OT: 2017-2018 NBA Season Thread | Page 4 | The Boneyard

OT: 2017-2018 NBA Season Thread

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Kyrie playing really well keeping the Celtics in 1st despite the Hayward loss and Tatum looks great (14/7 48%fg and 50%3pt). Crowder doing nothing in CLe and IT hurt for who knows how long. Good thing Danny is running the show in Boston not @the Q
Jaylen Brown's much improved as well.

I don't know how the Bledsoe trade will confirm that Ainge overpaid, either. On the one hand, we're in the season and they shut down Bledsoe (diminishing his trade value even further than the Kyrie situation), and on the other, Bledsoe hasn't proven to be in Kyrie's league basketball-wise.
 
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Still right that Danny overpaid.

Espn even did an article about it. And the Bledsoe trade will confirm it.
No you are not. And the fact that you think you are is scary.
 

the Q

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Jaylen Brown's much improved as well.

I don't know how the Bledsoe trade will confirm that Ainge overpaid, either. On the one hand, we're in the season and they shut down Bledsoe (diminishing his trade value even further than the Kyrie situation), and on the other, Bledsoe hasn't proven to be in Kyrie's league basketball-wise.

not true.

last year they had the exact same VORP. And they were comparable in 2015-2016, although both were hit pretty hard by injuries that year.

Same contract length.

Bledsoe is a bit cheaper.
 

the Q

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No you are not. And the fact that you think you are is scary.

you don't understand the concept of opportunity cost, do you?
 
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you don't understand the concept of opportunity cost, do you?
I do, but you think you are Chad Ford and that Tatum is not good and should have been included over the Nets pick. Wrong. The nets pick will fall outside the top 5 probably, so please tell me more Knox or Walker or Sexton being better than Kyrie and Tatum.
 
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not true.

last year they had the exact same VORP. And they were comparable in 2015-2016, although both were hit pretty hard by injuries that year.

Same contract length.

Bledsoe is a bit cheaper.
I think Bledsoe is a very good player, but I'm picking Kyrie every time. And it wouldn't be close for me. But you're picking one stat here, and we all know advanced basketball stats aren't as strong as baseball ones. We need a wider picture.

Kyrie had a higher PER, higher TS%, lower TO% (Bledsoe had higher A%). He shoots the 3 better by a lot (40% to 33.5% last year), and in general (47% to 43%). Kyrie's younger by almost 3 years, and has 2 inches on Bledsoe. Kyrie's weakness is defense, but his defensive rating was identical to Bledsoe's last year. In their years in the league (and Bledsoe has had more), Bledsoe has had a VORP of 3 or more once (3.3), and had 2.9 last year. Every other year was sub-2. Irving had a VORP higher than 3 twice (3.7 and 3.3), and just below it twice (2.9 and 2.8). Bledsoe rebounds at a better rate (8 to 5 TRB%), and assists slightly better rate (31.1 to 29.7 AST%).
 

the Q

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I think Bledsoe is a very good player, but I'm picking Kyrie every time. And it wouldn't be close for me. But you're picking one stat here, and we all know advanced basketball stats aren't as strong as baseball ones. We need a wider picture.

Kyrie had a higher PER, higher TS%, lower TO% (Bledsoe had higher A%). He shoots the 3 better by a lot (40% to 33.5% last year), and in general (47% to 43%). Kyrie's younger by almost 3 years, and has 2 inches on Bledsoe. Kyrie's weakness is defense, but his defensive rating was identical to Bledsoe's last year. In their years in the league (and Bledsoe has had more), Bledsoe has had a VORP of 3 or more once (3.3), and had 2.9 last year. Every other year was sub-2. Irving had a VORP higher than 3 twice (3.7 and 3.3), and just below it twice (2.9 and 2.8). Bledsoe rebounds at a better rate (8 to 5 TRB%), and assists slightly better rate (31.1 to 29.7 AST%).

No doubt. All fair Points. Just saying their value the last 2 years has been close. But the biggest difference now is one guy has a HOF coach, and the other was in Phoenix.

It’s closer than most think. Which is why I want to see what this ends up looking like.
 
