Big East Attendance Blues

[whaler11]

If you are going to bash people you can't do it by noting their attendance during a snowstorm that postponed other games in the area.

It is funny to read so many bashing the New Big East for their Fox growing pains the exact same place where so many promoted NBCS as a viable alternative for the Big East pre and post split. At least Fox overpays.

 

[Waquoit]

As I mentioned on the hoops board, we are in a house of delicate crystal using a catapult when we criticize someone else's attendance blues from conference affiliation.

We just sold out an XL game against a newbie. At noon, no less.

 

[nadav]

If you are going to bash people you can't do it by noting their attendance during a snowstorm that postponed other games in the area.

Wasn't bashing the attendance, just the reporting of a false attendance number. Thought that was fairly clear.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

We just sold out an XL game against a newbie. At noon, no less.

You are guaranteeing XL/Gampel sellouts for all the new schools now? Awesome. I was at the Temple game, and it was pretty much "pick your seat" night at the XL.

 

[nadav]

You are guaranteeing XL/Gampel sellouts for all the new schools now? Awesome. I was at the Temple game, and it was pretty much "pick your seat" night at the XL.

As Whaler would say, any weather issues that night Nelson??!!! PC drew 2,022 that night for Butler. Credit the Friars for actually posting actual attendance numbers though.

 

[frankthetank]

The OP premise is that there was some type of better option here for the C7/New Big East. Sure, the New Big East would rather have stayed in the Old Big East with Syracuse, Louisville, Pitt and UConn. That's why the hybrid stayed together as long as it did - it was the best option out of an admittedly bad set of options after Miami/BC/VT left for the ACC.

The issue, of course, is that the Old Big East died. As a result, the choice was either (a) stay in the AAC where the only 2 schools that the C7 cared about at all (UConn and Cincinnati) are doing everything they can to get out of there AND continue dealing with conference realignment stability beyond their control with a bunch of schools that they had no history or institutional commonalities with in the name of a sport (FBS football) that they didn't even play or (b) create a new conference where they could completely control their membership AND get paid more TV money for just basketball alone than the AAC gets for both football and basketball.

Believe me - there are problems with just signing all of your TV rights over to Fox. Exposure does mean something beyond money. However, simply being able to be the conference realignment predator of non-FBS Division I basketball schools as opposed to being constantly negatively impacted by being in a conference that's the prey of power FBS football conferences was reason enough alone to split. Stability means just as much as money in conference realignment. It had to be done from the C7 perspective.

 

[Fishy]

The "admittedly bad" set of options produced the best basketball conference in the country...and prompted the ACC to use ESPN's money cannon to destroy it.

Final Four's, a couple of NCAA national champions, record NCAA tourney bids....

So there's that.

 

[ZooCougar]

Hey Frank,

Nobody gives a crap about Creighton.

And nobody ever will, except for 15,000 fans with nothing better to do in the infinite Nebraska winter.

 

[frankthetank]

The "admittedly bad" set of options produced the best basketball conference in the country...and prompted the ACC to use ESPN's money cannon to destroy it.

Final Four's, a couple of NCAA national champions, record NCAA tourney bids....

So there's that.

Yes, it was a great basketball conference, but when I say "bad options", it's that no conference would willingly create a full-blown hybrid today with so many different types of schools, interests and football/non-football issues. However, the Big East at that time was still better off staying in that hybrid after the 2003 ACC raid as opposed to splitting - it was still optimal for them from a revenue standpoint. Once Syracuse left in particular, though, that killed the desire to continue the hybrid.

 

[Fishy]

You don't have a handle on our former conference. Losing Miami, Virginia Tech and Boston College didn't mean a blessed thing to our hoop-only partners.

The easiest way to explain those schools to an outsider such as yourself is that when they played St. John's, they played in Queens and not Madison Square Garden. Miami, Virginia Tech and BC fans didn't have to buy three-game packages to see their teams play in Providence.

The hybrid model worked overwhelmingly to the advantage of the basketball-only schools - the last ten years will be looked at as the good ol' days for those schools. They got a seat at a bigger table and cashed bigger paychecks than they could have without that model.

Even Syracuse leaving didn't jar them loose. Losing Louisville and the (at the time) imminent departure of UConn and perhaps Cincinnati, combined with the Fox offer split them off.

 

[pepband99]

I'll make it even easier. Basketball-wise, the biggest loss that came from Miami / BCU / VPI leaving, was the Miami dance team's annual appearance at MSG.

 

[NickyNewark]

Yes, it was a great basketball conference, but when I say "bad options", it's that no conference would willingly create a full-blown hybrid today with so many different types of schools, interests and football/non-football issues. However, the Big East at that time was still better off staying in that hybrid after the 2003 ACC raid as opposed to splitting - it was still optimal for them from a revenue standpoint. Once Syracuse left in particular, though, that killed the desire to continue the hybrid.

Man frank I'm telling you reading you're blog going back to "10" I feel you're a fan or obsessed with "Cuse"? Believe me here in the east outside hoop season their a nonentity where their strength used to be in North Jersey and the suburbs of NYC,NJ,FF cty in Conn+ LI....I see you really pushed/promoted them to the B1G on you're early stuff on eastern CR. In FB no one cares about Cuse or there antiquated Carrier Dome(Circus Tent) here in metro NYC!!

