Key tweets, and it's all gone to Hell.

[Waquoit]

UConn needs to crash the party. Bring DC, AK, Tristan, Samson and a few others. Oh yeah, bring Hurley and the trophy too.

Take center court with the trophy and announce the Champs are in the house ready to take on any challengers.

That would be cool if it was a work.

 

[metsfan2323]

The article is idiotic. The Big 12 doesn't need another Kansas? Well Kansas is the biggest national brand they've got.

Good point.

 

[Slasher]

Mediocre

Calling the Big 12 clearly the third best conference in football is a stretch. There's only two conferences that matter in college football, there's one conference that's way better than everyone else.

It's amazing the TV contract Yormark was able to pull off with his two football programs the country cares about in football leaving.

The article is idiotic. The Big 12 doesn't need another Kansas? Well Kansas is the biggest national brand they've got.

There's one conference in CFB that matters if we're being real. Outside of two teams OSU/Clemson the SEC has won all the Nattys. These teams have made the championship game ever since they went to a playoff:

Oregon
TCU
LSU
OSU (2)
Georgia (3)
Clemson (4)
Alabama (6)

So adding up that's 10 SEC, 4 Clemson, 2 OSU, TCU, Oregon.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

Anyone still on the Big East train after seeing the Pac 12 (10?) carry on the way they have?

Big East would be lucky to be on SNY at this rate.

 

[How Sway?!]

Anyone still on the Big East train after seeing the Pac 12 (10?) carry on the way they have?

Big East would be lucky to be on SNY at this rate.

There's 2 years before the contract expires and they are not competing with P5 conferences. The situation is not even close to being the same.

If the B12 is to be believed and basketball is undervalued, why would one of the best basketball leagues in the country with a well know brand not be able to take advantage of it?

 

[CL82]

Anyone still on the Big East train after seeing the Pac 12 (10?) carry on the way they have?

Big East would be lucky to be on SNY at this rate.

In a lot of ways the big east is better positioned to maintain or nominally grow its value. First, because it's only for basketball, the biggest contract is very affordable. So much so that even with a modest increase it still is a pretty good value for the content it provides. Second, and not in significantly, geography lends a hand. Being in the eastern time zone makes it's basketball games more useful.

Keep in mind that relative value drives that analysis. If the Big East walks away with 8 million per school in its next contract negotiation, that would be viewed as a pretty significant win, nearly doubling the existing value of the broadcast rights.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

There's 2 years before the contract expires and they are not competing with P5 conferences. The situation is not even close to being the same.

If the B12 is to be believed and basketball is undervalued, why would one of the best basketball leagues in the country with a well know brand not be able to take advantage of it?

In a lot of ways the big east is better positioned to maintain or nominally grow its value. First, because it's only for basketball, the biggest contract is very affordable. So much so that even with a modest increase it still is a pretty good value for the content it provides. Second, and not in significantly, geography lends a hand. Being in the eastern time zone makes it's basketball games more useful.

Keep in mind that relative value drives that analysis. If the Big East walks away with 8 million per school in its next contract negotiation, that would be viewed as a pretty significant win, nearly doubling the existing value of the broadcast rights.

The amount of slots on premium linear channels is finite - I'm less concerned with money than exposure.

In that sense to @How Sway?! comment they are absolutely competing with p5 leagues for air time. ESPN is all in on the acc / sec and Fox is all in on big ten / big 12 (with some crossover between the two). Those leagues all have tv deals and have expanded with additional programs and content since the last go around.

Simply put, in a vacuum your points aren't wrong per se, but once again the timing of the Big East deal is going to be awful.

 

[CL82]

The amount of slots on premium linear channels is finite - I'm less concerned with money than exposure.

In that sense to @How Sway?! comment they are absolutely competing with p5 leagues for air time. ESPN is all in on the acc / sec and Fox is all in on big ten / big 12 (with some crossover between the two). Those leagues all have tv deals and have expanded with additional programs and content since the last go around.

