AA awards

[bballnut90]

Now that the first half of the season is gone I feel that its possible that both Gabby and Pheesa could drop down to 2nd team AA.Neither has played as well as last year albeit Gabby was terrific last night and Pheesa really good.
I do however think that Kia right now should be on the first team with the way she has consistently played this first half. Lou is a lock of course.

I made a midseason list about a month ago which had:
1st Team:
Aja Wilson, South Carolina (POY)
Sabrina Ionescu, Oregon
Teaira McCowan, Mississippi State
Katie Lou Samuelson, Connecticut
Kelsey Mitchell, Ohio State

2nd Team:
Kalani Brown, Baylor
Victoria Vivians, Mississippi State
Asia Durr, Louisville
Napheesa Collier, Connecticut
Chennedy Carter, Texas A&M (NFOY)

3rd Team:
Loryn Goodwin, Kansas State
Lexie Brown, Duke
Arike Ogunbowale, Notre Dame
Azura Stevens, Connecticut
Brooke McCarty, Texas


Updating it to now, I'd go with:
1st Team:
Aja Wilson, South Carolina (POY)
Sabrina Ionescu, Oregon
Teaira McCowan, Mississippi State
Kalani Brown, Baylor
Katie Lou Samuelson, Connecticut

2nd Team:
Victoria Vivians, Mississippi State
Kelsey Mitchell, Ohio State
Asia Durr, Louisville
Megan Gustafson, Iowa
Arike Ogunbowale, Notre Dame

3rd Team:
Kia Nurse, Connecticut
Katelynn Flaherty, Michigan
Lauren Cox, Baylor
Chennedy Carter, Texas A&M (NFOY)
Napheesa Collier, Connecticut


UCONN's other 3 players have all had nice seasons but I think there are other standouts on top teams having better seasons. I don't see the argument for putting Collier/Williams/Stevens over players like Gustafson of Flaherty.

On first team I think the 4 non-UCONN players should all be in contention for POY. KLS has missed too many games and doesn't have the numbers for POY. If she was healthy all year she'd be in the mix though.

Players like Mitchell, Gustafson, and Vivians would be 1st teamers in most other years but may have a hard time cracking 1st team.

I put Arike ahead of Nurse to rattle some feathers here but they are interchangeable at this point IMO. I have little doubt UCONN will land at least 2 on the 10 player team even if it's not what I'd pick at this point. Nurse has gotten a lot more attention on message boards and in the media than Collier or Stevens, so I think it'll be her if only 2 make a team. Chances are we'll see 3.

 

[cbraarj]

If Gabby and Pheesa could drop to 2nd team, A'J Wilson should drop to the 3rd team AA, based on last night's performances.

Aja has not had a 1st Team AA game yet against Uconn!!!

 

[cbraarj]

I agree with comment about maintaining focus on NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP!!! But we on BY always want to speculate on this stuff... IMHO... Kia Has to be in serious contention for AA 1st team.... along with Lou and I think Gabby. Gabby could possibly get some attention for NPOY, despite her low scoring average because of everything she does... it has happened in the past as I understand...with another do everything Husky. Based on the SC game, and what they have done all year, Lou and Kia showed better than the supposed front runner for the award. Just my humble opinion.

You dont have to be humble about this opinion because you are absolutely correct!

 

[cbraarj]

Kia Nurse is an absolutely wonderful player, leader and human being. She is probably the glue to this team. She certainly deserves all the recognition she gets or should get.
If AA is talking top five players in the country I don't believe she quite fits there. If it's top ten, then yes.
Her season has been amazing. She gives everything she has on both ends of the court every moment she's out there.
Her improvement from last year I believe is attributable to a few factors. She has gotten more comfortable and confident in her leadership role than she was certainly at the beginning of last year, as that was a huge step up with the three who left. She has surely improved her shooting some. But I believe the biggest change for her is having a true, quick very good point guard who knows how to run the team. It allows Kia to do and be what she does best.
I know almost none of you want to hear or see this, but offensively she has some limitations in that she can not create her own shot. That said, there are very few if any, that do come with the amazing package of things she brings.
Bronx23

Kia in 2016 won a NC after which she had hernia surgery in between training for the Rio Games and then participating in the Games itself. Started the season slow with a team that only had her as a starter for a whole season. She hardly played against SC last year because of a leg injury. She did a lot better tournament time. This year she averages double figures for a team that has 6 players ave. that. She leads the country in 3-point shooting and any guard in the country should dread it when Kia is the one guarding them! Up next Asia Durr! This year she is taking the pull up jumper more than penetrating all the way to the rim. Know what other player at Uconn who had trouble going to the rim but does it a lot better now? Maya Moore!

