OT: Cincy dropping men's soccer

[Peacefrog]

Cincinnati drops men's soccer amid 'uncertainty'

They speak to the immediate uncertainty of the pandemic but go on to cite long-term budget concerns. I wonder if we will see the virus trigger other such moves.

 

[aburks41]

Don't they know that you can still have a fully functioning athletic department even if you have a $40m deficit?

 

[Storrs South]

There is a lot to unpack in here. Cincinnati was doing about as poorly financially as UConn as it pertains to the athletics department with respect to the student subsidies.

The new AAC deal is a drop in the bucket compared to what is needed to close the gap. Cutting a soccer team seems so minor to operate compared to the magnitude of issues for an AAC school to operate. Is COVID being used as an excuse for cover? Is this more about the travel costs for non-revenue sports in such a spread out conference?

As this pertains to UConn, I have no idea how this could play out. Specifically from football, revenue was $3 million and expenses $16 million. Does UConn benefit not playing for one season, especially one where they had to curry favor to schedule games on short notice i.e. lower buy game $$? I doubt it is that simple, especially since other parts of the institution are losing money from the on-campus housing refunds and operating under normal conditions.

However, unlike Cincinnati, UConn is now in a travel friendly conference for most sports. Does UConn dodge this bullet?

Does this affect the hockey rink that has been the subject of much debate the last couple years?

I do not have the answers to these questions, but I do hope we do not lose any sports as a result of this.

 

[UCONNJACK]

There is a lot to unpack in here. Cincinnati was doing about as poorly financially as UConn as it pertains to the athletics department with respect to the student subsidies.

The new AAC deal is a drop in the bucket compared to what is needed to close the gap. Cutting a soccer team seems so minor to operate compared to the magnitude of issues for an AAC school to operate. Is COVID being used as an excuse for cover? Is this more about the travel costs for non-revenue sports in such a spread out conference?

As this pertains to UConn, I have no idea how this could play out. Specifically from football, revenue was $3 million and expenses $16 million. Does UConn benefit not playing for one season, especially one where they had to curry favor to schedule games on short notice i.e. lower buy game $$? I doubt it is that simple, especially since other parts of the institution are losing money from the on-campus housing refunds and operating under normal conditions.

However, unlike Cincinnati, UConn is now in a travel friendly conference for most sports. Does UConn dodge this bullet?

Does this affect the hockey rink that has been the subject of much debate the last couple years?

I do not have the answers to these questions, but I do hope we do not lose any sports as a result of this.

The hockey arena is still moving forward per this April 9th update

Blog | University Planning, Design and Construction

updc.uconn.edu

 

[upstater]

All bets are off for every state school in the country, and things may be even worse at the privates.

There's a quadruple whammy coming.

1. High number if unemployed means an inability to pay for college, and students who work in the retail sector to pay for it are now unemployed. Fewer paying students.

2. State budgets are about to be decimated. They will cut subsidies to state universities by tens of millions quite soon.

3. University budgets are about to be decimated not only from losing American students, but foreign students who will not be able to easily travel to the US to resume studies.

4. We're now entering the biggest demographic trough in a generation, as the numbers of students aged 10-18 is well under the numbers of the recent past.

Schools are going to slash and burn very soon.

 

[NEforceUConn]

I wonder if sports are delayed for 2020 if UConn can get a refund of some of the money we paid aac to leave early.

 

[Storrs South]

1. High number if unemployed means an inability to pay for college, and students who work in the retail sector to pay for it are now unemployed. Fewer paying students.

When unemployment increases, more people go back to school

High Unemployment, High College Enrollment

 

[NJHusky]

All bets are off for every state school in the country, and things may be even worse at the privates.

There's a quadruple whammy coming.

1. High number if unemployed means an inability to pay for college, and students who work in the retail sector to pay for it are now unemployed. Fewer paying students.

2. State budgets are about to be decimated. They will cut subsidies to state universities by tens of millions quite soon.

