UConn-Villanova thread re: Fouls

[my2cents]

When we have these back and forths on points of disagreements, I will always go back to what Geno says. "Its not basketball we are seeing". Maybe Rugby ball.
As to comparing what's called against our opponents and us, it seems to me, our players get hit in the head/face way more , and knocked to the ground, way more.

 

[Bama fan]

My issue is that posters think Villanova, or any opponent, gets the benefit of ALL uncalled fouls. How many times was Maddy held or knocked down without a foul? A lot, but the people complaining don’t mention that. The refs were horrendous, no doubt about it. Inconsistent and incompetent for long stretches. ‘Nova wasn’t the sole beneficiary of the bad calls, though, but fans here are totally ignoring that to play the victim card.

Physical games are the way the sport is evolving. A lot of people here don’t read Twitter but if they did, they’d see the bruises on Cameron Brink, Aliyah Boston, Caitlin Clark, and other star players. If people don’t like that style of play, they should check out D2 or another sport because it’s here to stay.

Knowing that, just the thought that there will be complaints about Our Girls and the mean opponents that beat them up for the years to come is depressing.

I saw an ad for cheap , online generic Zoloft or Paxil. Given the state of the union/BY you might need to lay in a good supply.

 

[DennieEddy]

Would it be appropriate for UConn women’s video department to put a collection of these physical assaults together to share with the Big East officials’ overseers? Is there any reason they wouldn’t do that?

I think any coach could put together a newsreel of various snippets of various games of various players of their players getting hacked, shoved, pushed, trampled on, tackled, poked, et al...with no foul being called.

It just looks worse when it's YOUR team.

 

[Forego]

My beef is with head shots and face shots not called. Aaliyah gets the heel of a Nova player in her jaw while dribbling. Her head snaps back and she stops - stunned. The call - travelling on Aaliyah. Later in the game Nika is pushed by Olsen, knocked into Seigrist, and Nika gets the foul. Nika also took an elbow to the face, right in front of the official, and no call. The last one was in the 4th quarter when Caroline was under the basket going for a rebound. Seigrist came over her back, chopped down to slap the ball away and hit Caroline on the head. This caused Caroline to go to the bench and get ice on her neck.

Sorry, but head and face shots need to be called. This type of defensive behavior is not good for the game.

Although different players were involved, the foul when Olsen shoved Nika into Seigrist was nearly identical to the play where Azzi was injured. Thankfully the result was different.

When I saw who the refs were instantly I knew we were going to have a poorly called game. One of them is the most inconsistent in Division 1 and we always seem to get stuck with that ref. Isn’t there a way to exclude that ref? You know like lawyers excluding potential jurors.

 

[90BSEE]

Although different players were involved, the foul when Olsen shoved Nika into Seigrist was nearly identical to the play where Azzi was injured. Thankfully the result was different.

When I saw who the refs were instantly I knew we were going to have a poorly called game. One of them is the most inconsistent in Division 1 and we always seem to get stuck with that ref. Isn’t there a way to exclude that ref? You know like lawyers excluding potential jurors.

There are many good points in this thread and these should be discussed everywhere and constantly. First, you are absolutely right about how Azzi got injured. And Caroline took a shot to the head right in front of Vasily with no call.

The argument about both teams fouling out if all the fouls are called is as flawed as the argument that a game is called fairly if the teams are called for the same number. No, the teams won't foul out after the first quarter. Why? Because they WOULD STOP FOULING well before that happened. And this has nothing to do with "our girls". The same crap is happening on the men's side. I think the refs hate Hurley more than they hate Geno. I refuse to accept this as the new normal. Call the games according to the rule book.

I think the NCAA and the refs should be legally liable for injuries that occur due to not getting control of the game when it gets physical. If someone gets hurt because of a foul and you weren't calling all the fouls, you are liable. Then you would see things change.

 

[boontonbomber]

The game is getting harder and harder to call, much quicker and certainly more physical. Complain all you want about UConn always getting the short end if it makes you feel better.