 

[cbraarj]

WBCA is a 10 Team list. Coaches can nominate 3 players and the nominations can start in January. The Associated Press (AP) has 3 teams of 5 -1st Team, 2nd Team and 3rd Team and they have Honorable Mention. This has been discussed numerous times on the BY. You get your name on the wall by being 1 of the 10 WBCA or 1st Team AP. If I am wrong please correct me (as I know I would be..)

That said, on Feb 3, it's pretty clear the nominations are KLS, Gabby and Kia. All due respect to Crystal Dangerfield as well as Napheesa and Z, they are a tad behind the others in their consistent presence on the floor. They each have more time to get their games in gear and I have no doubt they will, however I don't think this year will be it.

Again the main banner on the wall needs to be the 12th...

Can Uconn beat 2002 and get 6 players on Associated Press AA Teams?

 

[Bronx23]

If UCONN fans were asked who was mostly likely to be a 1st Team AA between KLS and Kia, nearly everyone would choose KLS. She can do things Kia can't because of her size, and lanky build as well, but perception is a funny thing, and it can be deceiving. I'm not disparaging KLS; I think she's great. But if you go to the UCONN website and check out stats, you might be surprised. As of today, right now, comparing just these two players, Kia has played more minutes per game, has more field goals attempted and made as well as a higher field goal % made, has more 3-pointers attempted, made and higher % made, has more assists (60 to Lou's 50), and actually more blocked shots (surprisingly, 9 to Lou's 2). Lou, on the other hand, is averaging 1.7 more points per game than Kia (surprisingly, less than a bucket a game) and 4.4 rebounds per game to Kia's 3.5 (less than a rebound more per game, again, a surprise given Lou's height). I don't think many would question that Kia is the better defensive player (I'm not knocking Lou's defense, which has certainly improved considerably over the course of the season!). So, other than physical characteristics and perception, is there really that great a statistical difference between the two players, enough to say that one deserves 1st Team AA more than the other? # of Bad Ass Awards doesn't count. This board is very stats-minded, so check out the stats for yourself. I'm not saying that Kia is the better player so Lou fans should not get their shorts twisted in a bunch. I am saying that, statistically, among UCONN players, Kia has every right to be considered for 1st Team AA selection as any other UCONN player, including KLS, at this moment in time. I rest my case. All rebuttals welcome!

I like many of your points.
But being an old school guy stats only tell part of the picture.
You are correct that Kia is the better defensive player of the two.
Offensively I'm sorry to say there is no comparison. In the SC game, KLS scored in almost every way possible. She has changed her offensive game way more than most good to great shooters ever can. She also makes Kia much better in how she opens up the floor. It's not that Kia doesn't do some of that for Lou but Kia needs that and KLS doesn't. If and when you get a Kia type defender playing her, she gets pretty much shut down. It doesn't happen partially at least because that defender is put on Lou.
Kia is having a spectacular season and again is a wonderful player, leader and person but some people here get carried with their love for her and for the team.
KLS is on the cusp or just below the three best U Conn women bb players, and we know who they are. Because of her understanding of the game, her amazing grit even though she can look like a California beach girl, her selflessness and just plain wanting to improve, she is unbelievably talented and only going to get better.
As stated earlier by someone name I can't recall now she needs to improve a few things like offensive rebounding and blocking shots. She also is still a work in progress defensively as she could move her feet better when guarding a quick, athletic player.
We are very fortunate to have them both as well as some others, but again stats only tell a partial picture.
Bronx23

 

[bballnut90]

Can Uconn beat 2002 and get 6 players on Associated Press AA Teams?

If you count HM players, then yes they should beat 2002 (and 2014). 2002 had 4 on the top 3 teams. All 6 should definitely make at least HM, the question is how many make the top 3 teams....my guess is 3, but I could see them getting 4.

