SW Force Awakens - Review w/ spoilers (Don't read until after you see it) | Page 2 | The Boneyard

SW Force Awakens - Review w/ spoilers (Don't read until after you see it)

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I must have had some Star Wars-inspired dreams last night, because I awoke this morning with the phrase "I'm Lando Calrissian" in my head, from that old commercial with the Empire Strikes Back action figures.

And now that has got me wondering, what happened to Lando? Is there any word on whether he might figure in future episodes?
 
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I liked having the 3D for this (especially a few cockpit scenes when I felt like I was sitting in the back seat) but don't think it was essential.

Not a huge fan of 3D, though Avatar was the best I have seen so far. The one scene that really 'popped' for me was that head on shot of the Star Destroyer about 2/3 the way through the movie. Felt like I was about to get run over.
 
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If only they could erase episodes I, II & III.

For sometime, I have always had the thought that the prequels should have started at the start of the Clone Wars with a young Padawan Anakin Skywalke in Episode I. Scrap most of the political stuff or at last keep it as a subplot to focus on the heroes. By Episode III, he could a hardened war veteran who happens to be secretly married to Padme with kids. He defeats the Sith leader (Dooku); but, the Jedi Council finds out about it, kicks him out of the Order and threatens to take away his kids. To escape, he kills some minor Jedi and is arrested only for Chancellor Palpatine to offer him a way out and shows that is is the Sith Lord. The two then to plan to overthrow the Republic and the Order so Anakain can keep his family. Thus, Vader is born. After successfully turning over the government, Padme realizes that Anakin has gone too far and asks Obi-Wan, who was against taking their kids, to help. Obi-Wan beats Anakin; but Padme is killed in the cross file (not choked) and/or caught & executed for treason against the Empire. The twins are seperated to be hidden as in the movies; but, slightly older (maybe a year). It would be darker; but, show that the Jedi order as it was then was also partially at fault for turning Anakin into Darth Vader and would also better explain how Luke was able o turn him back (family first). It would also explain how Leia could tell Luke that she remembers her mother as the twins would have know their parents for a short time (less than a year). Padme could also take a more active role in III instead of sitting around being pregnant most of the time and then dying. Her character in II showed she was not a person that lets the world go by without being a part of it.
 
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I too, was wondering who the person was that Poe met on Jakku at the beginning. I felt like I should have known who it was and felt like my Star Wars fandom would need to be revoked. Glad to see it wasn't just me who didn't know!

Poe was great and a bad ass pilot but I still miss Wedge. He was by far, my favorite character in the series and I loved the X-Wing series books my Michael Stackpole that focused a lot on him. Wish they brought him back but seeing how they advanced the timeline so much, he wouldn't fit into the notion of being a fighter jock still.

The trench scene was a great blast from the past but could have done without the third death star gig.

Overall it was awesome and I can't wait to see it again next week when maybe the theater won't be filled with kids.

Ditto on seeing it again. I plan to catch it during the Holiday week in NYC as I will be working and my family will be away in Maine as I am out of vacation days.

Loos like everyone's one complaint was Death Star III and I agree. If I never see another super weapon again in Star Wars, I will be happy. It was one of the big reasons I liked the Heir of the Empire book series from Zahn. The bad guys don't need a Death Star to be a major threat.

I still think there is more to Lor San Tekka that what has been disclosed to far in the movie or online

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Lor_San_Tekka

Why? He knows the force, refers to Leia as 'Princess' and 'Royalty' and seems to know both Luke on a first name basis and I believe he knows exactly who Kylo Ren is, too. Considering that the Force is a myth and Luke is a legend by the time of Force Awakens, they points to Lor having ties to the Rebellion and being close to the core group. That is why I also believe it is not coincidence that he is on Jakku with Rey. I think he is the person that Rey's parents lefter her with on Jakku as he is someone the core members trust absolutely and someone who can take care of himself. He likely raised Rey during her earlier years before she went out on her own.

