Wooden Award Top 20

[Plebe]

Lou and Gabby made it, but no Pheesa

John R. Wooden Award Presented By Wendy's Announces 2016-17 Late Season Top 20

Lindsay Allen
Kristine Anigwe
Jordin Canada
Alaina Coates
Nia Coffey
Makayla Epps
Alexis Jones
Brionna Jones
Erica McCall
Kelsey Mitchell
Chantel Osahor
Alexis Peterson
Kelsey Plum
Katie Lou Samuelson
Brianna Turner
Victoria Vivians
Shatori Walker-Kimbrough
Sydney Weise [sic]
Gabby Williams
A'ja Wilson

 

[triaddukefan]

No Lexie Brown?

 

[Dawson]

I was just about to type that I would put Napheesa before Gabby, but I'm not sure I would. I would make them a 1a and 1b situation. Napheesa is deadly accurate from the floor, a great rebounder and puts up POINTS.

Gabby is just incredible. She's averaging over 5 assists a game, with a greater than 2-1 A/TO ratio. She also averages almost as many rebounds as Pheesa. She leads the team in steals and is second in blocks to...you guessed it... Napheesa! That goes the other way about with with the steals, with Pheesa coming in second to Gabby. Both of these players are incredible and invaluable.

 

[Vowelguy]

the 10 who made Naismith 30 but not Wooden 20

Collier
Lexie Brown
Letiica Romero
Shakayla Thomas
Asia Durr
Myisha Hines-Allen
Arike Ogunbowale
Tori Jankoska
DD
Mercedes R

 

[NoelAustin]

So Pheesa is not one of the 20 best...Am I in an alternative universe? I suppose this might give her added incentive when she goes up against her superiors Wilson and Coates in less than a week.

 

[hoophuskee]

If UCONN beats USC next week and Collier has a big game this list is going to look ridiculously stupid.

 

[triaddukefan]

If UCONN beats USC next week and Collier has a big game this list is going to look ridiculously stupid.

And what if she doesnt have a big game?

 

[hoophuskee]

And what if she doesnt have a big game?

What if she has a good game and UCONN wins?

UCONN's toughest opponents have been Fla State, Baylor, Texas, ND, Ohio Sate, and Md.

In those games vs their toughest opponents she has averaged 19.5 ppg, shooting 61.8%. So if she does her average vs the top tier teams, what do you think? Would she belong?

 

[triaddukefan]

What if she has a good game and UCONN wins?

UCONN's toughest opponents have been Fla State, Baylor, Texas, ND, Ohio Sate, and Md.

In those games vs their toughest opponents she has averaged 19.5 ppg, shooting 61.8%. So if she does her average vs the top tier teams, what do you think? Would she belong?

I suppose so. But who would you take off the list?

 

[Plebe]

I suppose so. But who would you take off the list?

It's become almost cliché on this board to go after Turner, but to me she seems like the weak link on this list. Maybe it's a subconscious backlash against the hype that's always surrounded her, which she rarely seems to live up to. And her improvement since freshman year seems only slight to me, aside from the fact that she's probably setting an NCAA record for alley-oops. I wouldn't call her undeserving, but more deserving than Queen Napheesa? I'm not usually such a homer when it comes to awards, but I'm not seeing it.

 

[hoophuskee]

I suppose so. But who would you take off the list?

Which of the two USC should be on there if Collier outplays one or both considering none of the UConn players will get NPOY?

IS it right to have the same number of players on the list between UCONN, USC and ND if UCONN wins next week and Collier has "just" a "good game" showing she is basically unstoppable? It's not like UCONN has Stewart or Maya. Why would the other teams have the same number of players while UCONN has won 3 more games in which Collier didn't have any clunkers vs the dangerous teams? The others have had clunkers in big games. Why wouldn't that count - vs Collier having nothing but good to great games ALONG WITH her stats are as good as anyone's other than a player like Plum?

Her fg% is 68.7 while she is averaging over 19.5 per game -- and if you add in her AMAZING reg. season efg% -it is 70.36%. If UCONN wins and she players well, she would have proven to be an unstoppable weapon every big game throughout the season. We can point to clunkers of Coates or the two ND players and eliminate one of them, can't we? For example, Collier vs Turner. Collier has averaged more points, shoots better from the floor and at the ft line, averages more rebounds and has more assists plus a better assist to turnover ratio and has more steals. Plus Turner so far is a train-wreck passing the ball and clunks free throws. While the ft's aren't "that important? Collier shoots 79.5% vs 60.4%. The point is Collier is WAY more efficient. This year Turner has just 29 assists vs 50 turnovers.

 

[chuck.r]

I suppose so. But who would you take off the list?

Mikayla Epps or Erica McCall. Easily. Frankly, she could replace Brianna Turner, IMO.

 

[triaddukefan]

It's become almost cliché on this board to go after Turner, but to me she seems like the weak link on this list. Maybe it's a subconscious backlash against the hype that's always surrounded her, which she rarely seems to live up to. And her improvement since freshman year seems only slight to me, aside from the fact that she's probably setting an NCAA record for alley-oops. I wouldn't call her undeserving, but more deserving than Queen Napheesa? I'm not usually such a homer when it comes to awards, but I'm not seeing it.

