Arizona Postgame Thread

[cbraarj]

But it wasn't the point the larry;legend said or the point I made to him.

Yes she is better. I never argued that.

LarryLegend spoke of a dominant post player. My post was stating there is no dominant post player.

I agree Brink is better but my post was not addressing who was better.

I'm leaning towards your point though of benching Liv. But that is for next year. Anyhow, some years seniors have a funny way of shocking all of us.

Offensively no dominate post in the Country. I agree with that.

 

[Gurleyman]

Offensively no dominate post in the Country. I agree with that.

Hillmon is pretty close. Didn’t have many games against a Baylor/Stanford/Oregon to measure her against an elite frontcourt defense, but she was a pretty relentless 25+12 every night while operating five feet and in.

 

[BBallF]

BBallF:

I just want to say I respect your opinion 100%. We have gone back enough here and I can say it’s a pleasure to read your stuff even if we disagree. Anything below I’m saying if it comes across anything other than respect in no way it meant to be.

1—About the layups – I don’t understand the point. Are you blaming Geno for UCONN missing layups? And as far Geno as perfect – I think it is impossible to project any coach as that. Nor are we. Not even close. The ironic thing is that I would’ve benched Liv more so. Not look to give her the ball more.

2—In terms of their offense – UConn dismantled Iowa and put up 69 vs Baylor. They had fine enough execution there. But overall we knew this team was young and we knew outside shooting was a problem. If I were to project this team over the past 20 years it would be bottom 3rd because they were never all that powerful as evidenced by the games you cited. A tough team to beat but not great. So why would anyone get in a tizzy over a team that was not “great” but only “very good?” A team that is "Very good" but not "great" is vulnerable to poor offensive games.

3—Regarding UCONN vs SC- UCONN won the game. vs a top 4 team in America. I can’t complain anything about that. For me it doesn’t matter the degree of their offense if they win- as long as they win. Why should it? There have been some issues with Geno I have disagreed with over the years but eh end sup winning. And still recruiting like a madman. I'm supposed to nitpcik him?

4—In terms of Liv- She can’t even consistently hit a layup with much consistency or hit ft’s. . So I’m going to take the ball out of NPOY Paige’s and CWill’s hands, and have her as a top-tier option? They both shot better than she did in this game too.

5—Over the last 20 years we’ve had as our top low post threats- AJones, JMoore, (the 04-05 team conceding didn’t have a true center), Tina Charles, SDolson, Stewie/Tuck, Gabby/Collier. She’s the 2nd worst low post scorer. And frankly the 04-05 team had used Charde playing center sometimes and she was a better low post scorer. So this is the worst (or 2nd worst) scorer in the last 20 years UConn has had for a low post player and we’re supposed to go away from the NPOY because you didn’t like the look on her face from the high post? How about she hits some layups to get that look off her face if it was there?

6--- In terms of defying me—fine. The team is not that great. When you have a high-powered offense and it gets shutdown I defy you to show me how you could say any offense that gets shutdown will look good. If you aren’t a great team – that’s what can happen. You saw the two games you cited. And even some Big East games. The offense looks poor because they aren’t like the great teams. Even 01-02 struggled vs Va Tech. Remember the infamous title game vs Stanford that, UCONN scored 15 points at halftime. Can I look at most years and find instances of an offense that struggled in some games? Sure I can.

7- And a final point I mean no disrespect with this but I just want to make it clear how much I disagree with any thought the offense should go through Liv just because she is taller. In addition, if she is in the low post, it means Edwards has less room to operate. That doesn’t make the team better either.

This is a really good colloquy but it would be appreciated if you understood my point about Liv. I would never suggest running the offense through her down low. You do that with a Charles or even a Boston but not her. I was objecting to her at the high post because last night it didn't work against AZ because they bottled up the entry pass to her and overplayed the next pass. When something doesn't work and is not going to work, you change it. The change is not for Liv to shoot more but to put her under for rebounding purposes because she was a waste at the high post against that team. While you do bring a defender down low with her, you open the lane from the arc to the 10 foot area and then you drive and pull up and we have 3 people that can in Paige, Evina and CW.

