because Zion Williamson’s scholarship was equivalent to the revenue he generated for ESPN, Duke, and Nike. I hate this argument that their compensation is a scholarship. People on academic scholarships are allowed to get paid through the open market ( research grants, companies that want to pay them for their talents etc etc). Why does the NCAA restrict highly profitable players from earning what they are worth through the market? They provide labor and generate revenue, they should be able to capitalize on that on top of the scholarship they are provided.
 
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Fatroony5 said:
Ah yes because Zion Williamson’s scholarship was equivalent to the revenue he generated for ESPN, Duke, and Nike. I hate this argument that their compensation is a scholarship. People on academic scholarships are allowed to get paid through the open market ( research grants, companies that want to pay them for their talents etc etc). Why does the NCAA restrict highly profitable players from earning what they are worth through the market? They provide labor and generate revenue, they should be able to capitalize on that on top of the scholarship they are provided.
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Zion and others like him should skip college altogether then. But don't exploit (yeah, it goes two ways) universities to gain exposure and then bitch about the compensation received after you have come a "celebrity". Athletes can leave, as Zion did, after their first season and reap all those riches. But the original deal was scholarship = athletic participation (nothing else).

Another issue is that in basketball & football, you are part of a team. Without your teammates, you have no success. So why would Zion, or others like him, receive additional compensation for his successes at Duke, when, in fact, he was totally dependent on his teammmates. Afterall they are also are "providing labor and generating revenue" for the university.

Zion and others like him, if they don't like NCAA rules on amateur athletics, should go play, and get paid, inthe developmental leagues. I am sure that the endorsement opportunities would be immense in that league. So until an athlete actually signs an NFL or NBA contract, they should be happy for the scholarship and recognize that athletic participation is not a right, it is an opportunity that could lead to financial reward at some later date.
 
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TouchdownHusky said:
Zion and others like him should skip college altogether then. But don't exploit (yeah, it goes two ways) universities to gain exposure and then bitch about the compensation received after you have come a "celebrity". Athletes can leave, as Zion did, after their first season and reap all those riches. But the original deal was scholarship = athletic participation (nothing else).

Another issue is that in basketball & football, you are part of a team. Without your teammates, you have no success. So why would Zion, or others like him, receive additional compensation for his successes at Duke, when, in fact, he was totally dependent on his teammmates. Afterall they are also are "providing labor and generating revenue" for the university.

Zion and others like him, if they don't like NCAA rules on amateur athletics, should go play, and get paid, inthe developmental leagues. I am sure that the endorsement opportunities would be immense in that league. So until an athlete actually signs an NFL or NBA contract, they should be happy for the scholarship and recognize that athletic participation is not a right, it is an opportunity that could lead to financial reward at some later date.
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I just can’t understand the logic behind the NCAA not allowing kids to profit off their NIL. Students on academic scholarships can pursue financial opportunities in the marketplace and the school doesn’t restrict them access in doing that. Compensation isn’t equal, life isn’t equal in the marketplace. I’m not saying the schools need to be paying the students directly. But restricting athletes from gaining their worth in the market place, while having them generate literally billions of dollars to then call that amateurism is laughable. No other college students are restricted from seeking their value in the market. It’s really that simple. Sure the schools provide a ton of value to these athletes to promote themselves, gain exposure etc etc and the schools are rewarded handsomely for that. Allowing kids to profit outside of the school while remaining on scholarship would seem like a logical next step. We’re heading in that direction sooner than later
 
:eek: People on academic scholarships are allowed to get paid through the open market (research grants, companies that want to pay them for their talents etc etc)

Yeah, we all know college freshmen who get this along with their educational scholarships. All my children received scholarships, my son a full boat Nutmeg Scholarship at UConn, not one of them received anything you are barking about while in school
These players get full boat scholarships (basketball players) - not many on educational scholarship receive full boat - less than 3% based on their educational achievements only.
 
gtcam said:
:eek: People on academic scholarships are allowed to get paid through the open market (research grants, companies that want to pay them for their talents etc etc)

Yeah, we all know college freshmen who get this along with their educational scholarships. All my children received scholarships, my son a full boat Nutmeg Scholarship at UConn, not one of them received anything you are barking about while in school
These players get full boat scholarships (basketball players) - not many on educational scholarship receive full boat - less than 3% based on their educational achievements only.
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I never hear arguments about why athletes that have worth in the market place cannot capitalize on said worth. No other students at universities are restricted from that whether on an academic scholarship (partial or full) or not. Students are allowed to work and make money through whatever means come available to them, why aren’t scholarship athletes allowed to do that? Those 3% you’re referring to aren’t restricted in taking jobs that will pay them well while remaining on their scholarships (could be during the school year or summer times).

