Abandoning Big East has become a disaster for one-time powerhouses | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Abandoning Big East has become a disaster for one-time powerhouses

Waquoit said:
Exactly, why?
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Zissou said:
There is more talk here about the current Big East compared to the Big East line-up 20 years ago, but all conferences have changed.

My ACC friends complain about the new ACC. It’s too big. The schedules don’t allow for playing all teams twice. There are more games that aren’t rivalries and fewer games that are. They don’t know all of the coaches in the conference and the best players on every team. There is just a lower interest now, and this is from the schools that were ACC before the expansion.

Pitt, BC, and Cuse fans definitely miss the juice of the Big East. F’em! They made their bed and sold their soul. They have more cash, but we have a better conference top to bottom, and BET at MSG never missed a beat with the rebirth.
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I mean if your ACC friend can't keep track of 15 basketball teams because that's too big, that's on him(or maybe you're just making it up like "people have been saying". But do you know the best players on every team in the Big East? I sure as hell don't. The Big East is certainly not as deep this year as past seasons.

I don't know where you get that there is lower interest in the ACC. Maybe because it's a down year but also might be some northeast bias showing. We're not that far removed from VA, Duke, UNC, LVille, FSU, VA-Tech and Syracuse all being ranked in the top 25. It's perennially one of the best conferences in the country.
 
buddy said:
I think UConn would be better off with the money. Villanova has the backing of the incredibly wealthy Catholic church. UConn has to rely on State Legislators who are not always fans, nor are the taxpayers of Ct.
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I'm not familiar with the finances at Catholic universities but does the Catholic church actually support those schools? If anything I highly doubt they are supporting the athletic endeavors of these schools. Anyone know?
 
Miami football is a small relic of what it once was. Even VT took a step backwards in football. WVU might be an exception. ND football has a license to steal in football, and stealing they are. The original members including the first add are all sucking wind across the boards. BC, RU, Pitt & Cuse.

Although they left for more money, I'm sure that makes the fans "happy". More money, no glory

I want to win, how much money the school gets paid means a whole lot less to fans of the sport. That's like a Jets fan being happy because their owner is getting richer
 
HooperScooper said:
I'm not familiar with the finances at Catholic universities but does the Catholic church actually support those schools? If anything I highly doubt they are supporting the athletic endeavors of these schools. Anyone know?
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I really don’t think they do. If anything just the chapel does.
 
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If a financial windfall is a disaster, it's a disaster.

Ironically, team that has fallen the furthest is Miami. They are no longer relevant in any sport.

BTW, this is an appropriate use of ironic which is often misapplied. The effect for Miami turned out to be the opposite of what was expected, and it did indeed result in wry amusement from onlookers.
 
Zissou said:
There is more talk here about the current Big East compared to the Big East line-up 20 years ago, but all conferences have changed.

My ACC friends complain about the new ACC. It’s too big. The schedules don’t allow for playing all teams twice. There are more games that aren’t rivalries and fewer games that are. They don’t know all of the coaches in the conference and the best players on every team. There is just a lower interest now, and this is from the schools that were ACC before the expansion.

Pitt, BC, and Cuse fans definitely miss the juice of the Big East. F’em! They made their bed and sold their soul. They have more cash, but we have a better conference top to bottom, and BET at MSG never missed a beat with the rebirth.
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14-16 team conferences suck. It's a TV bargaining creation and nothing more. The schools don't like them and the fans and players don't either.

There is a chance that disruptive TV/broadcast of the future reversed the current incentive for mega conferences. Things were much better before, more local rivals, less travel. Not just the big east, but the old Big8 and SWC, the pre-expansion BigTen and ACC, etc.

Disagree on your last sentence because it ignores football. It also ignores baseball and soccer. Basketball is the only sport where the ex-BigEast programs have suffered. BET at MSG also definitely missed UConn and Syracuse, which always were the biggest draws except for a handful of great St. Johns teams. Some of those BET games were like home games for UConn over the years.
 
Palatine said:
If a financial windfall is a disaster, it's a disaster.

Ironically, team that has fallen the furthest is Miami. They are no longer relevant in any sport.

BTW, this is an appropriate use of ironic which is often misapplied. The effect for Miami turned out to be the opposite of what was expected, and it did indeed result in wry amusement from onlookers.
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Miami is still relevant in football because sports writers always ask "is the U back" after they start 4-0, and then they promptly lose by a billion to Clemson.
 
Palatine said:
If a financial windfall is a disaster, it's a disaster.

Ironically, team that has fallen the furthest is Miami. They are no longer relevant in any sport.

BTW, this is an appropriate use of ironic which is often misapplied. The effect for Miami turned out to be the opposite of what was expected, and it did indeed result in wry amusement from onlookers.
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What exactly if your definition of relevant in football? Because if it's top 25 teams, I'd say Miami is relevant
 
HooperScooper said:
I'm not familiar with the finances at Catholic universities but does the Catholic church actually support those schools? If anything I highly doubt they are supporting the athletic endeavors of these schools. Anyone know?
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Yeah, they don’t.
 
HuskyHawk said:
14-16 team conferences suck. It's a TV bargaining creation and nothing more. The schools don't like them and the fans and players don't either.

There is a chance that disruptive TV/broadcast of the future reversed the current incentive for mega conferences. Things were much better before, more local rivals, less travel. Not just the big east, but the old Big8 and SWC, the pre-expansion BigTen and ACC, etc.