 

[ABCDFE]

My issue is that posters think Villanova, or any opponent, gets the benefit of ALL uncalled fouls. How many times was Maddy held or knocked down without a foul? A lot, but the people complaining don’t mention that. The refs were horrendous, no doubt about it. Inconsistent and incompetent for long stretches. ‘Nova wasn’t the sole beneficiary of the bad calls, though, but fans here are totally ignoring that to play the victim card.

Physical games are the way the sport is evolving. A lot of people here don’t read Twitter but if they did, they’d see the bruises on Cameron Brink, Aliyah Boston, Caitlin Clark, and other star players. If people don’t like that style of play, they should check out D2 or another sport because it’s here to stay.

Knowing that, just the thought that there will be complaints about Our Girls and the mean opponents that beat them up for the years to come is depressing.

Your point is well taken. However, when watching the games that our girls play, it is evident that the refs are not calling even the egregious fouls and in some instances lack of awareness and knowledge of the game like in the out of bounds play in the SC game. That is unacceptable and as we've seen can cause injuries to players. If this is also happening with other teams than I would advocate that the officiating stinks for those teams as well. As for a Uconn fan watching Uconn games, I feel there is a clear tactic the other teams are using on the defensive side of the ball. Just like the 2001 patriots who held and pass interfered on almost every pass play in the superbowl, Patriots knew they wouldn't get call for everything and that was the only way to win. We as a team have to fight through this, but it doesn't make it right. In all sports, we just want things to be called the right way as often as possible.

The fans I think have a right to call out the officiating here.

 

[housekeys]

My issue is that posters think Villanova, or any opponent, gets the benefit of ALL uncalled fouls.

The team that benefits most from uncalled fouls is likely the more physical team, keeping in mind that both teams are likely physical. In general, physicality is the talent equalizer. UConn is arguably more talented than most teams they play against. It is not surprising that teams must be physical against UConn. It is not surprising UConn fans will complain. UConn will also be the more physical team when it goes up against a more talented team (on a any given day - UConn may not be the most talented).

Knowing you are a moderator, I can understand your consternation, however.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

All I ask for is consistency at least in the same game. That seems to be a challenge across the league. If you're calling the touch fouls, then just call it both ways. If you're allowing slight hand-checking on the perimeter, then so be it. Look, there's incidental contact in basketball so I'm not a fan of blowing the whistle because someone falls down, screams 'and 1' or jerks their head back. Number one on my wish list is resolving the 'plane of verticality'. Why can the offensive player break that plane (jumping into the defense), but it's a foul on the defense?

 

[HuskyNan]

Your point is well taken. However, when watching the games that our girls play, it is evident that the refs are not calling even the egregious fouls and in some instances lack of awareness and knowledge of the game like in the out of bounds play in the SC game. That is unacceptable and as we've seen can cause injuries to players. If this is also happening with other teams than I would advocate that the officiating stinks for those teams as well.

I wholeheartedly agree that the refs were awful. The women’s game is getting more physical and it seems the refs don’t know how to handle it. The game is evolving; the rules/refs, not so much

As for a Uconn fan watching Uconn games, I feel there is a clear tactic the other teams are using on the defensive side of the ball. Just like the 2001 patriots who held and pass interfered on almost every pass play in the superbowl, Patriots knew they wouldn't get call for everything and that was the only way to win. We as a team have to fight through this, but it doesn't make it right. In all sports, we just want things to be called the right way as often as possible.

The fans I think have a right to call out the officiating here.

UConn fans are ignoring how physical the Huskies are with opponents. It’s unbelievable to me that fans still think UConn plays a finesse game.

I agree the refs are bad. What I hate is that fans make it sound like opponents are deliberately trying to hurt or rough up the Huskies and the refs are looking the other way. Every game the board goes on and on about it. That’s what’s driving me crazy

 

[RedStickHusky]

FWIW, it's not possible to hold a basketball over your head with two hands and turn your body without moving your elbows. A defender should not be allowed to fish for a flagrant by sticking her face in that cylinder. Beyond that, physical play and bad officiating are environmental factors you have to live with. If we had the 40 point margins we all take for granted, or the bodies to better absorb it all, we'd be doing a lot less complaining.

