Auburn @ Mississippi St - 2/23/21

[Jmsdawg]

So what you are saying is that one of the most reliable guys on the MSU forums says NMP is going to get at least one more year. And, this reliable person only suggest the possibility of no third year if there aren't signs of improvement in year 2. Sounds like that person and I are on the same page.

As for being a Nikki cheerleader, I think my viewpoint on her is more of wait and see. As my username indicates, I'm taking a realistic view about this season. The returning roster wasn't as deep, experienced and talented as people like you suggest--I've written at least two detailed posts on this and no MSU fan has had a valid response to show where I'm wrong. I'm realistic enough to recognized how difficult this season has been for new coaches trying to get familiar with a new team and trying to install new styles of play. If you want a good example, go look at what has happened with the Old Dominion program that was so successful under Nikki last year. I also realize that Vic had a big home court advantage which helped make the program a success, and this year home courts are almost like neutral court games. The bottom line is that there is nothing normal about this year in most situations, including being a first year head coach, and fans who give up on a coach after less than a year are really jumping the gun. (BTW, do you realize that Nikki has a better record than Vic this year against teams currently in the top-25 even though Vic has 3 upperclassmen McDonald's All-Americans including the player projected to be the #1 pick in the WNBA draft?)

You really believe this team has performed anywhere near their talent level? We only have 9 wins, five of those wins were against low level competition, and the only top 25 team appears to be Georgia. However, given our lack of success we are still projected as a 7seed NCAA team. Why do you think experts see our team deserving a 7 seed, my take is because they realize the talent is there and the possibility of some very intriguing match up exist if this team can play up to their talent level. I love our team regardless of their performance and always root for MSST, however NMP has definitely tested my enthusiasm as I really see her as a liability to MSST success. Still hoping our kids can get it together but basketball is some much about confidence and I think our confidence level is shot.

 

[MSSportsGuy]

The returning roster wasn't as deep, experienced and talented as people like you suggest--I've written at least two detailed posts on this and no MSU fan has had a valid response to show where I'm wrong.

If I may.......

In a different thread I gave you plenty of reasons why this roster is talented. You backed off of "gutted roster" but now say no one has given you a valid response that this roster isn't as deep, experienced and talented as some of us suggest.

I will give you depth and I never thought we had much to begin with. Talent? We have 3 McDonald's All American's on our team and neither Vivians nor McCowan earned that honor. No this roster isn't Uconn, SC, or Stanford but it isn't chopped liver. Jackson and Carter are shooting worse than last year. Cooks points are lower than at Michigan State, which you did correctly point out she wasn't a lynchpin yet still is playing worse for us than for them. Mingo and Matharu both had games where they put up good numbers and some games where they were ineffective but that's typical freshmen. BTW, Madison Hays who you say has a "good freshman year" is averaging 4.8 points on 42.4% shooting in 20 minutes. Compare that with the 7.1 from Matharu and 4.1 from Mingo during their freshman campaigns, in fewer minutes I may add, that you point to as a sign we shouldn't have counted on them to contribute for us the way we hoped.

I too consider myself a realist and I am not upset the team isn't in the top 10 nationally. I am upset because it's clear that something is wrong with their chemistry, attitude, and only one player has shown any growth this year. The SEC is better this year than the past few, I admit that. Vic would have had problems with A&M and UT this season as both are improved with coaching and transfers. I am not mad we lost some of the games we have: I am mad that there seems to be little shown during the games that resembles anything this team has been the past few years. That's at least somewhat on the coach.

While you think we fans were the ones touting the team that's inaccurate. National publications and sites all had us preseason top 10. Were all the "experts" wrong as well? So far your posts have made it sound like MSU fans talked this team up in their heads for no reason.

I honestly appreciate that you are contributing, supporting Nikki, and trying not to be all doom and gloom. I believe McCray needs to and will get another year or two to see if there is any improvement. It's fine that we disagree and I consider the matter closed after getting this post off my chest, but there is a difference between disagreeing and "no valid response".

 

[SECbbfan24]

Miss St went from finishing 2nd in the conference to 9th in the conference

 

[MSUrealist]

MSSportsGuy, you are referring to our exchange in the "If Vic Schaefer was still in Starkville" thread. You made the following comment, "This fan doesn't give the gutted roster line any consideration because it's not true. McCray inherited a very talented roster, one that was good enough to be considered top 10 back in April. Danberry was gone, yes Bibby and AEH transferred but waiting in the wings were two McDonald's All Americans in Cooks and Hayes. When a team brings back their two leading, All SEC scorers, starting point guard, and has an upperclassman transfer waiting in the wings that in no way constitutes a gutted roster. That's a roster with experience and talent when the season before they were SEC runner up and were set to be a top 16 seed host in the tournament."

It was then that I responded with a detailed look at the roster to point out in detail the exact roster NMP took over from last year. It was that detailed follow-up post that no one responded to until your post above. A few things which you actually pointed out:
--This idea that being a McAA automatically means someone is an elite college player is a fallacy. You imply that Jackson, Cooks, and Hayes are more talented than Vivians and McCowans since those two weren't McAA and we know that's not true.
--You latch on to the lower shooting percentages of Carter and Jackson while failing to mention that their points per game and rebounds are basically the same. Part of Jackson's decline is shooting more 3's this year, and with Carter last year her offense was mostly layups after on offensive rebounds or a dump off from a driving guard. This year they are trying to get her to develop an actual post game. With Carter and Jackson I see development in trying to expand their roles and talents, but I also seeing the growing pains in doing that.
--With Matharu and Mingo-Young it doesn't seem like you are suggesting that they should be stars this year or that they would be under another coach. You said they were inconsistent last year and we both know practice and games have been lower than normal.
--With Madison Hayes, let's don't forget that she averages almost 5 rebounds per game, basically tied with Jackson for 2nd best on the team. Plus, she plays hard all the time. I expect her to be a star in the league and am glad that NMP was able to successfully re-recruit her.

Maybe in the end we will have to agree to disagree on how much talent returned to MSU this season, and the same would go for how much of an impact we think the Covid limitations has had on new coaches. I'm okay with that. My opinions are just opinions, but they usually are made after a good bit of research and looking at the actual data. That doesn't mean they are right, it just means a lot of thought goes into them.

 

[DefenseBB]