Simply put, in a vacuum your points aren't wrong per se, but once again the timing of the Big East deal is going to be awful.

Define awful. Is it $5 million per school per year? Because that would be like a 20% increase over the big east current deal. There are only a limited amount of viewing slots to go around. If networks can fill them with relatively inexpensive, yet watchable, content that is desirable for advertisers, doesn't that maximize revenue?

Part of the PAC 12's issue is that their content is "expensive" and less usable given their time zone. The big east doesn't have either one of those issues.

 

[UConnJim]

Mediocre

Calling the Big 12 clearly the third best conference in football is a stretch. There's only two conferences that matter in college football, there's one conference that's way better than everyone else.

It's amazing the TV contract Yormark was able to pull off with his two football programs the country cares about in football leaving.

The article is idiotic. The Big 12 doesn't need another Kansas? Well Kansas is the biggest national brand they've got.

If you use the Sagarin ratings and adjust for the loss of Texas and Oklahoma and the additions of UCF, BYU, Cincinnati, and Houston, the Big 12 is the 3rd ranked football conference in 2022. If you do the same adjustment for basketball, the Big 12 is still the top ranked conference last year.

I think people are missing out on the big picture with the Big 12. The repositioned Big 12 is the clear #3 conference and it is more stable than the ACC or Pac 12 and it will be attractive for future conference refugees. And, we all know that conference consolidation is not over. If we are going to 20 team conferences down the road, the Big 12 will be an attractive landing spot.

 

[giddyup]

So what is clearly the 3rd best football league in the country is not very good in your opinion. When we were in the Big East we were in the 6th best football league and we loved it. There is a pecking order in college football and the B12 may be short an elite team, but TCU certainly seems close to filling the void.

Why are you using logic with a Mets fan? They hopelessly cling to sentimentality in lieu of dealing with reality.

 

[superjohn]

There's one conference in CFB that matters if we're being real. Outside of two teams OSU/Clemson the SEC has won all the Nattys. These teams have made the championship game ever since they went to a playoff:

Oregon
TCU
LSU
OSU (2)
Georgia (3)
Clemson (4)
Alabama (6)

So adding up that's 10 SEC, 4 Clemson, 2 OSU, TCU, Oregon.

Agreed but people still watch Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State....Those are name brands throughout the country. The Big 12 doesn't have that now that Oklahoma and Texas are leaving.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

Define awful. Is it $5 million per school per year? Because that would be like a 20% increase over the big east current deal. There are only a limited amount of viewing slots to go around. If networks can fill them with relatively inexpensive, yet watchable, content that is desirable for advertisers, doesn't that maximize revenue?

Part of the PAC 12's issue is that their content is "expensive" and less usable given their time zone. The big east doesn't have either one of those issues.

Awful as in the sense that the linear broadcast spots have already been spoken by leagues that have bigger brands, better ratings, and more expensive TV deals.

In the scheme of our financials $1-$2M a year is immaterial to the success or failure of our programs.. being resigned to behind a paywall/CBS sports network is a much bigger issue.

There were other purely financial considerations (travel, tickets, etc.) that prompted us to leave the AAC but that TV deal in total would have paid us more than FS and cbs sports network have. But we traded dollars for exposure (again host of other reasons but just talking $).

Unfortunately I don't think there's an alternative path here.

 

[Husky68]

Mediocre

Calling the Big 12 clearly the third best conference in football is a stretch. There's only two conferences that matter in college football, there's one conference that's way better than everyone else.

It's amazing the TV contract Yormark was able to pull off with his two football programs the country cares about in football leaving.

The article is idiotic. The Big 12 doesn't need another Kansas? Well Kansas is the biggest national brand they've got.