3. University budgets are about to be decimated not only from losing American students, but foreign students who will not be able to easily travel to the US to resume studies.

4. We're now entering the biggest demographic trough in a generation, as the numbers of students aged 10-18 is well under the numbers of the recent past.

Schools are going to slash and burn very soon.

and people realizing you can just do it mostly online. I think this could be the seismic shift education needed. No reason why the cost of an education went up 2-3x the cost of inflation the past 40 years

 

[McLovin]

Soccer sucks anyways, but it stinks for the players though.

 

[Hey Adrien!]

@upstater You make good points, but there was a correlation between the late 00s recession and the growth of applications to good, public universities like UConn. Much more upper/middle class kids applied to the school since then.

 

[UConnTrumbull]

Soccer sucks anyways, but it stinks for the players though.

Best sport in the world just not at the collegiate level

 

[LIuconn]

Brings into question the long-term sustainability for nationwide conferences for non-rev sports. Why should Cinci spend thousands to send a team to play UCF?

Within a 4 hr drive they can play an entire season, and against good competition.

+ the totally separate discussion of top youth soccer players bypassing college for academies and pro ranks.

Schools should re-think if they field expensive, non-rev teams and what schools to align with for competitions

 

[Dooooooomed]

Brings into question the long-term sustainability for nationwide conferences for non-rev sports. Why should Cinci spend thousands to send a team to play UCF?

Within a 4 hr drive they can play an entire season, and against good competition.

+ the totally separate discussion of top youth soccer players bypassing college for academies and pro ranks.

Schools should re-think if they field expensive, non-rev teams and what schools to align with for competitions

Agreed. Cincy needs to join the MAC ASAP.

 

[BlueDogs]

There will be a lot of fall out from this, including much more online programing as schools figure out they can deliver to many more without the hard infrastructure costs. Always about the $$. Big capital intensive projects are dead and the day of country club campuses has passed. Small endowment schools will have no choice.

 

[upstater]

and people realizing you can just do it mostly online. I think this could be the seismic shift education needed. No reason why the cost of an education went up 2-3x the cost of inflation the past 40 years

But you can't. This experience has taught us that you can't.

And education went up as much as it did because we no longer subsidize it.

 

[upstater]

@upstater You make good points, but there was a correlation between the late 00s recession and the growth of applications to good, public universities like UConn. Much more upper/middle class kids applied to the school since then.

The correlation is entirely because of demographics and price/value. More students competing for fewer spots at a better price than many privates.

But the demographics have changed entirely.

 

[NJHusky]

But you can't. This experience has taught us that you can't.

And education went up as much as it did because we no longer subsidize it.

Why is a year at a community college 7500/yr while a private university can be 70k/year? Sorry, the need for country clubs camouflaged as universities is not necessary.

Why can't u do it online? EVERY college is doing it? Either those classes don't count or they can do it online

 

[QDOG5]

Cincy won't be the the last school to drop a sport during/after Covid.

 

[upstater]

Why is a year at a community college 7500/yr while a private university can be 70k/year? Sorry, the need for country clubs camouflaged as universities is not necessary.

Why can't u do it online? EVERY college is doing it? Either those classes don't count or they can do it online

1. Why worry about private colleges? They are private and only 13% of the total industry. Public schools make up 87%. Private schools do whatever they want. Most redistribute total tuition dollars to defray the overall cost. Actual cost of educating a student at privates is between $15k-$20k. Actual expenditures at publics is $25k per year per student.

You're confusing tuition with actual expenditures. The two are entirely different, and community colleges should never be compared with universities anyway.

2. Studies have shown that there's a huge learning deficit online. Whatever they are doing, they haven't figured it out yet. And anecdotally I can tell you that this spring's experience has been an enormous clusterfrig for students, and not because of the technology or the virus. It's because one, they are out of jobs, and two, they are not invested in online learning. The third & biggest problem doesn't even count yet, the fact that studies have shown online learning to be largely ineffectual.