 

[Husky pride]

UConn was called for 16 fouls, Villanova was called for 23. UConn had 23 free throw attempts, Villanova had 12.

Is there any chance people could stop complaining about foul calls?

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Not when the complaints are legitimate and the flagrant fouls could cause injury to an already depleted lineup.

 

[baggerbob]

This is what Lou has to deal with every game with no calls going her way.

There were at least 2 fouls that should have been called in that sequence.

 

[HuskyNan]

Not when the complaints are legitimate and the flagrant fouls could cause injury to an already depleted lineup.

So, what will endless threads on the Boneyard accomplish to stop the behavior?

 

[boontonbomber]

So, what will endless threads on the Boneyard accomplish to stop the behavior?

Never has accomplished anything, never willl, but maybe good therapy for some people.

 

[Ct Dog]

It’s a message board that’s what’s suppose to happen

 

[Husky pride]

So, what will endless threads on the Boneyard accomplish to stop the behavior?

In all do respect, many threads can fall into the category of not positively stopping a given behavior… but, nonetheless, warrant being said.

 

[CTrefugee]

Similar to the NFL. In the last 2 minutes of a game, coaches could request the review of a call.
If they are wrong, they lose a timeout (which are usually valuable near the end). There were a number of bad call both ways in the Villanova game ( and all the other games).

In the last two minutes (crunch time) there were two terrible calls that hurt UCONN.
At about 1:47 Nika was pushed into Maddie by another Villanova player and called for a foul.
At about 0:48 A held ball was called when it was just a foul by Villanova. Villanova was never close to a joint possesion.

This rule would also benefit the refs who would no longer be "blamed" for crucial late game errors.

 

[SVCBeercats]

 

[Pharos]

UConn was called for 16 fouls, Villanova was called for 23. UConn had 23 free throw attempts, Villanova had 12.

Is there any chance people could stop complaining about foul calls?

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We need a new stat: "Bodies Unable to Manage Passing Safely" or "B.U.M.P.S." This will be more than "Fouls Called." It won't even be every collision between two (or more?) players. It'll just be the number of times that collision produces player pain of some kind. The trick will be to keep the "diving" under control, you know the James Harden head snap sort of thing. Comparing BUMPS to actual fouls called will give some basis for assessing ref reliability.

 

[Rowdy831]

Agree about turnovers, but really now, there aren’t many better teams that UConn hasn’t played.

Speaking of competing for the NC, not necessarily their conference teams.

 

[Kat]

It’s a message board that’s what’s suppose to happen

Exactly. It’s very easy to ignore comments that you don’t approve of and it’s not necessary to lecture people about it, either.

 

[Zinethar]

UConn used to be a finesse team. Teams with good coaching can alter tactics when it is called for. Now, from my observation, UConn has become a very aggressive and physical team very much like most of the other good teams they have played. There is likely a foul on almost every possession for both teams. What needs to happen is the Officials need to also adjust (and likely the rules also). Dangerous contact needs to be always called. Body bumps that do not affect a shot should not be called. An arm getting hit while making a shot should always be called as it affects the game. Sensible calls that are consistent throughout the game. UConn did adjust in that game in that they had early fouls that they learned from and didn't do them later. Nika was called for a foul at one point that was questionable and shortly after got hit with another which was EARNED. The opponent did not bother her like that again.

There are rules that need revision to clarify them or eliminate some things. The block/charge call unless in the arc is vague and no one knows what is the right call.Verticality would seem to be good but is still called when a player jumps into a defender. I'm just glad that I'm only a swimming and track official. A basketball official has all eyes on them at all times and is mostly an impossible job as the rules are now written. Before the end of the first quarter is all fouls as written were called it would be a 4 on 4 game. (For football fans think ruffing the passer!)