Penfield
a.k.a PencilForest
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A Dime Back: Firing Kevin Ollie Will Not Fix UConn’s Biggest Problem
- Thread starter Penfield
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It's a very well written article, even if I don't agree with much of what you said. I think it's a bit of an apologia for KO, but it's a good article.
1. recruiting - KO brought in a top ten class a year ago that didn't seem hampered by the conference we're in. Even if we do lose some recruits due to the conference, which I'm sure happens, on paper we've had as much if not more talent the last few years than anyone else in the conference.
2. the perception of the conference is definitely going up, as evidenced by the committee handing Cinci a nice projected seed the other day. I don't think the AAC will ever come close to the old big east, but it will get 2-4 or 5 bids consistently going forward. Wouldn't be a problem if UConn could actually win the league, or at least challenge for the regular season title
3. the travel thing is an interesting point but really, do we think it makes that much of a difference?
Joining the new big east in basketball only is a no brainer, but that's unlikely to happen. Again, like the article and I think it's very well researched. Good job
1. recruiting - KO brought in a top ten class a year ago that didn't seem hampered by the conference we're in. Even if we do lose some recruits due to the conference, which I'm sure happens, on paper we've had as much if not more talent the last few years than anyone else in the conference.
2. the perception of the conference is definitely going up, as evidenced by the committee handing Cinci a nice projected seed the other day. I don't think the AAC will ever come close to the old big east, but it will get 2-4 or 5 bids consistently going forward. Wouldn't be a problem if UConn could actually win the league, or at least challenge for the regular season title
3. the travel thing is an interesting point but really, do we think it makes that much of a difference?
Joining the new big east in basketball only is a no brainer, but that's unlikely to happen. Again, like the article and I think it's very well researched. Good job
intlzncster
i fart in your general direction
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New angle.
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Traveling so much hurts these kids. But is it any different than traveling to Indiana, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Omaha, Nebraska?
1. I suppose we're talking about # of games. 7 games outside the range (9-2 Cincy and Temple) versus 4 games. So, the discussion is really about a long trip for 3 extra games. Never mind the fact that in the ACC or B1G things would be just as bad.
2. Perception. Yes, this is the largest problem, and conceivably UConn would be helped by the BE.
3. Perception 2: the BE is doing great. Fox Sports ratings are abysmal. No one watches the BE. Is that good for perception?
4. BE money at $3.8m is not that different from AAC money, AAC money might take a jump this year. One thing he leaves out in his calculation is the playoff football and bowl money. It is $2 or 3m per school.
5. Recruiting. It is harder in the AAC. But I couldn't understand the geographic arguments. UConn needs to pull recruits from its region. The best recruits it can. But is the argument that Boston and NYC kids insist on playing in the BE? I don't think so. They want a path to the NBA. I really don't think that games against BE teams on Fox Sports will be the thing that jazzes them up.
6. What he doesn't mention: the threat of a P5 split that leaves the G5 and the BE behind.
1. I suppose we're talking about # of games. 7 games outside the range (9-2 Cincy and Temple) versus 4 games. So, the discussion is really about a long trip for 3 extra games. Never mind the fact that in the ACC or B1G things would be just as bad.
2. Perception. Yes, this is the largest problem, and conceivably UConn would be helped by the BE.
3. Perception 2: the BE is doing great. Fox Sports ratings are abysmal. No one watches the BE. Is that good for perception?
4. BE money at $3.8m is not that different from AAC money, AAC money might take a jump this year. One thing he leaves out in his calculation is the playoff football and bowl money. It is $2 or 3m per school.
5. Recruiting. It is harder in the AAC. But I couldn't understand the geographic arguments. UConn needs to pull recruits from its region. The best recruits it can. But is the argument that Boston and NYC kids insist on playing in the BE? I don't think so. They want a path to the NBA. I really don't think that games against BE teams on Fox Sports will be the thing that jazzes them up.
6. What he doesn't mention: the threat of a P5 split that leaves the G5 and the BE behind.
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Yes, as No Escalators outlines in the article it would still result in far less overall travel. Not to mention four opponents would be bus rides, whereas one is now. Also, most flying would be to play in recruiting hotbeds such as Chicago, DC, and Indiana, as opposed to basketball recruiting deserts like Tulsa, Greenville, and Wichita. Even the big cities in the AAC - Dallas, Houston, NOLA, Tampa, and Orlando - don't hold a candle to NYC, DC, Chicagoland in terms of available basketball recruits. Obviously, Philly is a wash though we'd be playing Villanova in the NBA arena each year as opposed to Temple's dimly-lit bunker.
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Literally every time this argument is made, you can counter with “why aren’t we winning if we have the highest ranked recruits in the conference?”
And it never gets answered.
And it never gets answered.
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What take? Did you actually read the article? He doesn't make an argument in either direction on keeping/firing Ollie. The argument is even if Ollie WAS winning, being in the AAC limits the amount of winning on a national scale that can be done.
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Taking his entire schtick into account, it's actually pretty obvious.
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Well written article. The conference complaint is a weak argument. It is probably a factor but not to the degree you claim. And return to the Big East? Obviously not a football fan. That discussion is also old and “saves” only basketball.
Penfield
a.k.a PencilForest
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Before this season I would have agreed. ADB has definitely stopped apologizing for him, and No Escalators does it a lot less
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Again, did you actually read the article? This supposedly obvious argument that KO isn't the problem doesn't exist there.
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Hmm, maybe I just missed the shift then. Definitely possible.
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Actually being in the American doesn't hurt the program at all. UConn hurts UConn.
It's a 3-5 bid league with UConn not helping at all.
If UConn or Memphis contributed an extra bid to that group, the perception of the conference would be near or par with the Catholic league.
Bottom line: We have the league schedule we need to go as far as UConn has been in the past. It's become a silly debate.
haha my mistake, thank you for posting it regardless. In depth analysis is always welcome
Rico444
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This is wrong. He lays it out with numbers and everything if you want to check out the article.
The American is a mid-major league, and the Big East has been one of the top leagues in the country each of the last few years. There's really no comparing the two,
Marat
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Again very well written article.
Does it imply that if we remained in the New Big East, we would making the NCAA tournament yearly due to better recruits? I would love for UConn to return to the New Big East, but can also envision continued struggles albeit slightly better recruits. To me its all of the above : not just players, league but also the coaching.
Does it imply that if we remained in the New Big East, we would making the NCAA tournament yearly due to better recruits? I would love for UConn to return to the New Big East, but can also envision continued struggles albeit slightly better recruits. To me its all of the above : not just players, league but also the coaching.
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There was also a Sporting News article published today that's a good companion piece to the one from A Dime Back: The gradual extinction of terrible teams in major conferences has 'evolutionized' 2017-18 season
ConnHuskBask
Shut Em Down!
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"And, there is, of course, the 2014 National Championship. Wave it away if you want, but you will never convince me a man who won the NCAA Tournament — beating a 1, 2, 3, and 4 seed along the way — somehow forgot how to coach a basketball team."
What's the other argument then - he never could coach? Because he sure as hell isn't the same coach as he was then.
Also, lmao at the notion of UConn football not being able to compete for a national title. That was never on the table in the Big East either, but it didn't detract from having a program.
Ultimately, as much as it pains me, I think the school is going to no longer be able to justify the subsidy and cut football, along with a lot of other non revenue sports and drop down into the Big East - which make no mistake - is where we will be when the P5 leagues breakaway and have their own March Madness.
What's the other argument then - he never could coach? Because he sure as hell isn't the same coach as he was then.
Also, lmao at the notion of UConn football not being able to compete for a national title. That was never on the table in the Big East either, but it didn't detract from having a program.
Ultimately, as much as it pains me, I think the school is going to no longer be able to justify the subsidy and cut football, along with a lot of other non revenue sports and drop down into the Big East - which make no mistake - is where we will be when the P5 leagues breakaway and have their own March Madness.
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Interesting. This probably contributes to the increase in transfers we see today once kids realize they won't be able to get any minutes.