 

[Bronx23]

Kia in 2016 won a NC after which she had hernia surgery in between training for the Rio Games and then participating in the Games itself. Started the season slow with a team that only had her as a starter for a whole season. She hardly played against SC last year because of a leg injury. She did a lot better tournament time. This year she averages double figures for a team that has 6 players ave. that. She leads the country in 3-point shooting and any guard in the country should dread it when Kia is the one guarding them! Up next Asia Durr! This year she is taking the pull up jumper more than penetrating all the way to the rim. Know what other player at Uconn who had trouble going to the rim but does it a lot better now? Maya Moore!

Again I can't say enough positive things about Kia but mentioning her in the same sentence as Mya, is going way overboard. Her big difference in shooting better is positioning and often getting good relatively open looks.
I think five will get at least honorable mention but unless she really picks it up the rest of the season I'm afraid Z will fall just short.
Bronx23

 

[cbraarj]

Again I can't say enough positive things about Kia but mentioning her in the same sentence as Mya, is going way overboard. Her big difference in shooting better is positioning and often getting good relatively open looks.
I think five will get at least honorable mention but unless she really picks it up the rest of the season I'm afraid Z will fall just short.
Bronx23

Mayas one weakness in college was taking people off the dribble just like Kia!

 

[HumblePie]

If UCONN fans were asked who was mostly likely to be a 1st Team AA between KLS and Kia, nearly everyone would choose KLS. She can do things Kia can't because of her size, and lanky build as well, but perception is a funny thing, and it can be deceiving. I'm not disparaging KLS; I think she's great. But if you go to the UCONN website and check out stats, you might be surprised. As of today, right now, comparing just these two players, Kia has played more minutes per game, has more field goals attempted and made as well as a higher field goal % made, has more 3-pointers attempted, made and higher % made, has more assists (60 to Lou's 50), and actually more blocked shots (surprisingly, 9 to Lou's 2). Lou, on the other hand, is averaging 1.7 more points per game than Kia (surprisingly, less than a bucket a game) and 4.4 rebounds per game to Kia's 3.5 (less than a rebound more per game, again, a surprise given Lou's height). I don't think many would question that Kia is the better defensive player (I'm not knocking Lou's defense, which has certainly improved considerably over the course of the season!). So, other than physical characteristics and perception, is there really that great a statistical difference between the two players, enough to say that one deserves 1st Team AA more than the other? # of Bad Ass Awards doesn't count. This board is very stats-minded, so check out the stats for yourself. I'm not saying that Kia is the better player so Lou fans should not get their shorts twisted in a bunch. I am saying that, statistically, among UCONN players, Kia has every right to be considered for 1st Team AA selection as any other UCONN player, including KLS, at this moment in time. I rest my case. All rebuttals welcome!

Stats alone rarely tell a complete story. There's an old adage which says, figures don't lie, but liar's can figure. No, I'm most certainly not calling you a liar. What I'm saying is that many hidden factors need to be taken into account that don't ever show up in stats. The HUGE factor you've completely overlooked IS, what Husky do the opposing coaches and players fear the most and devise plans to stop? Without question it's Katie Lou Samuelson. Why is this so important when doing a player comparison? Because if it was the other way around Kia wouldn't be getting all those completely wide open 3s, many of which are setup by an assist from KLS. That btw, can't be said in reverse. As it stands now, both are and will be first team All-Americans with Lou in the running for NPOY.

 

[Bronx23]

Stats alone rarely tell a complete story. There's an old adage which says, figures don't lie, but liar's can figure. No, I'm most certainly not calling you a liar. What I'm saying is that many hidden factors need to be taken into account that don't ever show up in stats. The HUGE factor you've completely overlooked IS, what Husky do the opposing coaches and players fear the most and devise plans to stop? Without question it's Katie Lou Samuelson. Why is this so important when doing a player comparison? Because if it was the other way around Kia wouldn't be getting all those completely wide open 3s, many of which are setup by an assist from KLS. That btw, can't be said in reverse. As it stands now, both are and will be first team All-Americans with Lou in the running for NPOY.