Who? If he is Force sensitive, I believe he is Kanan Jarrus as Kanan, assuming he lives through Rebels, had to eventually cross paths with Luke and would fit the above. If not Kanan, then he could be Wedge as Wedge fits that profile, too, and could also teach Rey how to fight and fly. Just not sure if Wedge fist age wise as Lor is closer to Han's age than Luke's (about 10 years).

PS - If Rey is not Luke's daughter, which I am about 75% certain, could she be Ezra Bridger's daughter maybe with Sabine as that timeline could work and would result in a young, force sensitive, capable young woman.
 

CL82

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Do we know that "Rebels" is being incorporated into the movie narrative?
 

SubbaBub

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The story was a little too similar to A New Hope. It didn't ruin anything, but I would have enjoyed a little something different. My brother did make a good point after the movie though -Didn't you expect that one day they would re-make Star Wars? Yup. Well, wasn't it better this way than actually re-making the first movie? OK, I can live w/ that.

@Penfield This is a great observation:

IMO, it flat out ruined the last half hour in the same way JJ ruined the last half hour of Star Trek: Into the Darkness. Pure fanboy masturbatory applause bait. I was also half waiting for a shot of Luke force telepathy-ing at Rey during the battle in the woods. Her ability to use the force out of the box was also a bit off-putting. It took Luke nearly two movies and meeting Yoda to survive a light saber duel. I liked Ren throwing saber tantrums throughout the movie. This was a better allusion to the lack of mental discipline that would move a young force sensitive toward the dark side than the incessant whining of the prequels. Would also have been nice to throw Luke a line or two. IRL, the use of Skelling Michael as the Jedi temple means I will never be able to go back there without suffering a horde of fanboys, which is too bad because it is one of the coolest places on the planet.

The first hour was absolutely well done.
 

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So just a few questions that I had in regards to some characters.

Was that Ackbar at the Resistance base or just another Mon Calamari? Not sure what the life span of a Mon Calamari is so wasn't sure but they had the exact same voice.

Also, was Nien Nunb, the pilot with Lando on the Falcon in ROTJ part of the X-Wing squadron? Just curious which characters they were carrying on and which were just similar species. (I had to use the link Mr Conehead supplied to the wookiepedia to find out Nien's name!)

So now it's on to the next Star Wars being released next December, Rogue One
 
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Do we know that "Rebels" is being incorporated into the movie narrative?

Star Wars Rebels is Cannon. I was under the impression that Commander Jun Sato, who leads the Rebel cell known as Phoenix in Rebels is also in the Force Awakens; but Ken Leung's character is listed as Admiral Statura and not Sato.
 
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So just a few questions that I had in regards to some characters.

Was that Ackbar at the Resistance base or just another Mon Calamari? Not sure what the life span of a Mon Calamari is so wasn't sure but they had the exact same voice.

Also, was Nien Nunb, the pilot with Lando on the Falcon in ROTJ part of the X-Wing squadron? Just curious which characters they were carrying on and which were just similar species. (I had to use the link Mr Conehead supplied to the wookiepedia to find out Nien's name!)

Yes, those were Acbar and Nunb in the Force Awakens; both are credited and are played by the same actors as they were in ROTJ.
 

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My thought when I walked out of the theater... "The force is strong in my family. My father has it. I have it. ... My sister has it." Why isn't Leia a Jedi? or at least displaying some force abilities beyond knowing when Han was killed?

I agree that Han's fate was sealed the moment they mentioned that Kylo was his offspring. Although - having Han and Leia not live happily ever after, and meeting as old folks with a past added (I thought) a good, adult element to the script.

I didn't mind the similarity to A New Hope too much. Sure, there are call-backs from Jakku being very Tatooine-like, leaving the desert planet in the Falcon, sneaking around the Imperial military installation without being detected. But it didn't feel like re-hashing to me. Ren killing Han felt completely different emotionally from Vader's swing-and-a-miss at Obi-Wan.I think Adam Driver did the "I'm following the Sith teachings because I'm an emo boy in pain" much better than Hayden Christiansen ever did, in a much more economical and believable way without pages and pages of exposition. Rey finding Luke at the end does not have a parallel in either of the first two trilogies. Mark Hamill didn't have to say anything, his eyes did the acting.