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Call me crazy but lamb fits very nicely in the starting line up... we will if he can keep this up .
He does but I think he would be fine off the bench as well as long as Clifford doesn't get wacky with his minutes. No reason why Lamb can't continue to get 25 minutes at the minimum off the bench backing up Batum/MKG, or playing alongside either of them if they slide up a position. He would be the featured scorer and secondary(and at times primary ballhandler, Clifford has been raving about his playmaking abilities) with the bench unit, plenty of opportunity to score in bunches.
 

UConnSwag11

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Do wall and beal get more love than they deserve?
 
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Wow. 14 made free throws is a career high. His previous career high, 13, came on 36 attempts.

Id be curious to kno what he did for training this summer. Anyone see any articles out there?

Ive heard of him using special shootinf sleeves and coaches before, but nothing recently.
 
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Lamb with another big game, 27pts, 9rebs, and 6 assists, but Charlotte's bench couldn't hold water against the Spurs. I'm shocked at how good Rudy looks following the Achilles tear, doesn't look sluggish at all and the Spurs have been doing a good job of identifying when he has a matchup advantage and letting him go off in spurts. He killed Kaminsky tonight.
 
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The thing that is so crazy to consider about Kemba is how good he was in college. He's gotten so much better since he entered the league that it's mind-blowing to think that his starting point was "best single season in UConn history." He doesn't really fit the model of any other star player - seemingly everybody else either made a huge leap right after college (Leonard, Butler, George, Westbrook, etc.) or continued to progress into the stud everybody thought they'd be (Davis, Towns, Griffin...). The only guy that comes to mind really - where everybody thought he was close to peaking as a dominant college player and then continued to get exponentially better in the pros - is Curry. His progression as a player is very unusual in that he made a quantum leap at both levels. A guy like Wall has gotten a lot better in the pros, but he was supposed to. Nobody saw this coming.
 

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The thing that is so crazy to consider about Kemba is how good he was in college. He's gotten so much better since he entered the league that it's mind-blowing to think that his starting point was "best single season in UConn history." He doesn't really fit the model of any other star player - seemingly everybody else either made a huge leap right after college (Leonard, Butler, George, Westbrook, etc.) or continued to progress into the stud everybody thought they'd be (Davis, Towns, Griffin...). The only guy that comes to mind really - where everybody thought he was close to peaking as a dominant college player and then continued to get exponentially better in the pros - is Curry. His progression as a player is very unusual in that he made a quantum leap at both levels. A guy like Wall has gotten a lot better in the pros, but he was supposed to. Nobody saw this coming.

Some good points -- I love trying to think of player comps in these situations, and you're right, no one that's obviously comparable.

Harden also came to my mind as someone who fits that description in many ways, though there are obvious differences.

But another example of how the game is changing, particularly with the one and dones. Not to say anything about Kemba's incredible ability and uniqueness.
 
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The Warriors are a +47 in 64 minutes with Jordan Bell on the court this season. They are a team that is bound to make any player look better than they are, but this was a situation where the team complemented the skill set of the player perfectly and I'm still floored that there were 29 other GM's who allowed this to happen. I'm not sure the significance of this marriage has quite resonated with people around the league yet. Bell is obviously an expendable piece that the Warriors would (likely) win without, but his presence, to my mind, even as a rookie, all but ensures a repeat and solidifies their monopoly on the league for the better part of the next decade.

The Golden State organization continues to re-spawn supernatural basketball players and fit them to a system that has managed to virtually void the displacement of talent. Jordan Bell's intrinsic value as a player - his draft projection, his contract, his production - is disguising the reality of what, exactly, is going on here, which is to say the Warriors are hoarding skilled, evolutionary players at a rate that speaks to a specific market inefficiency that is not being acknowledged by the rest of the league. Acquiring Durant is one matter - it just so happens that he fits seamlessly with the rest of the roster and it just so happens that he bought into the idea of deconstructing his basketball legacy to fulfill some sort of lab requirement that festered in his mind, but the point is taken that that was an easy call. Draymond Green wasn't an easy call, though, and Draymond Green was the guy that set all of this in motion. He was the undersized second round pick that old-school coach Mark Jackson refused to play. Green was the source of the rift - or at least part of it - between Jackson and GM Bob Myers. He was the dude who unleashed all of this madness and tied the knot on Steve Kerr's symphony of passing, cutting, and screening that activated the greatest shooting back court of all-time and sealed the lid to a versatile and menacing defense that elevated a pedestrian six seed to heights never seen before.