Agree with what you're saying
completely.
Going back to AA candidates a name that's missing is McPhee from Stanford. Had an amazing game last
night!
Bronx23

 

[Lynx23]

Interesting replies to my original post. Certainly some very passionate KLS fans. Whatever....none of us are determining who makes AA and who doesn't. One thing I most definitely agree with is that stats don't tell the whole story., regardless of the fact that I used stats in my comparison of KLS and Kia. OK, I admit I wasn't feeling well at the time. Since we agree that stats don't tell the whole story then I'm sure you will agree with me that stats don't tell Kia's whole story any more than they do KLS's. In the past we've spoken more about Kia's intangibles. it just so happens this year we can add some better numbers to them. In closing, those of you who felt my intent was to disparage KLS in some way to elevate Kia couldn't be more mistaken; I don't think that way and never have. Now go watch the Super Bowl or find something better to do with your time than reply to this post.

 

[easttexastrash]

Who is on the 5-player AA team?

I’m going with the following.
Brown
Wilson
Inoescu
Mitchell
?

 

[easttexastrash]

I made a midseason list about a month ago which had:
1st Team:
Aja Wilson, South Carolina (POY)
Sabrina Ionescu, Oregon
Teaira McCowan, Mississippi State
Katie Lou Samuelson, Connecticut
Kelsey Mitchell, Ohio State

2nd Team:
Kalani Brown, Baylor
Victoria Vivians, Mississippi State
Asia Durr, Louisville
Napheesa Collier, Connecticut
Chennedy Carter, Texas A&M (NFOY)

3rd Team:
Loryn Goodwin, Kansas State
Lexie Brown, Duke
Arike Ogunbowale, Notre Dame
Azura Stevens, Connecticut
Brooke McCarty, Texas


Updating it to now, I'd go with:
1st Team:
Aja Wilson, South Carolina (POY)
Sabrina Ionescu, Oregon
Teaira McCowan, Mississippi State
Kalani Brown, Baylor
Katie Lou Samuelson, Connecticut

2nd Team:
Victoria Vivians, Mississippi State
Kelsey Mitchell, Ohio State
Asia Durr, Louisville
Megan Gustafson, Iowa
Arike Ogunbowale, Notre Dame

3rd Team:
Kia Nurse, Connecticut
Katelynn Flaherty, Michigan
Lauren Cox, Baylor
Chennedy Carter, Texas A&M (NFOY)
Napheesa Collier, Connecticut


UCONN's other 3 players have all had nice seasons but I think there are other standouts on top teams having better seasons. I don't see the argument for putting Collier/Williams/Stevens over players like Gustafson of Flaherty.

On first team I think the 4 non-UCONN players should all be in contention for POY. KLS has missed too many games and doesn't have the numbers for POY. If she was healthy all year she'd be in the mix though.

Players like Mitchell, Gustafson, and Vivians would be 1st teamers in most other years but may have a hard time cracking 1st team.

I put Arike ahead of Nurse to rattle some feathers here but they are interchangeable at this point IMO. I have little doubt UCONN will land at least 2 on the 10 player team even if it's not what I'd pick at this point. Nurse has gotten a lot more attention on message boards and in the media than Collier or Stevens, so I think it'll be her if only 2 make a team. Chances are we'll see 3.

I’ve watched Carter several times and although the talent is there she makes too many bad decisions for me to put her in the top 15, although I think next season she will be contesting for first team. IMO she needs a full season under her belt to be on my list.

 

[MSSportsGuy]

I have always paid more attention to the 10 team WBCA squad. It's tough to narrow any list of top players to 5 and while the AP does it, the 10 team squad is chosen by coaches and seems to mean more. My list in no real order

Wilson
Mitchell
Williams
KLS
Nurse
Durr
Brown
Vivians
McGowan
Ionescu

I do realize this leaves off a ton of players who are having outstanding seasons. We all know CD, Collier and AZ are capable of leading the team on any given night in any category but the limit is 3 and the 3 UConn players I listed have been the more consistent this season. Flaherty and Ogunbalwe have had excellent seasons and just missed the cut. Maybe I am a bit of a homer to put both McGowan and Vivians on the team but if MSU keeps winning and they keep up their numbers, hard to deny they belong.

 

[connie]

The nation's best perimeter shooter and best perimeter defender are the same person, playing on the nation's best team. If that doesn't rate first team All-America accolades what does?