I was never suggesting that Paige or CW or even Evina shoot less, I wanted, all things being equal, for Evina to shoot more.

My point about the layups was that it was a symptom of a nervous, rushed, uncertain team and it is the coach's job to correct that either before it happens or during the game. Coaching is crucial in basketball, it is fluid game where players have to think and play at the same time with no time in between plays to decide what you are doing next like baseball or football. I thought the better coach for the game last night was not ours. Is Geno the better coach? Of course he is. He is perhaps the greatest ever right there with Wooden and Red Auerbach. But the last 3 NC semis our teams did not have the eye of the tiger, they didn't execute well and they seemed unready for the task.

You are right about the fact that these recent teams were not great teams. But they didn't have to be. They just had to play great or even well for a game and didn't. If Geno needs only truly great teams to win, that doesn't separate him from the pack except for recruiting and I don't believe that. I thought the jobs he did this year and last were among his best ever, transforming both teams in late February. Was it simply a failure of talent, the inevitability of youth not being able to prevail, or simply bad shooting? I would be inclined to accept one of them but for the fact that this is 3 years in a row that our team underperformed in this one game and we looked frighteningly similar in all of them.

 

[cbraarj]

Hillmon is pretty close. Didn’t have a game against a Baylor/Stanford/Oregon to measure her against an elite frontcourt defense, but she was a pretty relentless 25+12 every night while operating five feet and in.

Only saw her in tournament and wasn't overly impressed.

 

[hoophuskee]

This is a really good colloquy but it would be appreciated if you understood my point about Liv. I would never suggest running the offense through her down low. You do that with a Charles or even a Boston but not her. I was objecting to her at the high post because last night it didn't work against AZ because they bottled up the entry pass to her and overplayed the next pass. When something doesn't work and is not going to work, you change it. The change is not for Liv to shoot more but to put her under for rebounding purposes because she was a waste at the high post against that team. While you do bring a defender down low with her, you open the lane from the arc to the 10 foot area and then you drive and pull up and we have 3 people that can in Paige, Evina and CW.

I was never suggesting that Paige or CW or even Evina shoot less, I wanted, all things being equal, for Evina to shoot more.

My point about the layups was that it was a symptom of a nervous, rushed, uncertain team and it is the coach's job to correct that either before it happens or during the game. Coaching is crucial in basketball, it is fluid game where players have to think and play at the same time with no time in between plays to decide what you are doing next like baseball or football. I thought the better coach for the game last night was not ours. Is Geno the better coach? Of course he is. He is perhaps the greatest ever right there with Wooden and Red Auerbach. But the last 3 NC semis our teams did not have the eye of the tiger, they didn't execute well and they seemed unready for the task.

You are right about the fact that these recent teams were not great teams. But they didn't have to be. They just had to play great or even well for a game and didn't. If Geno needs only truly great teams to win, that doesn't separate him from the pack except for recruiting and I don't believe that. I thought the jobs he did this year and last were among his best ever, transforming both teams in late February. Was it simply a failure of talent, the inevitability of youth not being able to prevail, or simply bad shooting? I would be inclined to accept one of them but for the fact that this is 3 years in a row that our team underperformed in this one game and we looked frighteningly similar in all of them.

I have to ask-- in your opinion did UCONN have a successful season? And what do you think of each of these schools - Baylor and Maryland and SC- did they have successful seasons?

And taking away Liv from the High Post- what was your proposed offensive set? A double-post? And what teams mirror what you're suggesting?

 

[Superhuskies]

If Liv had a hook shot, she wouldn't have to use a fadeway.

Gotta blame coaching for that, after 3 years there...

 

[hoophuskee]

Gotta blame coaching for that, after 3 years there...

Not arguing but how many players do you see have a hook shot at the elite level?
And again I'm not arguing - but just wondering at the pro level who has developed a consistent hook shot? I wonder about every post player why they don't do it- I can only guess that it must be too hard to really be effective or which is very, very possible that there are many and I just don't notice.

And I'm showing my age ofc but what about underhanded ft's. Though I always thought that to be overrated. It's just as hard I thought to be able to do that vs regular.