I think my biggest fear going into The Force Awakens, other than the movie not living up to the original trilogy, was that the writing would feel like a "How to pace your hollywood script" formula, the way so many blockbusters these days do, including Abram's Star Trek scripts. Now, The Force Awakens probably does adhere to those formulas to a certain extent, but it wasn't too obvious about it. It felt like a hybrid of 70's/80s movies with the more recent type of scripts.

Here's my nerdy gripe - the weapon of the Starkiller Base is clearly not moving very fast, it's sub-light-speed for sure. We don't know if it can move through space, but the Death Star can - it is positioned close to Alderaan before blowing it up. And yet - the ray of energy or whatever moves relatively slowly, towards a planet in a system who knows how many parsecs away, but it arrives there instantaneously. Hm.
 

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Forgot to say - the "Oh, you're cold?" line from Han to Chewie got a laugh in the theater.

 

junglehusky

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Couple other thoughts... in IV, Luke is yearning to leave the family farm on the desert planet of Tatooine. In VII, Rey does not want to leave the desert planet of Jakku in case her family comes back (I think?).

C-3PO doesn't show up for most of the movie, and isn't overly annoying to Han (as in Eps IV, V) or Artoo (as in most of I-VI). In fact, I was kind of expecting some comedy / tension between BB8 and the original droids, and it didn't really happen and I was just a bit disappointed, but not really.

There is a theory on youtube that Snoke is actually Darth Plaeguis, he allowed Palpatine to think he killed him, then sat back and let Palpatine do all the heavy lifting. In Ep. III, when Palpatine is telling Anakin the story of Plaeguis, he doesn't explicitly say whether it was Plagues or Sidious/Palpatine that manipulated the mitochondria, er midichlorians to create Anakin. But if it was Plaeguis, he would have forseen Anakin (or another Skywalker) overthrowing the Emperor at which point he comes back. Now that that theory is out, maybe the writers will avoid it.

My guess would be that the image of Snoke isn't of a Skype type hologram being transmitted from another planet. Instead, Snoke is in inside some kind of crystal force-computery/matrixy thing, he doesn't have a physical manifestation (yet). Maybe was created by Palpatine or a more ancient Sith predating the Old Republic.
 
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junglehusky said:
Couple other thoughts... in IV, Luke is yearning to leave the family farm on the desert planet of Tatooine. In VII, Rey does not want to leave the desert planet of Jakku in case her family comes back (I think?). C-3PO doesn't show up for most of the movie, and isn't overly annoying to Han (as in Eps IV, V) or Artoo (as in most of I-VI). In fact, I was kind of expecting some comedy / tension between BB8 and the original droids, and it didn't really happen and I was just a bit disappointed, but not really. There is a theory on youtube that Snoke is actually Darth Plaeguis, he allowed Palpatine to think he killed him, then sat back and let Palpatine do all the heavy lifting. In Ep. III, when Palpatine is telling Anakin the story of Plaeguis, he doesn't explicitly say whether it was Plagues or Sidious/Palpatine that manipulated the mitochondria, er midichlorians to create Anakin. But if it was Plaeguis, he would have forseen Anakin (or another Skywalker) overthrowing the Emperor at which point he comes back. Now that that theory is out, maybe the writers will avoid it. My guess would be that the image of Snoke isn't of a Skype type hologram being transmitted from another planet. Instead, Snoke is in inside some kind of crystal force-computery/matrixy thing, he doesn't have a physical manifestation (yet). Maybe was created by Palpatine or a more ancient Sith predating the Old Republic.
This brings me to my list of gripes:
1. Midichlorians.
2. Jar jar

The force was supposed to be this mystical, unquantifiable thing that they simply had. I don't need some bullshat "reason" why they were strong with the force.
 