AA? Hell, why not NPOY?

 

[ucbart]

I don’t think Kelsey Mitchell belongs on a 10-player AA team. She scores. But she is a volume shooter....and that’s all she does. Period.

My 5 player AA team is:
Brown
Lou
Nurse
Durr
Wilson

 

[Bronx23]

Interesting replies to my original post. Certainly some very passionate KLS fans. Whatever....none of us are determining who makes AA and who doesn't. One thing I most definitely agree with is that stats don't tell the whole story., regardless of the fact that I used stats in my comparison of KLS and Kia. OK, I admit I wasn't feeling well at the time. Since we agree that stats don't tell the whole story then I'm sure you will agree with me that stats don't tell Kia's whole story any more than they do KLS's. In the past we've spoken more about Kia's intangibles. it just so happens this year we can add some better numbers to them. In closing, those of you who felt my intent was to disparage KLS in some way to elevate Kia couldn't be more mistaken; I don't think that way and never have. Now go watch the Super Bowl or find something better to do with your time than reply to this post.

I didn't think you were disparaging KLS at all, nor was I doing that regarding Kia.
And yes, you are absolutely correct that intangibles are an enormous factor and both players have them in abundance.
Kia is a unique young woman who brings and has brought so much to the team. Her leadership is outstanding and is some ways she is a model for KLS (and others). Next year KLS will have to fill those shoes and has begun that process already.
Love watching and listening to both of them on the court and off.
I just think KLS is becoming a great balanced player who if it wasn't for her injuries and time off, might well be NPOY.
Also the best part of watching this team and this program is truly great players put the team and its needs before their own.
Bronx23

 

[Los24]

I didn't think you were disparaging KLS at all, nor was I doing that regarding Kia.
And yes, you are absolutely correct that intangibles are an enormous factor and both players have them in abundance.
Kia is a unique young woman who brings and has brought so much to the team. Her leadership is outstanding and is some ways she is a model for KLS (and others). Next year KLS will have to fill those shoes and has begun that process already.
Love watching and listening to both of them on the court and off.
I just think KLS is becoming a great balanced player who if it wasn't for her injuries and time off, might well be NPOY.
Also the best part of watching this team and this program is truly great players put the team and its needs before their own.
Bronx23

Trying to be unbias and recognizing that I do not watch nearly enough non-UConn games to appreciate all that other players bring to their teams, Kia is on the cusp, right on the edge. For only 5 player team I think Lou and Gabby are in. Aja would be added so that makes 3, and despite how she plays against us, she is a great college player that did lead her team to a championship. I do not see how you can keep Asia Durr off either.

Then that is one spot, or 6 spots for the team of 10, with players you need to question are better such as Sabrina Ionescu, Teaira McCowan, Kalani Brown, Lexie Brown, etc... even our own Pheesa which I would not be as quick as many to discount. Pheesa was AA last year and that carries weight. Also, you would be hard pressed to find a player with her skill set and diversity.

Bottom line as a UConn fan I believe that Kia has a strong case. She has good stats but also passes the eye test for being a top college player. I also think that Z does not even come close to deserving a spot. It's not about potential, skills or a couple big spots during the season. There are to many far deserving players that have consistently contributed throughout the season. Crystal Dangerfield has improved from last year and is making strides but to me is not at this level ...yet.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

People who say Gabby is having a bad season don't understand basketball. She effects the game in every way. I was watching yesterday as the Cincy's Point would use picks to get a switch, and it was comical because getting a switch from Kia to Gabby is a worse situation for the person with the ball. She is the point of Defense, and the offense works best when it goes through her. She is the best passer.......her outlet passes are a thing of beauty. She can hit a streaking teammate the way Bird, Lebron, and Rodman could. I think she scored more last year, but this team doesn't need more scoring from her on most nights. She is the straw that stirs the drink. It isn't all about scoring.

 

[wallman]

Who is on the 5-player AA team?

I’m going with the following.
Brown
Wilson
Inoescu
Mitchell
?