 

[HuskyHawk]

and people realizing you can just do it mostly online. I think this could be the seismic shift education needed. No reason why the cost of an education went up 2-3x the cost of inflation the past 40 years

It's way worse than 2-3X inflation.

Paying for your college, 30 years ago vs. today

Tuition rises faster than minimum wage, early-career salaries

www.marketwatch.com

As for @upstater saying it's all about less funding, I'd say that's a part of it. A major part of the problem is the competition for students. Look at the new UConn rec center. I went inside on a tour with my daughter. It's a $100M abomination. And comes with a new mandatory fee to defray the cost. You want a place for students to work out? Encourage Planet Fitness to open near campus. Done.

Look at European colleges. No sports teams. Big classes. Many don't have dorms or common areas. You get an apartment, take public transit to campus, go to classes and that's it. There aren't thousands of funded clubs, and they are more select about what departments they have. You generally won't see nearly as many potential majors. Their costs have not risen nearly as much.

 

[HCCForever]

Why is a year at a community college 7500/yr while a private university can be 70k/year? Sorry, the need for country clubs camouflaged as universities is not necessary.

Why can't u do it online? EVERY college is doing it? Either those classes don't count or they can do it online

I believe most courses can be taught on-line except for subjects such as
Chemistry, Biology and other sciences which require lab work. BTW, I am sure glad that I went so school when I did. It was a great experience and taught me much more that coursework.

 

[Waquoit]

But you can't. This experience has taught us that you can't.
And education went up as much as it did because we no longer subsidize it.

Online classes are best for getting that piece of paper you need to check a block. But for stuff you need to actually learn it's a poor substitute.

 

[Hey Adrien!]

I believe most courses can be taught on-line except for subjects such as
Chemistry, Biology and other sciences which require lab work.

Great point. My sister is a biology professor at Sacred Heart and distance learning has been a pain for her. She told me that she feels like the only options are provide something that is nowhere near the quality of what you can do live or pretend that you are offering the same quality of education.

On the other hand, I'm a math teacher and have found the transition pretty smooth. Even though my school is much more experimental, experiential and group-work based, plenty of uses of Zoom/Google Hangouts make that happen without too many issues.

To be a step ahead, I applied to a tutoring agency after 12 years of tutoring just through word of mouth. Figured it was good due diligence just in case I need to adjust my workload if/when private schools start cutting like crazy. Even though I'm the department chair at my school, still gotta think about longevity, marketability and flexibility.

I had my first online tutoring session with a student who I normally see in person. It went surprisingly well and I re-remembered why I enjoy tutoring so much. The extra money is nice too.

 

[shakes65]

All bets are off for every state school in the country, and things may be even worse at the privates.

There's a quadruple whammy coming.

1. High number if unemployed means an inability to pay for college, and students who work in the retail sector to pay for it are now unemployed. Fewer paying students.

2. State budgets are about to be decimated. They will cut subsidies to state universities by tens of millions quite soon.

3. University budgets are about to be decimated not only from losing American students, but foreign students who will not be able to easily travel to the US to resume studies.

4. We're now entering the biggest demographic trough in a generation, as the numbers of students aged 10-18 is well under the numbers of the recent past.

Schools are going to slash and burn very soon.

Upstater is a college academic and a pretty savvy guy who has posted here for years. I will take his comments most seriously. My gut tells me we are in for some gut wrenching times as far as the University is concerned and UConn athletics, in particular.

 

[Peacefrog]

I believe most courses can be taught on-line except for subjects such as
Chemistry, Biology and other sciences which require lab work. BTW, I am sure glad that I went so school when I did. It was a great experience and taught me much more that coursework.

Yup. My daughter is finishing up her second semester online in engineering and you just can't reproduce the hands-on labs. In lieu of these they have loaded the kids up with a lot of extra written assignments. They also can't have effective discussion sessions like they had face-to-face. If things are still online come fall, I'm going to be looking for a reduction in tuition. It doesn't make sense to pay this exorbitant amount when there is zero face time with the professors and no top-notch facilities.