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Just read the movie novelization. Not much to add except for a few cut scenes, like a speeder chase on Jakku between Rey and some local thugs and Chewbacca rips an arm off of Unkar Plutt (Simon Pegg's character) who followed Rey from Jakku to Takodana. The one impression that came out more strong in the book that the movie is that Kylo definitely knows who Rey is and where she is from. Rey is not her birth name either.

Any be that Rey is actually Annie Skywalker? Named after her grandfather. It would work, except it would be way too close to another Annie - Little Orhphan Annie.
 

Penfield

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So after having several days to reflect on the movie my feelings have changed a bit.

Where the prequels had a potentially good story that was ruined by dialogue, acting and pacing (just read this article and its a great look at what the movies could have been), I feel The Force Awakens was a very re-hashed, unoriginal story that was instead saved by the great dialogue, acting and pacing. Who is more responsible for that - Abrams or Kasdan? Like I said before, it is an extremely fun movie, and I plan to go watch it again in the theater. It made me excited about Star Wars again. But the more I think about it the more the unoriginality begins to bother me. I am glad JJ Abrams is only consulting on the next film, because despite the successes he may have had with this one, I am just about done with him. I guess my rating of the movie would go from an 8/10 to 7/10 with a chance to move up or down...

I feel that people's opinions on this movie will ultimately be based on how good the next one is. When Phantom Menace came out people were generally positive about it, admitted it had some major flaws and annoyances. Yes, everyone hated Jar Jar, but I dont think it was until AOTC came out that people were really willing to admit that neither was a very good movie. That is when we lost our faith. Then ROTS fully cemented their standings in the franchise. The Force Awakens will always be seen more positively (because it is a better movie than all 3), but I think it is in a similar situation as TPM. If the next movie is simply a retelling of the Empire Strikes Back I am going to be extremely disappointed, and I think a lot of other people will be too. If the next movie is great then it will be very, very easy to forgive the issues TFW had.

Hopefully Rian Johnson can inject some originality into this trilogy. Hopefully Disney and Lucasfilm are willing to be a bit more risky, and not follow the current Hollywood trend of cookie cutter blockbuster nostalgia trips. It will be exciting to see where Star Wars goes over the next year in a half. With Rogue One and Episode 8 there seems to be a lot of potential for the series to reclaim it's status as best movie franchise. After this movie I'm just not quite ready to give them back the crown.
 
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I enjoyed and want to see it again... How hardcore am I l? I got off of 21 hours of plane flights and went straight to theater.

Nitpicking here, but as a rule, nothing about Adam Driver or the cast of " girls" is scary. Same with "Poe Lameron". Those two characters were cast terribly. Couldn't stand either character.

Also the bad didn't seem scary or evil enough. Which is kind of a big problem.
 
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I enjoyed and want to see it again... How hardcore am I l? I got off of 21 hours of plane flights and went straight to theater.

Nitpicking here, but as a rule, nothing about Adam Driver or the cast of " girls" is scary. Same with "Poe Lameron". Those two characters were cast terribly. Couldn't stand either character.

Also the bad didn't seem scary or evil enough. Which is kind of a big problem.


I actually thought Oscar Issac played Poe well, kind of a combination of Han Solo swagger with some bravado from Pete "Maverick" Mitchell of Top Gun and with the skill to back it up.

I think casting Driver as Kylo was done on purpose. he is very power and very unpolished with the potential to go either way light/dark. He's more Darth Vader intimidating with the mask on and more human, Leia's & Han's, with it off. of course, now that he shish kabobed his old man and had his boyish/pretty face split-open by Rey, it will be interesting to see if he can come back from that
 
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Really enjoyed it. Not perfect, but lots of fun. As many have said, lots of repetition in the story. I get it, though. It was all about establishing the new characters and feeling like Star Wars again. Could it have been more original? Yes, but I thought the acting and dialogue was great, and it allows the next two directors to stake out new and original stories within these world. No more Death Stars, though. For serious.

Rey: she was trained, right. That's the only thing that makes sense. She was trained as a jedi and then had her memory wiped. Perhaps she was more powerful than Kylo Ren and that's why he turned on the jedi--petulance. But, he didn't kill her. He couldn't. Probably because she is related to him and he still had good in him. So he dropped her on Jakku and wiped her mind. Aside from her being Luke's daughter, that's my big guess.