It was Draymond Green, the 35th pick in the draft in 2012, who represents the foundation of the NBA's most tenuous discovery. Fast forward five years, and the experience of watching Jordan Bell fall to 38th in the draft (Golden State bought their way in!) resembled a Mike Myers movie. He's averaging 19 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 steals, and 2 blocks per 36 minutes. He's shooting 77% from the field. His offensive rating is 138 and his defensive rating is 103. His PER is 28.2 and his BPM is 10.0. He's guarding all five positions.

The sample is still extremely small and I'm certainly not saying he's the next Draymond. I'm just saying it's emblematic of why they're miles ahead of every organization in the league besides maybe San Antonio and Boston.
 
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The Warriors are a +47 in 64 minutes with Jordan Bell on the court this season. They are a team that is bound to make any player look better than they are, but this was a situation where the team complemented the skill set of the player perfectly and I'm still floored that there were 29 other GM's who allowed this to happen. I'm not sure the significance of this marriage has quite resonated with people around the league yet. Bell is obviously an expendable piece that the Warriors would (likely) win without, but his presence, to my mind, even as a rookie, all but ensures a repeat and solidifies their monopoly on the league for the better part of the next decade.

The Golden State organization continues to re-spawn supernatural basketball players and fit them to a system that has managed to virtually void the displacement of talent. Jordan Bell's intrinsic value as a player - his draft projection, his contract, his production - is disguising the reality of what, exactly, is going on here, which is to say the Warriors are hoarding skilled, evolutionary players at a rate that speaks to a specific market inefficiency that is not being acknowledged by the rest of the league. Acquiring Durant is one matter - it just so happens that he fits seamlessly with the rest of the roster and it just so happens that he bought into the idea of deconstructing his basketball legacy to fulfill some sort of lab requirement that festered in his mind, but the point is taken that that was an easy call. Draymond Green wasn't an easy call, though, and Draymond Green was the guy that set all of this in motion. He was the undersized second round pick that old-school coach Mark Jackson refused to play. Green was the source of the rift - or at least part of it - between Jackson and GM Bob Myers. He was the dude who unleashed all of this madness and tied the knot on Steve Kerr's symphony of passing, cutting, and screening that activated the greatest shooting back court of all-time and sealed the lid to a versatile and menacing defense that elevated a pedestrian six seed to heights never seen before.

It was Draymond Green, the 35th pick in the draft in 2012, who represents the foundation of the NBA's most tenuous discovery. Fast forward five years, and the experience of watching Jordan Bell fall to 38th in the draft (Golden State bought their way in!) resembled a Mike Myers movie. He's averaging 19 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 steals, and 2 blocks per 36 minutes. He's shooting 77% from the field. His offensive rating is 138 and his defensive rating is 103. His PER is 28.2 and his BPM is 10.0. He's guarding all five positions.

The sample is still extremely small and I'm certainly not saying he's the next Draymond. I'm just saying it's emblematic of why they're miles ahead of every organization in the league besides maybe San Antonio and Boston.
I still can't believe Chicago traded him to GS for cash so they could pay Wade to play for the Cavs, it's crazy
 
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The Warriors are a +47 in 64 minutes with Jordan Bell on the court this season. They are a team that is bound to make any player look better than they are, but this was a situation where the team complemented the skill set of the player perfectly and I'm still floored that there were 29 other GM's who allowed this to happen. I'm not sure the significance of this marriage has quite resonated with people around the league yet. Bell is obviously an expendable piece that the Warriors would (likely) win without, but his presence, to my mind, even as a rookie, all but ensures a repeat and solidifies their monopoly on the league for the better part of the next decade.