Interesting question as who is best and spread through top 3 or 4 conferences in football. Went to my ol' standby "Massey" to see their end 2022 ratings by conference P5 adjusted for teams transferring in and out (excluded ND). Show below overall average conference ratings, best rated team, median rated team and worst rated teams:

Sec 29.8, 1, 24, 76
B10 36.9, 3, 28, 97
B12 39.3, 7, 42, 63
ACC 52.0, 10, 49, 96
PAC 53.0, 11, 60, 117

How to judge, decided would take average team ratings by conference and judge each by how much higher the average was vs. the next worst team (i.e, is there more % difference between best the SEC and 2nd best the B10 or 3rd best B12 and the 4th best ACC, etc.)

B10 vs. SEC is = 24% higher
B12 vs. B10 is = 7% higher
Acc vs. B12 is = 32% higher
PAC vs. Acc is = 2% higher

Based on above would suggest that B12 is quite clearly # 3 football conference and is closer to B10 than would have thought.
Also interesting:

1. How much one bad team impacts conference averages with Colorado being #117 in 2022 and bringing up the averaged for Pac10 from 46 to 53.
2. How close B12 average was to B10 (vs. difference from SEC to B10).
3. B12 had by far the "least bad team" as bottom dweller in Kansas at #63 where even SEC had a #76 in Vanderbilt.
4. How bad the ex BE teams at time of BCU leaving were overall:
Pitt #28, Fruit #54, Miami # 71, Rutgers # 81, BCU # 95, VT #96. Good thing for ACC they picked good football schools.

 

[auggie22]

Interesting question as who is best and spread through top 3 or 4 conferences in football. Went to my ol' standby "Massey" to see their end 2022 ratings by conference P5 adjusted for teams transferring in and out (excluded ND). Show below overall average conference ratings, best rated team, median rated team and worst rated teams:

Sec 29.8, 1, 24, 76
B10 36.9, 3, 28, 97
B12 39.3, 7, 42, 63
ACC 52.0, 10, 49, 96
PAC 53.0, 11, 60, 117

How to judge, decided would take average team ratings by conference and judge each by how much higher the average was vs. the next worst team (i.e, is there more % difference between best the SEC and 2nd best the B10 or 3rd best B12 and the 4th best ACC, etc.)

B10 vs. SEC is = 24% higher
B12 vs. B10 is = 7% higher
Acc vs. B12 is = 32% higher
PAC vs. Acc is = 2% higher

Based on above would suggest that B12 is quite clearly # 3 football conference and is closer to B10 than would have thought.
Also interesting:

1. How much one bad team impacts conference averages with Colorado being #117 in 2022 and bringing up the averaged for Pac10 from 46 to 53.
2. How close B12 average was to B10 (vs. difference from SEC to B10).
3. B12 had by far the "least bad team" as bottom dweller in Kansas at #63 where even SEC had a #76 in Vanderbilt.
4. How bad the ex BE teams at time of BCU leaving were overall:
Pitt #28, Fruit #54, Miami # 71, Rutgers # 81, BCU # 95, VT #96. Good thing for ACC they picked good football schools.

I doubt I’ll find it but I was also surprised at how much higher the football ratings were for big 12 teams relative to ACC. Granted a league without Oklahoma and Texas will take a step back in prestige but my bet is they will still be #3 in ratings without them.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Agreed but people still watch Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State....Those are name brands throughout the country. The Big 12 doesn't have that now that Oklahoma and Texas are leaving.

Correct, but the money is good, competition is good and there should be enough compelling match ups for UConn fans.

10 years from now you reassess your options.

 

[Husky68]

I doubt I’ll find it but I was also surprised at how much higher the football ratings were for big 12 teams relative to ACC. Granted a league without Oklahoma and Texas will take a step back in prestige but my bet is they will still be #3 in ratings without them.

Ratings I did was with Ok. and Texas out of B12 and Houston, Cin. BYU and UCF in so unless B12 falls apart or ACC or PAC get way better the B12 should still be solid #3 even before the UConn sleeping (maybe not longer sleeping) giant arrives. UConn only needs to move up to #94 to be better than a 2022 BCU and be the best Div 1 football team in New England and to #53 to be better than any team in southern Canada.