Three of those players will have to show they can help their team get to the success of a top 4 team, therefore Mitchell would be out of the top 5 at least, it appears Oregon are overrated so I would drop Ionescu and neither play defense. Brown is interesting as due to Baylors weak OOC scheduling they are not being considered in the top group yet and will need to win outright in conference and tournament, plus Brown just stands on the block and receives passes from her team but does alter shots on the defensive end. Only time will show if Brown can compete against top competition this year but the question is when.

 

[HumblePie]

Three of those players will have to show they can help their team get to the success of a top 4 team, therefore Mitchell would be out of the top 5 at least, it appears Oregon are overrated so I would drop Ionescu and neither play defense. Brown is interesting as due to Baylors weak OOC scheduling they are not being considered in the top group yet and will need to win outright in conference and tournament, plus Brown just stands on the block and receives passes from her team but does alter shots on the defensive end. Only time will show if Brown can compete against top competition this year but the question is when.

I don't necessarily disagree with your player assessments, but you do overlook the fact that All-American is an individual, not a team award.

 

[bballnut90]

I have always paid more attention to the 10 team WBCA squad. It's tough to narrow any list of top players to 5 and while the AP does it, the 10 team squad is chosen by coaches and seems to mean more. My list in no real order

Wilson
Mitchell
Williams
KLS
Nurse
Durr
Brown
Vivians
McGowan
Ionescu

I do realize this leaves off a ton of players who are having outstanding seasons. We all know CD, Collier and AZ are capable of leading the team on any given night in any category but the limit is 3 and the 3 UConn players I listed have been the more consistent this season. Flaherty and Ogunbalwe have had excellent seasons and just missed the cut. Maybe I am a bit of a homer to put both McGowan and Vivians on the team but if MSU keeps winning and they keep up their numbers, hard to deny they belong.

You're not being a homer at all. Mississippi State is undefeated and both McCowan and Vivians are having POY worthy seasons. Both should be locks for the 10 man team.

 

[bballnut90]

Trying to be unbias and recognizing that I do not watch nearly enough non-UConn games to appreciate all that other players bring to their teams, Kia is on the cusp, right on the edge. For only 5 player team I think Lou and Gabby are in. Aja would be added so that makes 3, and despite how she plays against us, she is a great college player that did lead her team to a championship. I do not see how you can keep Asia Durr off either.

Then that is one spot, or 6 spots for the team of 10, with players you need to question are better such as Sabrina Ionescu, Teaira McCowan, Kalani Brown, Lexie Brown, etc... even our own Pheesa which I would not be as quick as many to discount. Pheesa was AA last year and that carries weight. Also, you would be hard pressed to find a player with her skill set and diversity.

Bottom line as a UConn fan I believe that Kia has a strong case. She has good stats but also passes the eye test for being a top college player. I also think that Z does not even come close to deserving a spot. It's not about potential, skills or a couple big spots during the season. There are to many far deserving players that have consistently contributed throughout the season. Crystal Dangerfield has improved from last year and is making strides but to me is not at this level ...yet.

Gabby isn't going to make the 5 player team. She's struggled with consistency and overall hasn't been as impactful as she was a year ago, when she made 2nd team. She does a lot of things well and should be a high draft pick, but she's 6th on her team in scoring and isn't a 1st teamer this year. If any team is getting two, it's Mississippi State with Vivians and McCowan. Both are in the mix for POY IMO.

At this point, I think McCowan, Brown, Wilson and Ionescu should be 1st team locks ahead of anyone on UCONN. KLS is the only one who is in the mix for 1st team IMO, and Nurse is in the mix for 2nd team. Maybe Williams, too, since she is such a unique player. Anyone else on UCONN could sneak on to 3rd team.

You should take some time and watch other players and also research how they're doing. This is a year where there are a lot of really strong players having standout seasons. Teaira McCowan and Kalani Brown are the most dominant centers we've seen since Griner, Ionescu does everything well and her all around game is unlike any player who has come through women's basketball, and Wilson is dominating everyone besides UCONN. Other players like Durr, Ogunbowale, Vivians, L. Brown, Flaherty, Gustafson, Mitchell, Carter, etc. are having MONSTER years too (20-25ppg with good to great percentages) and these players are still putting up big numbers in conference play. Then there are a slew of other really good players who are having fantastic seasons like Cox, Hebard, McPhee, Russell, Hines-Allen, Charles, Goodwin, Canada, etc.