 

[FriarJ]

Nova still

Two of the three newcomer's attendance is up by less than 1%, probably not statistically significant. For the entire conference you have one team with an increase and everyone else flat or down. The one increase is Creighton and what will happen to them when McDermott graduates and they come back to earth? The flagship programs, Villanova and Georgetown, have amongst the biggest drops. Not great signs.

has 3 good home games at The Wells Fargo center that are near or sellouts so their numbers should improve, but the number speak for themselves. PC will be getting only their 2nd ranked opponent to the Dunk tonight.

 

[zls44]

A Big 12 WBB game outdrew nine Big East men's games across FS1 & FS2 last week. Nine. Out of ten.

 

[whaler11]

A Big 12 WBB game outdrew nine Big East men's games across FS1 & FS2 last week. Nine. Out of ten.

ESPN can run a test pattern and outrate FS1. Everyone knows this, but if you really get into viewers Newlywed Game reruns on GSN outrate good ESPN games.

We'll see if Fox has the stomach to invest in the long term. They are probably too late to the party, but the games are on and the money is still two and half times higher than the AAC - so what the *k were they supposed to do?

 

[CAHUSKY]

ESPN can run a test pattern and outrate FS1. Everyone knows this, but if you really get into viewers Newlywed Game reruns on GSN outrate good ESPN games.

We'll see if Fox has the stomach to invest in the long term. They are probably too late to the party, but the games are on and the money is still two and half times higher than the AAC - so what the *k were they supposed to do?

I was actually surprised how many people watch the game show network. They have between 250k and 500k viewers most of the day.
http://gameshownetworknews.blogspot.com/2014/02/gsn-ratings-february-10-16-2014-catch.html

 

[huskypantz]

I was actually surprised how many people watch the game show network. They have between 250k and 500k viewers most of the day.
http://gameshownetworknews.blogspot.com/2014/02/gsn-ratings-february-10-16-2014-catch.html

I was blown away by Spongebob squarepants ratings a year or two ago, not sure if it's still as strong but they were massive. Another heavy hitter is family guy - put it on at 3am Tuesday and it can still outdraw most bball games.

 

[CAHUSKY]

I was blown away by Spongebob squarepants ratings a year or two ago, not sure if it's still as strong but they were massive. Another heavy hitter is family guy - put it on at 3am Tuesday and it can still outdraw most bball games.

Spongebob is no joke...................

From last weeks ratings:
The weekly win was fueled by Nick’s hit programming roster. For the second consecutive week, SpongeBob SquarePants, Sanjay and Craig are the top animated series, respectively, with Kids 2-11; followed by Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, which took the number-three spot this week . SpongeBob SquarePants averaged a 6.0/1.9M (+40%) with K2-11 and 3.5 million total viewers.

 

[tcf15]

Georgetown vs. Xavier is supposed to be playing on FS1 right now (started at 11:30), but it was bumped to FS2 until noon, so they could show more NASCAR practice laps.

FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1
Sprint Cup practice is LIVE! The rain has let up and the track is almost dry.

FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1
PROGRAM ALERT: @XUAthletics vs. @GeorgetownHoops is airing on FOX Sports 2. The conclusion of the game will be on @FOXSports1.

 

[BUHusky]

Georgetown vs. Xavier is supposed to be playing on FS1 right now (started at 11:30), but it was bumped to FS2 until noon, so they could show more NASCAR practice laps.

FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1
Sprint Cup practice is LIVE! The rain has let up and the track is almost dry.

FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1
PROGRAM ALERT: @XUAthletics vs. @GeorgetownHoops is airing on FOX Sports 2. The conclusion of the game will be on @FOXSports1.

Yikes...

I have no doubt the new Big East teams are enjoying cashing their bigger checks from FOX, and they should because they are making good money for non football schools.

But good grief, their exposure is disappearing at an astonishing rate. It's only their 1st season, but FS1 is already throwing hail marys and replacing basketball with NASCAR just to boost ratings. If this is a taste of things to come it can't be good for anyone associated with the new Big East.

 

[zls44]

Georgetown vs. Xavier is supposed to be playing on FS1 right now (started at 11:30), but it was bumped to FS2 until noon, so they could show more NASCAR practice laps. FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1 Sprint Cup practice is LIVE! The rain has let up and the track is almost dry. FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1 PROGRAM ALERT: @XUAthletics vs. @GeorgetownHoops is airing on FOX Sports 2. The conclusion of the game will be on @FOXSports1.

Lololol

 

[Durks07]

Georgetown vs. Xavier is supposed to be playing on FS1 right now (started at 11:30), but it was bumped to FS2 until noon, so they could show more NASCAR practice laps.

FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1
Sprint Cup practice is LIVE! The rain has let up and the track is almost dry.

FOX Sports 1@FOXSports1
PROGRAM ALERT: @XUAthletics vs. @GeorgetownHoops is airing on FOX Sports 2. The conclusion of the game will be on @FOXSports1.

So, if I understand this correctly, FS is banking on people watching water dry and hoping that they stick around for the conclusion of a live basketball game. Hey, remember when the Big East had basketball teams people cared about watching? When you can throw $3 million a year for DePaul, Providence, Seton Hall, and St. Johns to play each other and not play the real Big East teams (UConn, Cuse, Pitt) you just have to do it right? That's Good Business Sense 101. It is NOT, I repeat, NOT the functional equivalent of: