#4 South Carolina @ #21 Mississippi St - 1/28/21

[visitingcock]

First time I have been satisfied with SCar’s FT shooting this year

 

[JDuro]

 

[GoDawgs4]

COVID did not cause this. Our coach has taken a Final Four type roster/team and turned them into a bottom 75-100 or worse team. We may end up as a Quad 4 win for our opponents before the year is over.

 

[jumpstart]

COVID did not cause this. Our coach has taken a Final Four type roster/team and turned them into a bottom 75-100 or worse team. We may end up as a Quad 4 win for our opponents before the year is over.

Year one is always a transition year with a new staff. McCray has to put her stamp on things and she is not a Vic disciple so her way will be more of the "Dawn way". I don't think she has Dawn's passion but that could change as the season wears on. I hate to see fans write off a coach or a team in transition. It's not what it seems at the moment, as things move forward.

 

[Creature]

Just waiting for this team to gel, so far we have not looked good on either offense or defense. We have the horses but our jockey seems to have no influence on the team. What a difference a coach can mean both positively or negatively. Our coach needs to become more involved during the game, she needs to motivate these kids!

Not trying to inflame but Coach Schaefer lost a Natl. Championship to this team (2017) and has only recorded two victories against Coach Staley. Comparing the previous coach to the new coach is a dubious argument at best since Coach Vic did not have any success against Coach Staley either. I just know your new Coach is one of the 10 best TN Women basketball players of all time at Tenn, an Olympic Gold Medalist,WNBA Champ and she built the current SC juggernaut.

She needs time just like you all gave Vic when he went 13-17 year one and 22-14 year two. UGA has given Joni Taylor time and that program was more established than either SCar or Miss. St. Please help me understand why your year 1 expectation from her is different than Vic's year one expectation ? I will hang up and listen

 

[HuskyMJ]

Not trying to inflame but Coach Schaefer lost a Natl. Championship to this team (2017) and has only recorded two victories against Coach Staley. Comparing the previous coach to the new coach is a dubious argument at best since Coach Vic did not have any success against Coach Staley either. I just know your new Coach is one of the 10 best TN Women basketball players of all time at Tenn, an Olympic Gold Medalist,WNBA Champ and she built the current SC juggernaut.

She needs time just like you all gave Vic when he went 13-17 year one and 22-14 year two. UGA has given Joni Taylor time and that program was more established than either SCar or Miss. St. Please help me understand why your year 1 expectation from her is different than Vic's year one expectation ? I will hang up and listen

Vic's record vs. one coach is beyond the point. He built Mississippi State into a really good program. Who else at Mississippi State won SEC championship ever? or SEC tournament? Or Elite 8 and Final 4? He put the program at another level.

And Nikki's playing accolades like 10 best TN players and stuff is also not that relevant. I think about the Houston Comets stars, did playing accolades do much for Cynthia Cooper, Sheryl Swoopes, or Tina Thompson? Playing and coaching are so different.

Vic inherited a bad program, McCray-Penson inherited a nationally ranked program with returning players everyone was high on and had some big recruits coming in. Other than the fact that she coached at SC, please help me understand why you want to hold her to very low standards when we all know she is taking over much better program than Vic did.

 

[GoDawgs4]

COVID did not cause this. Our coach has taken a Final Four type roster/team and turned them into a Quad 4 win for our opponents. We will not even make the tournament this year. It is understandable that there will be some transition pains with a new coach but when the team is playing no heart or effort something is badly wrong. I have no problem with missing shots, making mistakes, etc. All those things happen in basketball but when the effort is lackadaisical, that is when a team loses me as a fan.

 

[jumpstart]

Vic's record vs. one coach is beyond the point. He built Mississippi State into a really good program. Who else at Mississippi State won SEC championship ever? or SEC tournament? Or Elite 8 and Final 4? He put the program at another level.

And Nikki's playing accolades like 10 best TN players and stuff is also not that relevant. I think about the Houston Comets stars, did playing accolades do much for Cynthia Cooper, Sheryl Swoopes, or Tina Thompson? Playing and coaching are so different.

Vic inherited a bad program, McCray-Penson inherited a nationally ranked program with returning players everyone was high on and had some big recruits coming in. Other than the fact that she coached at SC, please help me understand why you want to hold her to very low standards when we all know she is taking over much better program than Vic did.

While it is true that she inherited a better talent base, that does not mean that Vic would have not had the same 'transition' problems with a much more talented team that he did not recruit for what his style of basketball was. That is speculation that the problem lies with her because of the talent and not with the players not being able to run her type of offense. I think in year three this conversation matters...but for now...it's not a true measurement of what she may be capable of.