 

[Los24]

Gabby isn't going to make the 5 player team. She's struggled with consistency and overall hasn't been as impactful as she was a year ago, when she made 2nd team. She does a lot of things well and should be a high draft pick, but she's 6th on her team in scoring and isn't a 1st teamer this year. If any team is getting two, it's Mississippi State with Vivians and McCowan. Both are in the mix for POY IMO.

At this point, I think McCowan, Brown, Wilson and Ionescu should be 1st team locks ahead of anyone on UCONN. KLS is the only one who is in the mix for 1st team IMO, and Nurse is in the mix for 2nd team. Maybe Williams, too, since she is such a unique player. Anyone else on UCONN could sneak on to 3rd team.

You should take some time and watch other players and also research how they're doing. This is a year where there are a lot of really strong players having standout seasons. Teaira McCowan and Kalani Brown are the most dominant centers we've seen since Griner, Ionescu does everything well and her all around game is unlike any player who has come through women's basketball, and Wilson is dominating everyone besides UCONN. Other players like Durr, Ogunbowale, Vivians, L. Brown, Flaherty, Gustafson, Mitchell, Carter, etc. are having MONSTER years too (20-25ppg with good to great percentages) and these players are still putting up big numbers in conference play. Then there are a slew of other really good players who are having fantastic seasons like Cox, Hebard, McPhee, Russell, Hines-Allen, Charles, Goodwin, Canada, etc.

Thanks for your reply and input. I think you are supporting my point about what a strong field there is and we need to realize there are also many deserving and talented players that do not go to UConn.

I stated Kia is on the cusp but I do not feel is 1st team only because she is not an individual standout player. In someways its unfair but if your a voter you see how many times she scores on open layups and wide open 3s. Is it because she is in a great system and surrounded by other great players that makes more of her success than her own greatness? BYers I believe have a harder time distinguishing. Obviously she is a very good defender and her 3pt shooting is great. However, when I see Durr or Sabrina Ionescu they are doing it with the opposition on them but still creating. That said its not Kia's fault she made a better choice about which program to join : - )

Regarding Gabby I have to say that the MSST game really made me turn the corner on how good she really is... Gabby is the only reason we had a chance to win (Lou also was impactful but to lesser degree.) I have heard many times you need to see her in person to appreciate her true impact and performance. I always knocked her, and rightfully so, for not being able to consistently hit open shots outside the paint. Her only real offensive move is to go to the glass or putting back an offensive rebound. But .... greatness is value, significance and to inspire. When you take the other areas she is able to contribute and the way she is able to change a game, its incredible. The fact that you can not just close her down because of the way she does contribute makes her even more unique and harder to contain. UConn often is able to take away the best, and many times top 2, opposing players. How do you game plan to shutdown Gabby? Best I have seen is leave her open and hope she misses 15ft jumper.

All that to say (1) I can see your points and believe that has an actual higher probability of happening, (2) I still hold out hope that Gabby will be first team because she deserves it and (3) I would watch more of other teams if I had time but do try to grab some parts of games.

 

[nwhoopfan]

Then there are a slew of other really good players who are having fantastic seasons like Cox, Hebard, McPhee, Russell, Hines-Allen, Charles, Goodwin, Canada, etc.

Good list, one other Pac 12 player I would add that has been consistently good throughout the season is Gulich.

 

[DallasBUFan]

Three of those players will have to show they can help their team get to the success of a top 4 team, therefore Mitchell would be out of the top 5 at least, it appears Oregon are overrated so I would drop Ionescu and neither play defense. Brown is interesting as due to Baylors weak OOC scheduling they are not being considered in the top group yet and will need to win outright in conference and tournament, plus Brown just stands on the block and receives passes from her team but does alter shots on the defensive end. Only time will show if Brown can compete against top competition this year but the question is when.

Look at her stats vs McCowan last year. http://www.baylorbears.com/gametrac...ool=bay&sport=wbaskbl&camefrom=&startschool=&

Kalani's team have nothing to do with this. You say she needs to face better teams, yet to date they have played - Stanford, Texas, West Virginia, and OKST all ranked currently.
Also, even in the lost to UCLA she posted over 30 pts. Even in the big loss last year she still shut down McCowan and played like an AA and she has all season long.
If she plays like a AA then she deserves it. Basing it on the teams results is idiotic.