Loved all the other characters, and even though Driver didn't have the gravitas when the mask was taken off, I got the sense that was intentional and I could roll with it.
 
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Awful movie. Was all special effect and very little character development or narrative. It was all action and felt very dry and seem to borrow too much from the old movies. No orginallity! The black character was awful and should of just died as he was very weak in personality. The woman character was well acted but felt too overpowered and fake in how she learns her powers compared to the past Jedi's. Revealing kylo ren's identity so soon and making him a punk hipster really was a let down. This movie just felt like a rehash of jj's Star Trek into the darkness with how he has ruined the series putting a recycled story with paper thin characters and forcing way too much action on the viewer for the sake of the millenniums.

My wife who had never seen a Star Wars except for the original hated it. I will keep episodes 4-6 dear to my heart and not waste any more time watching this abomination of the Star Wars name.
 

junglehusky

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Awful movie. Was all special effect and very little character development or narrative. It was all action and felt very dry and seem to borrow too much from the old movies. No orginallity! The black character was awful and should of just died as he was very weak in personality. The woman character was well acted but felt too overpowered and fake in how she learns her powers compared to the past Jedi's. Revealing kylo ren's identity so soon and making him a punk hipster really was a let down. This movie just felt like a rehash of jj's Star Trek into the darkness with how he has ruined the series putting a recycled story with paper thin characters and forcing way too much action on the viewer for the sake of the millenniums.

My wife who had never seen a Star Wars except for the original hated it. I will keep episodes 4-6 dear to my heart and not waste any more time watching this abomination of the Star Wars name.
Tell us what you really think!

At least we got a parody twitter account out of this:


 
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I actually thought Oscar Issac played Poe well, kind of a combination of Han Solo swagger with some bravado from Pete "Maverick" Mitchell of Top Gun and with the skill to back it up.

I think casting Driver as Kylo was done on purpose. he is very power and very unpolished with the potential to go either way light/dark. He's more Darth Vader intimidating with the mask on and more human, Leia's & Han's, with it off. of course, now that he shish kabobed his old man and had his boyish/pretty face split-open by Rey, it will be interesting to see if he can come back from that

Isaac and Driver were there to appease the hipsters. Those guys are big in Brooklyn and Silverlake.
 
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Caught it for the second time last night in IMAX at AMC Empire in NYC. Theater was absolutely packed on a rainy Tuesday night, though during the Holiday break, in NYC. I love my kids; but, it was easier to watch without my boys asking 1,000 questions. Crowd was less jacked-up, too.

Also, apologies to Poe, he shot down 9, not 6, TIE's in that one combat sequence.

I also tried to pay attention to that flashback scene more. Rey is defiantly on Bespin in that once scene with Vader breathing nearby. I also paid attention to the voices, too and noted both Obi-Wan's in there. I thought Anakin maybe in there, too. When she is left on Jakku, that does look like Unkar Plutt's. If so, that is one heck of a parenting snaffu. Its not as clear in the movie as in the novelization; but, that guy is a scum bag and looks at Rey like she could be merchandise, too. Chewie ripping off his arm in the novel was a plus in my opinion. Some one else on Jakku had to be watching over her and gave her some basic survival, hand-to-hand, and piloting training. Can't picture Unkar doing that. And Rey looks to have been 7 or 8 when left there and is now 18 or so. No way a child can survive on Jakku that long without help.

Also, in his final duel, Finn got a hit on Kylo's right shoulder, which forced Kylo to stop playing with him and finished him off with a slash to the back (check in the novel). Still not sure if Finn is force sensitive. he did not look like in his duel with Kylo; but, on Jakku, Kylo seemed to sense him after the slaughter took place. Against Rey, Kylo took a hit to the left shoulder, had his cloak cut off, which may or may not have also scored him in the legs ,and also took nasty slashes to the face and chest. Less clear when Rey sliced Kylo's lightsaber into pieces if she also look off his left hand. Looked liked so in one scene; but, not the next (his wrist could have been buried int he snow making it look like there was a gap between his forearm and left hand).