 

[HuskyMJ]

While it is true that she inherited a better talent base, that does not mean that Vic would have not had the same 'transition' problems with a much more talented team that he did not recruit for what his style of basketball was. That is speculation that the problem lies with her because of the talent and not with the players not being able to run her type of offense. I think in year three this conversation matters...but for now...it's not a true measurement of what she may be capable of.

Well that is a debate you hear about often. Should a coach be rigid in the systems they run, or should they adapt their systems to fit their personnel best? Sometimes when coaches inherit bad teams it is great reason to run their systems because the team would probably be bad no matter what, so you may as well get them acclimated now. When you get a job like Mississippi State which had a lot of returning players with talent, it is fair question to ask whether you insert your preferred systems right away or do you gradually do it and maybe play a little differently to take advantage of the strengths of your roster.

You can blame the players for not running her offense well but in college I tend to look at coach over players because coaches get paid well, college players are not professionals. If a system is not being run well it is valid question to ask why you should be rigid in running it maybe until you get your preferred players on campus. Also, some of NMPs own recruits, not the ones Vic signed, barely play. Caterrion Thompson the grad transfer only played 3 minutes last night. Charlotte Kohl didn't play, and KNisha Godfrey a high schooler who just enrolled early played 4 minutes, but not playing big minutes like the guard at Oregon State or some other of the high school enrolees. So you could surmise Vic's players are still her best options over the players she has brought in in a short recruiting cycle.

 

[Creature]

Vic's record vs. one coach is beyond the point. He built Mississippi State into a really good program. Who else at Mississippi State won SEC championship ever? or SEC tournament? Or Elite 8 and Final 4? He put the program at another level.

And Nikki's playing accolades like 10 best TN players and stuff is also not that relevant. I think about the Houston Comets stars, did playing accolades do much for Cynthia Cooper, Sheryl Swoopes, or Tina Thompson? Playing and coaching are so different.

Vic inherited a bad program, McCray-Penson inherited a nationally ranked program with returning players everyone was high on and had some big recruits coming in. Other than the fact that she coached at SC, please help me understand why you want to hold her to very low standards when we all know she is taking over much better program than Vic did.

Rickea was your first McDonalds AA until Madison Hayes this year. This notion that Vic left the program stacked is a misnomer in my humble opinion. Coaivey at Notre inherited a program with more accolades and accomplishements at Notre Dame I dare say and she is going through struggles this year... I am not holding her to low standards but perhaps Hail State fans are holding up a standard that does not exist. 1 Sec regular Season title,1 Sec Tourney, 2 FF and 2 Natl. title Game losses. Coach Vic did not reach this standard until year 5. Coach Nikki is in year one is all that I am saying-be realistic.

 

[Creature]

Well that is a debate you hear about often. Should a coach be rigid in the systems they run, or should they adapt their systems to fit their personnel best? Sometimes when coaches inherit bad teams it is great reason to run their systems because the team would probably be bad no matter what, so you may as well get them acclimated now. When you get a job like Mississippi State which had a lot of returning players with talent, it is fair question to ask whether you insert your preferred systems right away or do you gradually do it and maybe play a little differently to take advantage of the strengths of your roster.

You can blame the players for not running her offense well but in college I tend to look at coach over players because coaches get paid well, college players are not professionals. If a system is not being run well it is valid question to ask why you should be rigid in running it maybe until you get your preferred players on campus. Also, some of NMPs own recruits, not the ones Vic signed, barely play. Caterrion Thompson the grad transfer only played 3 minutes last night. Charlotte Kohl didn't play, and KNisha Godfrey a high schooler who just enrolled early played 4 minutes, but not playing big minutes like the guard at Oregon State or some other of the high school enrolees. So you could surmise Vic's players are still her best options over the players she has brought in in a short recruiting cycle.

While it is true that she inherited a better talent base, that does not mean that Vic would have not had the same 'transition' problems with a much more talented team that he did not recruit for what his style of basketball was. That is speculation that the problem lies with her because of the talent and not with the players not being able to run her type of offense. I think in year three this conversation matters...but for now...it's not a true measurement of what she may be capable of.

From what I see its the same Dribble drive offense that Vic ran. The difference is that this is not his defense. She also has done a huge favor for Jessica Carter-giving her a WNBA face up game and a work in progress back to the basket post up game..

 

[HuskyMJ]

Rickea was your first McDonalds AA until Madison Hayes this year. This notion that Vic left the program stacked is a misnomer in my humble opinion. Coaivey at Notre inherited a program with more accolades and accomplishements at Notre Dame I dare say and she is going through struggles this year... I am not holding her to low standards but perhaps Hail State fans are holding up a standard that does not exist. 1 Sec regular Season title,1 Sec Tourney, 2 FF and 2 Natl. title Game losses. Coach Vic did not reach this standard until year 5. Coach Nikki is in year one is all that I am saying-be realistic.