Disagree on your last sentence because it ignores football. It also ignores baseball and soccer. Basketball is the only sport where the ex-BigEast programs have suffered. BET at MSG also definitely missed UConn and Syracuse, which always were the biggest draws except for a handful of great St. Johns teams. Some of those BET games were like home games for UConn over the years.
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But I went to all those BET games, before and after. Yes, UConn and Cuse bring fans to New York, but sold out is sold out, and the games have been electric in MSG. UConn coming back will add to the atmosphere but not the attendance.

I was shocked to see the Creighton turn out at their first BET. Creighton fans were EVERYWHERE. Creighton, Butler, and X are real hoops programs and they show up. They love being in the Big East.
 
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Cuse's best finish in the ACC was in 2013-2014. Since then they're battling off GT and Wake Forest for bottom dwellers. That doesn't seem like a powerhouse that their fanbases makes them out to be
 
UConnSwag11 said:
Cuse's best finish in the ACC was in 2013-2014. Since then they're battling off GT and Wake Forest for bottom dwellers. That doesn't seem like a powerhouse that their fanbases makes them out to be
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In fairness they did make a Final Four. I remember, I was there.
 
pepband99 said:
Also fair, but you were comparing Pitt's postseason to your postseason.
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Ok, then let’s only compare from the start of the Big East forward. Pitt doesn’t compare. No Final Fours.

They were close once, but felt the Scottie Reynolds dagger.
 
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rondo225 said:
What exactly if your definition of relevant in football? Because if it's top 25 teams, I'd say Miami is relevant
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They've been ranked during 8 of the past 12 seasons. But only finished the season ranked in four of those seasons. And they are 1-10 in Bowl games since 2008.
 
Zissou said:
And Pitt? You are going to compare Pitt’s NCAA Tournament resume to Nova’s?

You need a filter. If you don’t know first hand, then Google a little before you post.
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No. I’m saying that Villanova benefitted when those teams left. Now they can regularly beat up on the mediocre new big East teams and it has helped them.

And jeez, yeah in the 1970s and 1980s they were good. Good grief. There wasn’t a Big East in 1971. Villanova is the absolute cream of the crop in the NBE. It isn’t even debatable. When you win 4 of 5 league championships and 2 National championships while nobody else gets past the 2nd round ( well Xavier got to an elite 8 I think) there is little argument about that.
 
Zissou said:
In fairness they did make a Final Four. I remember, I was there.
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Yes... By all metrics they didn’t deserve to get in that year or the following (might have been the previous). Still doesn’t change the fact that they’ve been trash
 
rondo225 said:
I mean if your ACC friend can't keep track of 15 basketball teams because that's too big, that's on him(or maybe you're just making it up like "people have been saying". But do you know the best players on every team in the Big East? I sure as hell don't. The Big East is certainly not as deep this year as past seasons.

I don't know where you get that there is lower interest in the ACC. Maybe because it's a down year but also might be some northeast bias showing. We're not that far removed from VA, Duke, UNC, LVille, FSU, VA-Tech and Syracuse all being ranked in the top 25. It's perennially one of the best conferences in the country.
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It is one of the best conferences, no argument there.
It’s not, however, as interesting for the old members. Not playing every team twice was a sacrifice for the cash.
If you have family and friends in the ACC you will likely hear the same. They don’t consider Miami, FSU, VT, Pitt, BC etc as equals to Tobacco Road.
 
freescooter said:
No. I’m saying that Villanova benefitted when those teams left. Now they can regularly beat up on the mediocre new big East teams and it has helped them.

And jeez, yeah in the 1970s and 1980s they were good. Good grief. There wasn’t a Big East in 1971. Villanova is the absolute cream of the crop in the NBE. It isn’t even debatable. When you win 4 of 5 league championships and 2 National championships while nobody else gets past the 2nd round ( well Xavier got to an elite 8 I think) there is little argument about that.
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Oklahoma, UNC, Kansas, and Michigan were impressed by Nova. That makes me think that maybe Nova was just plain very good, and not just the best of a weak conference.

The 2018 Nova team is arguably the best tournament team in NCAA history. It wasn’t playing conference opponents in that run.
 
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WhereistheDove? said:
I am genuinely very interested to see how their fundraising has done since the move. Some of the others probably don't have that issue (Cuse, ND), but do even Pitt alum care about their program as it is right now?
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They used to always sell out for their games. Now, 2k to 3k for most games.
 
freescooter said:
Obviously never been to the ACC Tournament, especially if UNC-Duke are playing for the title. Plus more people watch it on tv than in person
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You mean the tournament were they curtain off the upper deck on day 1. Plus, that last statement holds true for every league. Lol.
 
Zissou said:
Oklahoma, UNC, Kansas, and Michigan were impressed by Nova. That makes me think that maybe Nova was just plain very good, and not just the best of a weak conference.

The 2018 Nova team is arguably the best tournament team in NCAA history. It wasn’t playing conference opponents in that run.
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Yes but you forget their greatest achievement that year
Keeping the score of the UConn game to a somewhat respectable 20 pt margin.
That took an amazing effort.
 
Zissou said:
The 2018 Nova team is arguably the best tournament team in NCAA history. It wasn’t playing conference opponents in that run.
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2004 UConn would have beaten them by double digits. 1999 would have been interesting.
 
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