The Golden State organization continues to re-spawn supernatural basketball players and fit them to a system that has managed to virtually void the displacement of talent. Jordan Bell's intrinsic value as a player - his draft projection, his contract, his production - is disguising the reality of what, exactly, is going on here, which is to say the Warriors are hoarding skilled, evolutionary players at a rate that speaks to a specific market inefficiency that is not being acknowledged by the rest of the league. Acquiring Durant is one matter - it just so happens that he fits seamlessly with the rest of the roster and it just so happens that he bought into the idea of deconstructing his basketball legacy to fulfill some sort of lab requirement that festered in his mind, but the point is taken that that was an easy call. Draymond Green wasn't an easy call, though, and Draymond Green was the guy that set all of this in motion. He was the undersized second round pick that old-school coach Mark Jackson refused to play. Green was the source of the rift - or at least part of it - between Jackson and GM Bob Myers. He was the dude who unleashed all of this madness and tied the knot on Steve Kerr's symphony of passing, cutting, and screening that activated the greatest shooting back court of all-time and sealed the lid to a versatile and menacing defense that elevated a pedestrian six seed to heights never seen before.

It was Draymond Green, the 35th pick in the draft in 2012, who represents the foundation of the NBA's most tenuous discovery. Fast forward five years, and the experience of watching Jordan Bell fall to 38th in the draft (Golden State bought their way in!) resembled a Mike Myers movie. He's averaging 19 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 steals, and 2 blocks per 36 minutes. He's shooting 77% from the field. His offensive rating is 138 and his defensive rating is 103. His PER is 28.2 and his BPM is 10.0. He's guarding all five positions.

The sample is still extremely small and I'm certainly not saying he's the next Draymond. I'm just saying it's emblematic of why they're miles ahead of every organization in the league besides maybe San Antonio and Boston.

Would Draymond be Draymond if he was drafted by the Suns? Doubtful. I think Kerr could have plugged another malleable 4 in for Green and would barely skip a beat on offense. I can't deny that his defense would be a glaring loss. And his competitive drive and intensity would definitely be missed. I might be talking myself out of my opinion. Regardless, Bell was so obviously going to become a plus role player. And now he is supercharged because of that drop. If he keeps developing and Lacob refuses to spend 400 million on salaries, the Warriors may have the ideal back up plan.

I don't know if it's nature or nurture but I was thinking of this topic Thursday night watching the Warriors Spurs. Probably a little of both. I was more prompted by the Spurs as they trotted out lineups full of undrafted players, second rounders and very late 1st rounders. The 14th pick in the draft is a crapshoot for most teams. The Spurs hit on seemingly every transaction, and the Warriors to a slightly lesser extent. They have this new 2guard from overseas/Illinois who looked very good last week. Any team in the league could have had him. It's so hard to find plus 2 way wings and now fresh off the scrap heap, it appears he is going to be the new Jon Simmons. Simmons actually is very good and is evidence of the development/scouting superiority. I think both the Warriors and Spurs have a great eye for talent but I would guess the development abilities of the staff and the system/players are more important. Regardless, it's gotta be awesome to be a guy like Pat McCaw and get drafted by the Warriors.
 
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Lebron dropped 57 points last night to become the youngest to get to 29,000 (passing Kobe) joins MJ to have 800 consecutive double digit games.

I know people like to make comparisons but if you were picking teams and someone took Mike first, no one would cry having to 'settle' for Lebron.

He still talks about still getting better at 33. Enjoy him while you can, he's unique and I will say an outstanding role model. I'm posting this because of his milestone last night:

 
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Do wall and beal get more love than they deserve?
Would have said last year they are a little over-rated because they play in the East. Well, now the East is abysmally weak, even more especially so with Boston’s outlook for this season. They better be the 2 seed
 

BUConn10

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Lebron dropped 57 points last night to become the youngest to get to 29,000 (passing Kobe) joins MJ to have 800 consecutive double digit games.

I know people like to make comparisons but if you were picking teams and someone took Mike first, no one would cry having to 'settle' for Lebron.

He still talks about still getting better at 33. Enjoy him while you can, he's unique and I will say an outstanding role model. I'm posting this because of his milestone last night:


GOAT.
 

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