I'm not a Mississippi State fan, please refer to my user name. Niele Ivey inherited team that went 13-18 last year. You are moving the goalposts a lot, you want Mississippi State to be on same expectation level as Notre Dame? Mississippi State went 27-6 last year and return almost 2/3 of their total scoring power from last year. You mentioning McDonald's AA is beside the point, the HS accolades are not as important when most of the talent from a team that won 27 games returned. if you want to talk McDonald's AA they have Sidney Cooks this year who sat out last season, she was AA so that is 3. Coming back to Vic and 5 years is also moving the goal posts, he was rebuilding a bad team, McCray-Penson inherited a winning team. You play the hand you are dealt.

 

[Gamecockfan77]

Rickea was your first McDonalds AA until Madison Hayes this year. This notion that Vic left the program stacked is a misnomer in my humble opinion. Coaivey at Notre inherited a program with more accolades and accomplishements at Notre Dame I dare say and she is going through struggles this year... I am not holding her to low standards but perhaps Hail State fans are holding up a standard that does not exist. 1 Sec regular Season title,1 Sec Tourney, 2 FF and 2 Natl. title Game losses. Coach Vic did not reach this standard until year 5. Coach Nikki is in year one is all that I am saying-be realistic.

I don't think this makes much sense.

Vic inherited a bad program. McCray inherited a very good program with very good players.

The expectations for McCray are reasonably going to be higher.

particularly when she returned the bulk of the roster from last season, added a good transfer and a blue chip recruit.

Obviously, the coaches felt like the loss of Vic and I guess the two contributors was significant. So probably McCray doesn't deserve to be run out on a rail.

But no way should she get five years to contend. That's not the job she took.

 

[HuskyMJ]

McCray signed a 4 year deal so we will see whether their AD is the type to give one year rollover extensions or not. If she does not get an extension, she is going into 3 more years of her contract, and will be recruiting high school players whose tenure in college will outlast NMP's current contract, which will certainly be made known to recruits.

 

[shiverz45]

COVID did not cause this. Our coach has taken a Final Four type roster/team and turned them into a bottom 75-100 or worse team. We may end up as a Quad 4 win for our opponents before the year is over.

You guys are fine. The same teams that beat you last year with Vic are the same teams you have loss to this year. What makes you think you have a final 4 roster?

 

[Sched234]

You guys are fine. The same teams that beat you last year with Vic are the same team you have loss to this year. What makes you think you had a final 4 roster?

I do think Mississippi State looks to be playing without the intensity it had under Vic.

This is a roster with Final Four potential, something I’d say 10-12 teams have. You have a Big Two with Jackson and Carter, a solid addition in Cooks, a top high school recruit in Hayes, and a whole crew of talented guards in Mingo-Young, Taylor, Wiggins, and Matharu.

The only problem is that none of that has played out this year. Jackson is mercurial, Carter often finds herself neutralized against skilled posts, Cooks goes AWOL more often than not, and the guards can’t do it alone (even though at least one or two of them seems to be on each night). I think State is a good example of a team playing below the sum of its parts. But the good news in Starkville is this: the talent is there to be exceptional if they can put it together. Doesn’t seem likely it’ll be this season.

 

[shiverz45]

I do think Mississippi State looks to be playing without the intensity it had under Vic.

This is a roster with Final Four potential, something I’d say 10-12 teams have. You have a Big Two with Jackson and Carter, a solid addition in Cooks, a top high school recruit in Hayes, and a whole crew of talented guards in Mingo-Young, Taylor, Wiggins, and Matharu.

The only problem is that none of that has played out this year. Jackson is mercurial, Carter often finds herself neutralized against skilled posts, Cooks goes AWOL more often than not, and the guards can’t do it alone (even though at least one or two of them seems to be on each night). I think State is a good example of a team playing below the sum of its parts. But the good news in Starkville is this: the talent is there to be exceptional if they can put it together. Doesn’t seem likely it’ll be this season.

I did notice some positive changes with the players that will pay dividend. Myah Taylor is shooting the three ball and Carter is facing up more on her jump shot.

 

[SECbbfan24]

She needs time just like you all gave Vic when he went 13-17 year one and 22-14 year two.

While I agree, the program she took over is not comparable to the one Vic took over.

She has taken over a top 15 quality roster, which returned most of last years team (adding Cooks and Hayes) and are playing themselves out of the top 25 and towards the bottom half of the conference after finishing second in the SEC last year. Multiple of their 'star' players look to be regressing and not improving.