But in terms of the hook shot/ jump hook- if a player can't hit a layup - and has "touch issues" around the basket- you really think they can develop a hook shot/ jump hook if they can't even hit a regular shot? Back in the 70's maybe-- but now? Because who does it?

 

[CocoHusky]

Also they said 6 or 7 of the teams in the PAC 12 use UConns offense.

That a really solid and underrated point. Arizona from the opening tip seemed to what UCONN actions were coming and moved quickly to defend. Yet UCONN stuck to the same sets (most elbo) even when 1) ONO had to go to the bench with foul troube and 2) When Nika was first inserted into the game. The only new wrinkle to the UCONN offense was late in the game when Nika went dribble drive and kicked out. Give credit to Arizona for their preparation but it's a lot easier to defend when you know what is coming.

 

[eebmg]

That a really solid and underrated point. Arizona from the opening tip seemed to what UCONN actions were coming and moved quickly to defend. Yet UCONN stuck to the same sets (most elbo) even when 1) ONO had to go to the bench with foul troube and 2) When Nika was first inserted into the game. The only new wrinkle to the UCONN offense was late in the game when Nika went dribble drive and kicked out. Give credit to Arizona for their preparation but it's a lot easier to defend when you know what coming.

Adia in the pregame presser said that UConn likes to run what she calls 'Chin Action" and most of the PAC12 teams run this. One of the more perceptive pressers. She also made a point afterwards that she does not want to be known simply as a recruiter but is technically strong etc.

 

[TheFarmFan]

Adia in the pregame presser said that UConn likes to run what she calls 'Chin Action" and most of the PAC12 teams run this. One of the more perceptive pressers. She also made a point afterwards that she does not want to be known simply as a recruiter but is technically strong etc.

I love Barnes's press conferences. She's observant and candid like Geno, not holding anything back. And she talks details, which I always appreciate.

On our board, fans have noted that Tara's Princeton offense that she adopted a few seasons ago is now very close to UConn's motion offense, which means there's no reason why Arizona can't do to us what they did to the Huskies on Friday. I'm expecting a tight, defensively-focused game; for Arizona to win, Aari needs to break out and get some support, and they need to hold us to few made threes like S. Carolina did. Very similar to the game plan against UConn, which they executed very well.

 

[PAHuskeyFan]

Has anyone questioned if the choice of the gray uniforms may have contributed to the problems???
Our team was flat from the start... and just never caught fire.

 

[eebmg]

Has anyone questioned if the choice of the gray uniforms may have contributed to the problems???
Our team was flat from the start... and just never caught fire.

So you want flammable uniforms?

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Has anyone questioned if the choice of the gray uniforms may have contributed to the problems???
Our team was flat from the start... and just never caught fire.

I hate them and I'm puzzled as to what impelled their creation and stubborn persistence.

 

[cancontent]

No excuse!

Well I guess it's a matter of agree to disagree. I didn't get the same reaction to what happened as you did. Everyone has their perspective on language like this.

 

[BBallF]

I

I have to ask-- in your opinion did UCONN have a successful season? And what do you think of each of these schools - Baylor and Maryland and SC- did they have successful seasons?

And taking away Liv from the High Post- what was your proposed offensive set? A double-post? And what teams mirror what you're suggesting?

In partial reply, UCONN had a successful season by objective standards measured by other programs. By UCONN standards it was disappointing because you know as well as I, that the expectations and goal is always an NC. I think Baylor and SC are both very disappointed as well and that applies to Maryland also. How do they measure success? I can't speak for them, and I don't think there is a one size fits all measure of success. I just know that our coaches and players were disappointed. I said it before and I will say it again, AZ had a better game plan, their players were game ready, and we were not. I don't think there can be any dispute about that. You saw how we played. I would have liked to have seen an open dribble drive type of offense with the post players on the blocks extended at least tried because it would have obviated the first high post pass and allowed our 3 guards who started the game to drive into an open key much like the men's offense. That was where our advantage developed during the game, that's where our points came from. You can contend all you want for our offense but the problem was that it didn't work. You think missing layups was a coincidence, I think it was a manifestation of a team not being ready mentally.