 

[noeynox]

Could be nothing

 

[UConn Dan]

Could be nothing

Not CR related. Looks like it's related the misconduct allegations.

 

[noeynox]

Not CR related. Looks like it's related the misconduct allegations.

Didn't know those existed.

 

[CL82]

Awful as in the sense that the linear broadcast spots have already been spoken by leagues that have bigger brands, better ratings, and more expensive TV deals.

In the scheme of our financials $1-$2M a year is immaterial to the success or failure of our programs.. being resigned to behind a paywall/CBS sports network is a much bigger issue.

There were other purely financial considerations (travel, tickets, etc.) that prompted us to leave the AAC but that TV deal in total would have paid us more than FS and cbs sports network have. But we traded dollars for exposure (again host of other reasons but just talking $).

Unfortunately I don't think there's an alternative path here.

I'm not sure that it actually was a better deal on a net basis. At the time Susan Herbst said that our travel costs were approximately $2 million. So, in a quick and dirty computation, big east media distributions, plus the $2 million travel savings, plus the half million we get from CBS Sportsnet totals effectively to about $7 million. I feel as if that's a fairly close approximation of what the American teams were getting in the first year of the contract. Keep in mind that the American deal also required schools to bear the TV production cost for all sports except for football. Being in the Big East probably was at worst a "breakeven choice."

But I agree with you it wasn't a financial decision it was an exposure decision, including particularly the fact that woman's basketball was going to be put behind a pay wall rather than be readily available on SNY.

 

[gioff2323]

There's one conference in CFB that matters if we're being real. Outside of two teams OSU/Clemson the SEC has won all the Nattys. These teams have made the championship game ever since they went to a playoff:

Oregon
TCU
LSU
OSU (2)
Georgia (3)
Clemson (4)
Alabama (6)

So adding up that's 10 SEC, 4 Clemson, 2 OSU, TCU, Oregon.

While the SEC is head and shoulders above others, your data suggests there are 4 schools and everyone else.

 

[gioff2323]

Per Wash Post — Stanford University President Marc Tessier-Lavigne announced Wednesday he will resign after an investigative report found he had failed to correct mistakes in years-old scientific papers and overseen labs that had an “unusual frequency” of manipulations of data.

 

[noeynox]

Per Wash Post — Stanford University President Marc Tessier-Lavigne announced Wednesday he will resign after an investigative report found he had failed to correct mistakes in years-old scientific papers and overseen labs that had an “unusual frequency” of manipulations of data.

Sounds like science.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

I'm not sure that it actually was a better deal on a net basis. At the time Susan Herbst said that our travel costs were approximately $2 million. So, in a quick and dirty computation, big east media distributions, plus the $2 million travel savings, plus the half million we get from CBS Sportsnet totals effectively to about $7 million. I feel as if that's a fairly close approximation of what the American teams were getting in the first year of the contract. Keep in mind that the American deal also required schools to bear the TV production cost for all sports except for football. Being in the Big East probably was at worst a "breakeven choice."

But I agree with you it wasn't a financial decision it was an exposure decision, including particularly the fact that woman's basketball was going to be put behind a pay wall rather than be readily available on SNY.

The Big East was able to negotiate it's first deal with Fox when the network was beginning to acquire content and needed quite a bit of winter programming.

If anything the Big East in a vacuum is much more valuable product in 2023 with UConn then after the original break, but I'm highly concerned there's just not going to be much demand to showcase the product on FS1 the way it used to be.

 

[shizzle787]

The Big East was able to negotiate it's first deal with Fox when the network was beginning to acquire content and needed quite a bit of winter programming.

If anything the Big East in a vacuum is much more valuable product in 2023 with UConn then after the original break, but I'm highly concerned there's just not going to be much demand to showcase the product on FS1 the way it used to be.

If FOX doesn’t get a piece of the Pac-12, the only other leagues FOX will have are the B1G and Big 12, and both of these leagues have multiple TV partners.