Its too early to give up but at the same time, there are definitely concerns you cannot dismiss. McCray was not hired to 'rebuild'.

 

[Creature]

While I agree, the program she took over is not comparable to the one Vic took over.

She has taken over a top 15 quality roster, which returned most of last years team (adding Cooks and Hayes) and are playing themselves out of the top 25 and towards the bottom half of the conference after finishing second in the SEC last year. Multiple of their 'star' players look to be regressing and not improving.

Its too early to give up but at the same time, there are definitely concerns you cannot dismiss. McCray was not hired to 'rebuild'.

So we should take into account sir by your logic that the 10th place team (Arkansas) beat #3 & 4 this year. Thats fine-don't acknowledge that TN & TxA&M are much better this year. LSU & GA are not good teams and discount any wins Bama has had this year. Oh..what about Kentucky? Fact is...this is the toughest Conference in the country this year and her top 15 roster is not the top 3 rosters in the SEC. Its a reason they were picked 4th in the pre-season SEC Poll

 

[SimpleDawg]

We're 1-5 against good teams. Good teams being South Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, A&M, Kentucky, Alabama.
I don't buy that we're a product of a strong conference. I might be ok going .500 against good teams, but a team that can't beat anyone good clearly has issues.

 

[Jmsdawg]

Not trying to inflame but Coach Schaefer lost a Natl. Championship to this team (2017) and has only recorded two victories against Coach Staley. Comparing the previous coach to the new coach is a dubious argument at best since Coach Vic did not have any success against Coach Staley either. I just know your new Coach is one of the 10 best TN Women basketball players of all time at Tenn, an Olympic Gold Medalist,WNBA Champ and she built the current SC juggernaut.

She needs time just like you all gave Vic when he went 13-17 year one and 22-14 year two. UGA has given Joni Taylor time and that program was more established than either SCar or Miss. St. Please help me understand why your year 1 expectation from her is different than Vic's year one expectation ? I will hang up and listen

Vic coached the entire game, he was always pressing the girls to play hard. In the games I have watched, Nikki seldom leaves her chair she is just not involved in the game to the level Vic was and is now that he is with Texas. I realize the lack of fans reduces the excitement so IMHO the coach has to be more involved but Nikki is not. It is obvious to me the players are not motivated and not enjoying playing the game as they did with Vic. Lack of involvement by Nikki is like an army with no command structure. As for year one expectation, this team was ranked top 3 to start the season and as of today I believe we will be lucky to finish top 25. Nikki has been a total failure to date and I fear it will get worse. iMHO, unless she departs soon MSST will follow the Holly route with Tennessee.

 

[SECbbfan24]

So we should take into account sir by your logic that the 10th place team (Arkansas) beat #3 & 4 this year. Thats fine-don't acknowledge that TN & TxA&M are much better this year. LSU & GA are not good teams and discount any wins Bama has had this year. Oh..what about Kentucky? Fact is...this is the toughest Conference in the country this year and her top 15 roster is not the top 3 rosters in the SEC. Its a reason they were picked 4th in the pre-season SEC Poll

I understand they lost to some solid teams but they literally have lost to practically all of the decent teams they have faced. Hell they were lucky they didn't get by Ole Miss the other week.

I get you are defending McCray but this looks like a laundry list of excuses for why she lost all these games. They are trending in the wrong direction. Instead of improving throughout the season, they are playing worse by the week.To me that is the bigger concern.

Maybe she turns it but she hasn't made a good impression so far.

 

[SCGamecock]

I did notice some positive changes with the players that will pay dividend. Myah Taylor is shooting the three ball and Carter is facing up more on her jump shot.

Myah Taylor looks MUCH better, which is reflection of McCray I think.

 

[SECbbfan24]

Myah Taylor looks MUCH better, which is reflection of McCray I think.

She is allowing her to be more proactive offensively and shoot the 3 ball. Vic, with all the great things he did at State, I didn't understand not allowing M. Taylor to ever take those perimeter shots. Cant develop offensively or gain confidence if you don't shoot.

 

[Jmsdawg]

She is allowing her to be more proactive offensively and shoot the 3 ball. Vic, with all the great things he did at State, I didn't understand not allowing M. Taylor to ever take those perimeter shots. Cant develop offensively or gain confidence if you don't shoot.

Vic wanted the PG to be aware of the other players and try to get the ball inside for easy shots. Both Morgan and Jazz were ideal PG for Vic. They knew where the other players were and when they should get the ball, Myah never fit Vic mold, she does a lot of dribbling instead passing the ball to the inside guys.