NIL seems pretty simple to me. It allows the players to obtain financial income through the marketplace that every other student has access to while removing the liability of the school to directly pay the athletes. Allows the kids to make money while the schools don’t have to get involved to determine what player gets x amount and what sports have to be cut to make that work.
 
Fatroony5 said:
Students on academic scholarships can pursue financial opportunities in the marketplace and the school doesn’t restrict them access in doing that.
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It depends on the scholarship. This isn't entirely true. Schools expect those on an academic scholarship to devote themselves totally. If it's financial aid we're talking about, then you're right. But those on scholarship are different than aid.

For TAs, they are totally prohibited from moonlighting in exchange for full tuition remission. I well remember those documents I had to sign.

More than that though the NCAA does this to prevent boosters and such from paying players directly.
 
gtcam said:
:eek: People on academic scholarships are allowed to get paid through the open market (research grants, companies that want to pay them for their talents etc etc)

Yeah, we all know college freshmen who get this along with their educational scholarships. All my children received scholarships, my son a full boat Nutmeg Scholarship at UConn, not one of them received anything you are barking about while in school
These players get full boat scholarships (basketball players) - not many on educational scholarship receive full boat - less than 3% based on their educational achievements only.
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your kid doesn't create millions of dollars of revenue for the school, basketball players do what is so hard to understand about that
 
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QuickDraw said:
I would take a season in the bubble instead of no season at all for many reasons. This may be the last chance we get to see Bouk dress as a Husky if there is a season, others will continue to mature and move on regardless of unused eligibility. A season in almost any form would be better than none. I agree that no fans would suck but I still prefer it to no games.
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Bouk isn't NBA ready without the big 20-21 season we all are expecting.
 
TouchdownHusky said:
And . . . I don't want to force them to play. I agree, you have to put common sense first. But if the university and the conference deem that they will play in a bubble, then the players have a choice: do it (and accept the scholarship) or don't and pay your own way as a regular college student.
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There's absolute no chance a situation occurs that players lose their scholarships over opting out of season due to covid concerns.
 
bmayuc said:
your kid doesn't create millions of dollars of revenue for the school, basketball players do what is so hard to understand about that
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I would take issue with this. A lot of people on scholarship create MORE money for the school than a basketball player.
 
Fatroony5 said:
I just can’t understand the logic behind the NCAA not allowing kids to profit off their NIL. Students on academic scholarships can pursue financial opportunities in the marketplace and the school doesn’t restrict them access in doing that. Compensation isn’t equal, life isn’t equal in the marketplace. I’m not saying the schools need to be paying the students directly. But restricting athletes from gaining their worth in the market place, while having them generate literally billions of dollars to then call that amateurism is laughable. No other college students are restricted from seeking their value in the market. It’s really that simple. Sure the schools provide a ton of value to these athletes to promote themselves, gain exposure etc etc and the schools are rewarded handsomely for that. Allowing kids to profit outside of the school while remaining on scholarship would seem like a logical next step. We’re heading in that direction sooner than later
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Bad policy. The scholarship covers it all. You wanna promote yourself, go play in a developmental league right out of high school. A lot of opportunities coming out of that. Just like baseball with so many, many minor leaguers making so much outside revenue. Bottom lines the players, without the university they represent, are worth little financially until - and if - they make the NBA or NFL.
 
TouchdownHusky said:
Bad policy. The scholarship covers it all. You wanna promote yourself, go play in a developmental league right out of high school. A lot of opportunities coming out of that. Just like baseball with so many, many minor leaguers making so much outside revenue. Bottom lines the players, without the university they represent, are worth little financially until - and if - they make the NBA or NFL.
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But we can solve this problem by simply having the universities license their brand to pro leagues. Make a clean cut, have the schools license their brand, and then everyone is happy.
 
ToolzieFan said:
Well, if they have to make a choice between playing basketball in a bubble or not playing at all, then I suspect some might choose the bubble. Don’t forget, these kids love playing, and their prospects of playing professionally might depend on getting a chance to play. Also, if it’s really a bubble with remote learning, then they might be safer than the typical college student.
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It is an example of just how warped college sports have become that we are 3ven considering this. if they do it, the Big East will show that it is nothing more than the SEC. Just in large cities instead of rural communities.
 
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