In the book, it is very clear that Kylo knows who Rey is now. If so, Snoke will know, soon. Leia has her suspicions, too, based on their hug at the end. That 'secret' I doubt will make it halfway past Episode VIII as there is just too much on the table now. That said, JJ will want to surprise us, like Empire, so what will big reveal at the end of VIII be? Maybe there will be hints in Rouge One next winter?

Lastly, I really had to keep from laughing in the scene that Rey escape by using the force on the Storm Trooper, who we now know is Daniel Craig, as I had a run of James Bond lines and music going off in the back of my head. 'You will but down that gun and go get a vodka martini, and make sure its shaken, not stirred.'

Overall, still a good flick.
 
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Star Wars is THE classic Hero's Journey. It doesn't go any other way. Said plot structure has to follow a certain formula. Because it happens in the same universe with recurring characters, y'all see it as a straight rehash. But the Hero doesn't meet the Sage at the end of IV. The Heros don't do anything particularly miraculous to save the day like the Hero does in IV (in fact, the opposite happens; while the sidekick sets up the Hero in IV, the Heros at most set up the sidekick here). The villain is completely different and will evolve with the story, unlike Vader. The face of the Masked Villain is revealed almost immediately, unlike the tension created throughout the original trilogy.

...not to mention, thanks to casting, there is no possibility of some creepy unbeknownst incestuous romantic relationship
 
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Really liked it. At a minimum, the film making in this movie was taken infinitely more seriously than the prequels. There were scenes in those movies that seemed like they were early rehearsal walkthroughs to which Lucas said "Close enough, print it". Just lazy and felt disrespectful to the franchise and its legion of fans.

Agree with most of the criticisms. I consciously felt at times the parallels with the original. Enough to pull me out of the realm of willing suspension of disbelief. Felt odd that Rey was able to use the force so easily without AT LEAST some kind of foreshadowing. But then if we got a neat and tidy fix for all those critiques, it would have been 3 hours. I would have been fine with that, but Disney - not so much.

By far the best part - for me - was Han Solo. His interactions with Chewie were classic Star Wars. Very sad to see him go. Which is another reason that scene just didn't do the movie or the franchise justice. I saw it coming a mile away as well. Maybe not entirely avoidable, but at least make up for that by making the scene epic. Han's death should have been agony and bloody, both for him and his son. Too much to ask for the PG rating and the appeal to kids ? Not in my opinion. But pretty much expected based on the risk averse corporate culture. Instead it was death circa movies in the 1950s. Gasp, eyse closed. Death.

One other thing I thought about, especially in contrast to the newly enlightened need for a "female protagonist" is the way Leia's character petered out after Empire. She was the first badass female protagonist in the original. The princess that didn't need saving. And then in Jedi, we find out she has jedi roots. And then... nothing. I certainly like badass leia much more than idle prop Leia.

Happy to see more of this overall
 

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Well, after the prequels anything was going to be an improvement.
At least this got the series back on the right rail.
But they rushed everything. Saw no foundation for relationship between Luke's hot daughter and the former storm trooper who made me wish that Will Smith was twenty years younger. If you are going to replace Harrison Ford, you need a star.
Leia and Hans Solo were a constant reminded of how old I have gotten.
Leia looked only slightly better than the new giant emperor guy.
We can only hope that they don't put her in a bikini for the sequel.
Solo's death was more of mercy killing for the audience. They should have had Solo being an old Solo instead of a young Solo with an old face.
They had unlimited screen time for this movie. They should made it three hours and did it much better. Hired a writer or two.
The new little robot was okay.
Did they use Bill Walton's voice for the new Darth Vader guy? And why put him in a mask? His real face was far scarier.
Lots of action. A return to fun humor.
The best scene in the whole movie is when Luke's daughter hands him his light saber.
Hopefully, the next one will be back up to snuff.
 
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