 

[MSGRET]

Kia has played 5 more games, you have to adjust the numbers to a per game average.

If you do that, KLS has more FG and FGA per game, more assists per game and fewer TO per game. Kia only beats her with percentages, 3pt FG/FGA and blocks.

KLS has played limited minutes in several games due to injuries, so the MPG would be about the same if she was healthy. She played just 15 minutes before getting injured against Cal, 28 vs. Notre Dame, and 15 vs. Tulsa.

Statistically, KLS is ahead, and she's also performing better against better competition than Kia is. Nurse had a big game against SC, but so did KLS, and KLS had great games against Texas and Notre Dame too. Aside from the SC game, Kia's best showings have been against Nevada, Michigan State, and Temple.

Stats say KLS>Nurse, and eye test does too.

Actually it is closer to 6 games, because if I remember correctly Lou went out in two of her starts with less than 15 minutes in one and 20 minutes in the other. Both were because of injuries, the Cal game and the Tulsa game. She only scored a total of 15 points in the two games combined.

 

[bballnut90]

Actually it is closer to 6 games, because if I remember correctly Lou went out in two of her starts with less than 15 minutes in one and 20 minutes in the other. Both were because of injuries, the Cal game and the Tulsa game. She only scored a total of 15 points in the two games combined.

Agreed. I mentioned the limited minutes in other games. She also sat in the 2nd half against Notre Dame...if she was healthy she would've been out there a full 40.

 

[bballnut90]

Thanks for your reply and input. I think you are supporting my point about what a strong field there is and we need to realize there are also many deserving and talented players that do not go to UConn.

I stated Kia is on the cusp but I do not feel is 1st team only because she is not an individual standout player. In someways its unfair but if your a voter you see how many times she scores on open layups and wide open 3s. Is it because she is in a great system and surrounded by other great players that makes more of her success than her own greatness? BYers I believe have a harder time distinguishing. Obviously she is a very good defender and her 3pt shooting is great. However, when I see Durr or Sabrina Ionescu they are doing it with the opposition on them but still creating. That said its not Kia's fault she made a better choice about which program to join : - )

Regarding Gabby I have to say that the MSST game really made me turn the corner on how good she really is... Gabby is the only reason we had a chance to win (Lou also was impactful but to lesser degree.) I have heard many times you need to see her in person to appreciate her true impact and performance. I always knocked her, and rightfully so, for not being able to consistently hit open shots outside the paint. Her only real offensive move is to go to the glass or putting back an offensive rebound. But .... greatness is value, significance and to inspire. When you take the other areas she is able to contribute and the way she is able to change a game, its incredible. The fact that you can not just close her down because of the way she does contribute makes her even more unique and harder to contain. UConn often is able to take away the best, and many times top 2, opposing players. How do you game plan to shutdown Gabby? Best I have seen is leave her open and hope she misses 15ft jumper.

All that to say (1) I can see your points and believe that has an actual higher probability of happening, (2) I still hold out hope that Gabby will be first team because she deserves it and (3) I would watch more of other teams if I had time but do try to grab some parts of games.

Agreed in regards to Nurse. She's not nearly as dynamic offensively as most players on the list--offensively she primarily roams around on the perimeter, takes catch and shoot open looks, hits breakaway layups and sets picks. No dribble penetration, attacking the glass or creating for others. She's not a player who is going to take the last shot in the game unless you draw up a play for her to get an open look. She has a very defined role at UCONN, so you can't fault her for the lack of creativity, but at the same time she doesn't stand out like a lot of players. In her favor, she is extremely efficient and is also a very strong defender, so I think she should be an AA this year, but she's not 1st team material.

Skill wise, Gabby Williams is absolutely a 1st team All American. She does everything well besides shooting perimeter shots. Great ball handling, aggressive rebounding, finishes inside, can hit shots 15 feet and in, creates for others, has good vision, etc. Not to mention she is a world class athlete and defender. However, she has been streaky all year. She's had some very good games, but she's also disappeared in several, and there are far more than 5 players in women's basketball having better seasons than Gabby at this point which is why I don't think she should be on 1st team, or 2nd team for that matter.