2-3 zone

[QDOG5]

My guess is we'll see changes this year. NCAA mens bball is the only league in the world playing two halves. I think we'll see quarters within 2 years and I think the 3pt. line will get deeper. I'm not sure we'll see defensive 3 seconds in that time frame but I guess it's on the discussion list. Remember it took the NCAA a couple of years after the NBA to install the arc under the basket.

 

[intlzncster]

My guess is we'll see changes this year. NCAA mens bball is the only league in the world playing two halves. I think we'll see quarters within 2 years and I think the 3pt. line will get deeper. I'm not sure we'll see defensive 3 seconds in that time frame but I guess it's on the discussion list. Remember it took the NCAA a couple of years after the NBA to install the arc under the basket.

Even the women play in qtrs. Makes no sense for the men.

 

[intlzncster]

I don't care about how it makes the game look. My sense is that these kids should have one set of rules that matches where they'll play later. FIBA would make a lot of sense. Once you're 18, you can shoot from distance enough that you shouldn't need a separate 3-pt line. I'd also bring the shot clock to FIBA standards as well. etc etc.

I dont' mind the 30 second clock. If only because college players have a tough time getting a good look against zones. If you lowered it further, you'd have more zone defenses imo.

I guess if you instituted the 3 second rule, that would counteract it.

 

[Excalibur]

Absolutely... Ball movement is paramount. My dad used to coach me and used a drill where we were not allowed to dribble against the zone. Ball movement, player movement, open shots. It was pretty effective when I was 11.

Dribble penetration is a necessity against a zone. It was part of our formula for years.

 

[husky429]

Dribble penetration is a necessity against a zone. It was part of our formula for years.

In middle and high school... and college, the vast majority of guards are unable to dribble penetrate a zone. From the wing it's possible, but still difficult. Calhoun used to screen one guy up top and try to make the penetration a 1 on 1 move. Always worked nicely.

 

[UConnRock]

Syracuse's 2-3 zone works but it makes college basketball unwatachable

This article sums it up nicely

 

[TheChamps990411]

Shortened shot clock playing in favor of zone. Less time in each possession to work for a good shot. Lots of forced 3's at end of shot clock a result.

This! So this. Ive always wondered how can you still allow zone D if youre lowering the shot clock? Never made sense to me. It really does need to go especially if they shorten the shot clock to 24 which ive heard being considered.

 

[boog204]

Dribble penetration is a necessity against a zone. It was part of our formula for years.

Not disagreeing... Just saying that my pops necessitated moving/swinging/skipping the ball, flashing to the free-throw line to teach us to avoid over dribbling against the 2-3. Obviously, attacking the seams, when available, w/ the bounce is a great way to collapse the zone for a kick out etc.

 

[UConnJim]

There are many ways to attack the 2/3 zone. In my opinion, the best way is to play uptempo and beat the defense down the court before they can set up in the zone. And, play a full court press against the team that likes to play zone to increase the tempo of the game and force turnovers.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Dribble penetration is a necessity against a zone. It was part of our formula for years.

Not really. Rule of thumb is you beat man defense with the dribble, you beat zone defense with the pass. A 2-3 wants you to try to dribble penetrate, because the penetrator will usually find themselves trapped in the paint with no passing lanes out, and either turn it over or take a wild shot. Going baseline against a good 2-3 like Syracuse's is very dangerous because there will be a trap waiting for you behind the backboard. There are diagonal penetration lanes in a 2-3 at 45 degrees to the hoop, but that penetration is set up by good passing using ball reversals, especially using the high post.

If you can get the ball to the high post, the zone is in trouble. If your high post is a good passer, the zone is in a lot of trouble.

Our best zone busting teams had good high post passing from Knight, Voskuhl, Okafor, Thabeet and even Oriakhi. Okafor, Villanueva and Boone would just high/low zones to death, because once the defense's center steps up on the high post, the blocks are wide open. Combine that with good shooting over the top to stretch the zone out, and THEN you can dribble penetrate against a zone, but if the ball movement and movement without the ball is good enough, you don't really need to dribble drive.

 

[Excalibur]

We beat the zone with a combination of high-post flashes and guards penetrating seams either from the wing or with a ball screen at the top.

If you want to see what happens when you make no effort to use the dribble against a zone, watch what MSU did this weekend. Plenty of passes to the high post with little effectiveness.

 

[UConnRock]

Paragraph from ESPN article on Duke's transition to the syracuse zone. Doesn't bode well for the NBA futures of many Dukies. Coach K couldn't get the 1-and-dones to buy into working hard in a man-to-man.