 

[Artifact]

One again, UConn has the height advantage and it’s all for nothing.

Height has it's advantages, yes & no. Depends how it is performed ?

 

[uconnfan68]

I hate them and I'm puzzled as to what impelled their creation and stubborn persistence.

Nike. Same with the silver, and with the black unis. Burn all of them.

 

[hoopsfan22]

Has anyone questioned if the choice of the gray uniforms may have contributed to the problems???
Our team was flat from the start... and just never caught fire.

Dislike them. I thought we wore home whites for High Point and then went gray the rest of the way. Not sure why we even need an alternate home uniform other than college teams taking their cue from pro teams which have a bunch of alternate uniforms.

 

[BBallF]

Not arguing but how many players do you see have a hook shot at the elite level?
And again I'm not arguing - but just wondering at the pro level who has developed a consistent hook shot? I wonder about every post player why they don't do it- I can only guess that it must be too hard to really be effective or which is very, very possible that there are many and I just don't notice.

And I'm showing my age ofc but what about underhanded ft's. Though I always thought that to be overrated. It's just as hard I thought to be able to do that vs regular.

But in terms of the hook shot/ jump hook- if a player can't hit a layup - and has "touch issues" around the basket- you really think they can develop a hook shot/ jump hook if they can't even hit a regular shot? Back in the 70's maybe-- but now? Because who does it?

I know you will find this to be very unusual, but I actually agree with you about the hook shot. A hook shot from a poor inside shooter and poor shooter in general is not the answer. Even in the NBA, the rare hook shot is a slower, less powerful shot and with elite defenders with long wing spans and high elevations, the shot would have to very, very high, effecting its reliability. It also starts at a lower point making that part of it vulnerable to guards. The answer for Liv in the big games, barring any change in her nervousness, is for the ball not to be in her hands except due to rebounds and clearly positioned height advantages underneath. It will be a guard dominated offense next year as you note and for that reason I hope a different offense with more of a perimeter dribble drive, shoot 3s approach be at least tried out. It puts Liv more underneath at the block extended rather than the high post but she is not making critical passes and decisions there. We want the shots, I would think, to come primarily from Paige, Azzi, EW and CW and CD secondarily if she is ready.

 

[Superhuskies]

Not arguing but how many players do you see have a hook shot at the elite level?
And again I'm not arguing - but just wondering at the pro level who has developed a consistent hook shot? I wonder about every post player why they don't do it- I can only guess that it must be too hard to really be effective or which is very, very possible that there are many and I just don't notice.

And I'm showing my age ofc but what about underhanded ft's. Though I always thought that to be overrated. It's just as hard I thought to be able to do that vs regular.

But in terms of the hook shot/ jump hook- if a player can't hit a layup - and has "touch issues" around the basket- you really think they can develop a hook shot/ jump hook if they can't even hit a regular shot? Back in the 70's maybe-- but now? Because who does it?

Not arguing but how many players do you see have a hook shot at the elite level?
And again I'm not arguing - but just wondering at the pro level who has developed a consistent hook shot? I wonder about every post player why they don't do it- I can only guess that it must be too hard to really be effective or which is very, very possible that there are many and I just don't notice.

And I'm showing my age ofc but what about underhanded ft's. Though I always thought that to be overrated. It's just as hard I thought to be able to do that vs regular.

But in terms of the hook shot/ jump hook- if a player can't hit a layup - and has "touch issues" around the basket- you really think they can develop a hook shot/ jump hook if they can't even hit a regular shot? Back in the 70's maybe-- but now? Because who does it?

I believe Tina C did one at times, eventually- of course, she was one of the greatest college centers of all time...

 

[Superhuskies]

She maybe gonna get the Paige Sauer experience......

 

[Cornell Lt]

If Liv had a hook shot, she wouldn't have to use a fadeway.

C'mon the hook shot went away about the same time canvass high tops did. Name one female player in the last 15-20 years that used the hook shot.

 

[oldude]

C'mon the hook shot went away about the same time canvass high tops did. Name one female player in the last 15-20 years that used the hook shot.

Somewhere in my basement there’s a box full of old shoes with a pair of Converse All-Stars in it......??