I knew that would be the first player mentioned.....

So who would you take off to include Lexie Brown ?

Mikayla Epps or Erica McCall. Easily. Frankly, she could replace Brianna Turner, IMO.

So who would you take off to include Lexie Brown ?

 

[Plebe]

I knew that would be the first player mentioned....

So you asked a question to which you already knew the answer?

So who would you take off to include Lexie Brown ?

Well, it would need to be an ACC player, so let's just make it a clean leprechaun sweep and take off Allen.

 

[triaddukefan]

So you asked a question to which you already knew the answer?



Well, it would need to be an ACC player, so let's just make it a clean leprechaun sweep and take off Allen.

How bout her old teammate from Maryland...... #32

 

[Suebird10fan]

I suppose so. But who would you take off the list?

I would take Collier over any of them, except maybe Kelsey Plum. In many cases (Vivians and Epps come to mind) it's not remotely close. For many she is far superior in almost every statistical category.

 

[chuck.r]

So who would you take off to include Lexie Brown ?

Actually, Mikayla Epps would be a bad swap for Collier, as Epps is a point guard. But Epps and Brown are pretty even statistically, and both are guards, so there's a nominee.

 

[warbler1055]

This list is stupid beyond compare. I would argue that Collier is among top 15 easily and by far!!!

 

[Roundball fan]

Lists are not why we root for our girls. We can't control what others think, our girls just win and that's why they play the game. We all watch because of how they play, poetry in motion. I will put the team on my wall.

 

[CL82]

So Pheesa is not one of the 20 best..Am I in an alternative universe? I suppose this might give her added incentive when she goes up against her superiors Wilson and Coates in less than a week.

 

[Suebird10fan]

Compare Collier to Vivians.

• Collier has 45 more points on 99 fewer shots. (FG% 687 vs 396!!!)
• 3 point FG% Collier is better 375 to 321
• FT% Collier is better 795 to 744
• Rebounds obviously not close
• Collier has more assists 51 to 35
• Collier has fewer TOs 31 to 44
• Blocks obviously not close
• Collier has more steals 44 to 42

I realize Vivians is a guard and Collier is a post but come on, look at the numbers! Vivians is a guard but has fewer assists and fewer steals! What shred of evidence is there to hang on to to suggest that Vivians is anywhere near as good as Collier?

And a statistical comparison would tell a similar story with at least half a dozen on the list.

 

[Orangutan]

It's become almost cliché on this board to go after Turner, but to me she seems like the weak link on this list. Maybe it's a subconscious backlash against the hype that's always surrounded her, which she rarely seems to live up to. And her improvement since freshman year seems only slight to me, aside from the fact that she's probably setting an NCAA record for alley-oops. I wouldn't call her undeserving, but more deserving than Queen Napheesa? I'm not usually such a homer when it comes to awards, but I'm not seeing it.

 

[HuskyFan1125]

While I agree that Collier should be on the list I'm more interested in who she replaces?!?


Epps?

I'm actually ok with Vivians and McCall. I would definitely have Lexie Brown over Epps!??

It gets edited again before end of season.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Compare Collier to Vivians.
I realize Vivians is a guard and Collier is a post but come on, look at the numbers!

With all due respect, it is not just difficult to compare a guard to a post...

It is also impossible to compare statistics for someone like Vivians who has some good players around her, with Collier, who has KLS (top rated player in her class), Gabby Williams, Kia Nurse, Crystal Dangerfield, etc. around her. There is a difference when one is undoubtedly the best player on a team with role players around her and a team with a few superstars and a good number of players who were elite at their positions in high school.

You could make a better argument about stats with respect to teams with similar or comparable talent levels. For example, Mitchell vs. Collier. Different positions. But Ohio State has a lot of talent and some really elite players, as does UConn. For Vivians, a better example might be Kelsey Plum, who has Oshafor (ESPN ranked her as the 71st best recruit) and Romeo (ESPN #58) around her.

Personally, I WOULD have had Collier on the list. I also would have Lexie Brown on the list. Open to another player.
I would remove Lindsey Allen (her assists are up, but scoring is down, and she is not as much as a difference maker as she was last year on a better ND squad), Victoria Vivians (.396 from the floor, .321 from three overall; .363 from the floor, .305 from three in conference games; played the fewest games against the Top 25 per Sagarin), Erica McCall (compare Karlie Samuelson's numbers to McCall's, especially in terms of shooting; McCall may be the leading scorer, but is not the best player on her team.

As for Epps, she has very good overall numbers...better than Vivians. And she has really stepped it up in conference games (16,9 ppg, 4.9 rpg, 3,3 apg, 45.4 percent from the floor, 41.7 percent from three, while having to play 37.1 minutes per game).

 

[triaddukefan]

Monique Billings of UCLA should arguably be on this list as well. Im not sure if she made the cut for the other lists.