"His players couldn't stop anyone playing man-to-man. Opposing teams couldn't hold the Blue Devils' high-powered offense in check, but the opposite end of the court had become a nightmare. Guards were beating senior Grayson Allen off the bounce with regularity, wings were driving past Marvin Bagley III, and bigs were making fellow freshman Wendell Carter Jr. look like he was swimming in quicksand."

"It was an embarrassment," one coach who faced Duke told ESPN. "It was a combination [of the fact] that they didn't want to defend, and that they couldn't defend."

 

[Hamms30]

it's killing the college game, just brutal to watch. And now Dook camps in it as well. Time to adopt NBA rules.

I think the NBA is unwatchable. It's awful.

 

[tzznandrew]

I think the NBA is unwatchable. It's awful.

You say, as the NBA has the highest ratings its had in years...

 

[Hamms30]

I think that's more the success of marketing and branding than quality of the actual product. You think all the women wearing Curry, Lebron or Harden jerseys are there for the game? Or because they succeeded in marketing and branding a given cities team as the hottest show in town? One of my nephews has more Knicks clothing than I ever had for any team growing up. Kid has never sat and watched a whole game. But he likes the logo and recognizes the brand means something in certain social groups.

It's all 1 on 1's. Officiating is a joke, nobody everrrrrrrrr travels. The game just lost something from the 90's and early 00's. I feel the same for most pro sports to be honest, I just notice it the most with the NBA. It feels too commercial and like the focus was taken off the game

 

[intlzncster]

If you want to see what happens when you make no effort to use the dribble against a zone, watch what MSU did this weekend. Plenty of passes to the high post with little effectiveness.

MSU's problem was that the guy at the high post was like a deer in the headlights. He was indecisive. You need a guy who can pull the trigger effectively for a shot, or quickly make the right pass to the open man depending from where the zone shifts.

They should have put Bridges at that position the entire game. Head scratching move by Izzo not to do so.

 

[the Q]

I think that's more the success of marketing and branding than quality of the actual product. You think all the women wearing Curry, Lebron or Harden jerseys are there for the game? Or because they succeeded in marketing and branding a given cities team as the hottest show in town? One of my nephews has more Knicks clothing than I ever had for any team growing up. Kid has never sat and watched a whole game. But he likes the logo and recognizes the brand means something in certain social groups.

It's all 1 on 1's. Officiating is a joke, nobody everrrrrrrrr travels. The game just lost something from the 90's and early 00's. I feel the same for most pro sports to be honest, I just notice it the most with the NBA. It feels too commercial and like the focus was taken off the game

They stopped calling travels in the 90s.

It’s a terrible actual product. You are 100% on point about the marketing. Don’t forget China loves the NBA too. I hear they have a decent population over there.

 

[the Q]

MSU's problem was that the guy at the high post was like a deer in the headlights. He was indecisive. You need a guy who can pull the trigger effectively for a shot, or make the right pass to the open man depending from where the zone shifts.

They should have put Bridges at that position the entire game. Head scratching move by Izzo not to do so.

Agreed. 3 guards outside, and bridges there.

It was painful to watch that kid work the foul line.

 

[tzznandrew]

The NBA is hella fun to watch, with more talent than has been in it since it started expansion. They play great defense, can shoot better than they ever have, and the players no longer (by and large) play with hangovers. You guys are just wrong on this.

But to each their own, I guess.

 

[the Q]

The NBA is hella fun to watch, with more talent than has been in it since it started expansion. They play great defense, can shoot better than they ever have, and the players no longer (by and large) play with hangovers. You guys are just wrong on this.

But to each their own, I guess.

I prefer real sports, not sports entertainment.

 

[August_West]

The NBA is hella fun to watch, with more talent than has been in it since it started expansion. They play great defense, can shoot better than they ever have, and the players no longer (by and large) play with hangovers. You guys are just wrong on this.

But to each their own, I guess.

I much preferred the wired out of their minds cocaine days of the late 70's and early 80's. Bernard King! Marvin Barnes! Michael Ray Richardson! David Thompson!

 

[uconnbaseball]

Syracuse's 2-3 zone works but it makes college basketball unwatachable

This article sums it up nicely

Eh, whatever it takes to win. I doubt we would be annoyed with it if we used it.

 

[August_West]

All these numbers hurt my head
2-3 zone
1-2-2 press

Here is the only number that matters:

::Waves hello at syrcausefan.com dummies::

Love,
"The Fat Grateful Dead Dude"

 

[Kemba429]

Yeah, some of those idiots over at Syracuse fan saying hes using us as a stepping stone. I lol’d pretty hard at that one, who the hell signs a 6 year deal as a stepping stone...