Why? Basketball, that's why.

[Carl Spackler]

I keep coming back to the same one word....why?
Why syracuse and pitt? why the acc? why why why?

Syracuse and Pitt...football powerhouses? Not for a long time now. Big draws to a football stadium down south? Umm. No. Pitt traveling fans? Yeah right, we're doing better with travelers and we've been at it for a couple years with teh big boys.

Everybody, including me, has been assuming this is about football. TV contracts. Football drives the bus athletically is the old cliche, and it's true. Football is the biggest money maker you can build, and it is where all the television money is going.

The esteemed Tranghese went on national TV whining about football and integrity and loyalty. I'm concerned about football because UConn football is swinging in the breeze right now.

But I keep coming back to why - and the answer i'm getting is...basketball, not football.

Syracuse brings the NY media market in college football? Nope. Pittsburgh brings a major market in college football? Not really, nope. ACC football didn't just add much at all when it comes to TV contracts and football.

It just doesn't make sense. This was either a panic move by the Syracuse and Pittsburgh based on little faith in the big east leadership (can't blame them for being nervous) and it happened behind closed doors that the leadership of the ACC jumped on to weaken the basketball stronghold of the big east on the entire college basketball landscape, or there's really just some personal agenda's involved here from people in positions of power that we'll never know about.

In the long run, I can't see how this will turn out well for Pitt or Syracuse, IF some kind of northeastern all sports league with geographic sense doesn't get put together.

I think that the ACC better seriously be thinking about going to the 16 to solidify the all sports in the northeast, or they're just going to be stuck with two more versions of what they've got in Boston college in Pitt and Syracuse, and nobody down south is going to care about them, and in turn, nobody in the their own backyards is going to care about them.

There is a lot to be said about regional rivalry, and as our university president lays out, the regional rivalries are based on student athletes, and students actually ahve to go to class, and you can't go to class when it takes you three or four days to go play a softball game, or compete in a swim meet every other week.

I don't see this turning out well for either Syracuse or Pitt long term if the ACC fails to add the only other schools that make sense in a 16 team conference,a nd that's us and Rutgers.

West Virginia? Oh man, Frothing at mouth out there in morgantown, if I'm them.

Maybe that's me being vindictive, probably. But is it that unreasonable?

Either way, the more I think about it, and the more time that passes from the shock, the clearer it becomes that football, and television contracts around football, had very little to do with this move at all on both the Pitt/Cuse and ACC sides, aside from the obvious fact that everybody involved knew that the big east football situation would be a mess after it happened, which would then significantly impact big east basketball.

ACC football has major issues facing them, that aside from being in an all sports conference that's pretty much unified, were no different than the problems that big east football had. Their BCS automatic qualifying status didn't get improved by adding syracuse and pitt.

They didn't have the media black sheep badge, the big east has that's all. They've got several programs that are in trouble with the NCAA. We don't. The death penalty word was actually put in play around Miami just a few weeks ago.

Syracuse and Pitt moving to the ACC?

So - my answer is why did it happen? Basketball - not football.

Just trying to reason a little bit out here. Not sure what any of it means, but I am becoming convinced that football, and television contracts around football, had very little to do with any of this, and that makes me even less confident in big east leadership.

But the more I think about that, the more I wonder why UConn basketball was not in those back rooms behind closed doors in the dark.

and the more I think about that, I'm pretty glad that we weren't, because that's not the way I want the school to operate.

Mr. Calhoun and Mr. Pitino though, I'm very sure want to know WTF is up, because the smoke and mirrors says it's about football, but in reality, it's just not.

 

[whaler11]

If it happened because of basketball, UConn wouldn't be sitting around waiting to find out if the ACC can do better than them for number 15.

 

[businesslawyer]

The concensus on this board is that football branding is irrelevant. That what is important is how you've done the past five years. And this board sticks to that like glue. Notre Dame? Irrelevant. Syracuse? Irrelevant. Michigan? largely irrelevant. Miami? No one cares. And this board sticks to that position no matter how many times networks pay more for brand names and televise brand name games in the prime viewing slots as opposed to more interesting games.

Note to all -- get a friggin grip. Branding is everything in college football. It's why Notre Dame can lose 5 of 6 games to the Big East over a prolonged period of time and still be viewed as in a different straosphere. The ACC took the two Big East football teams with the best brand names developed over the last fifty years. No amount of denying that is going to change the reality of the situation.

 

[CTMike]

I can sort of understand why you wrote what you did, except you kind of shoot yourself in the foot with the fact that UConn wasn't included. Why did they pick Pitt and Syracuse, as opposed to UConn and Syracuse, or UConn and Pitt, is a question though...

... and BL answers the question. Nice. haha

 

[8893]

Congratulations. This is the first I've heard anyone suggest that this isn't all about football and TV contracts.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Brand names. Football. Yes. I don't believe for a second that Swofford was taking Syracuse and Pitt along for the brand name alone, and if the football brand name is the only reason that UConn wasn't in the closed rooms,I suppose that's possible, but it doesn't say a whole hell of a lot about the smarts involved in whatever went down, and I believe even less that any TV network is going to be throwing tons of money at the ACC now because they've added Syracuse and Pittsburgh football.

But I think the most important part of my long winded thing, is that this move is going to turn out bad for Syracuse and Pitt with only Boston College as a regional opponent.

Sooner or later, an all sports, northeastern intercollegiate athletic conference is going to have to form. There's just too much money and too many people involved not for it to happen.

But I'm putting on my AD hat here. There are how many sports taht a college must have to support a division 1-A status? Enjoy getting every single one of your teams on the road in the new configuration.

Boston College is loving Cuse and Pitt coming, because misery loves company. Boston College since leaving the big east has become irrelevant in their own backyard.

The same thing is going to happen to Pitt and Cuse, competiting with the rest of the ACC in a 14 team schedule, and having Maryland and Boston College as their closest regional competition.

I don't think I"m being vindictive in saying that, I think it's true.

I don't agree with Boeheim much, but I think it's a dumb move on the part of Syracuse and Pittsburgh.

 

[whaler11]

What schools exactly would make up a Northeastern all sports conference?

Boston College isn't irrelevant because they joined the ACC. They are irrelevant because Boston has had a ridiculous run of pro sports success and the athletic department is run by idiots.

 

[06029]

Ask your average CFB fan anywhere to name Pitt players. They will easily say Tony Dorsett and Dan Marino. Ask them to name Cuse FB plaers. Easily they will say Jim Brown and McNabb. Ask them to name a Uconn FB player. They will if one of them is on the pro team they want otherwise they will be pretty silent.

There is no doubt that having a BB profile as high as both Pitt and Cuse helped ease their way into the ACC since all Duke and UNC really care about is BB. They want ACC BB to be the undisputed king of BB (which they have not been). But their FB profile moved them to the top of the list.

As far as whether it is dumb or not, maybe they were disappointed that the BE stabilization plan involved a tier 2 TX school and moving FCS Nova up. Despite some assertions that there was going to be some really huge TV contract for the BE, they may have had some information that the ESPN offer was as good as it gets. The bottom line, they are gone for whatever reasons they had and they can now sit back and watch knowing they have some stability and security for their school.

BTW, I think all of the ACC schools are closer to both schools than Waco. The BE is now the poster child for grabbing teams with no regard to regional competition.

 

[danlow1963]

The concensus on this board is that football branding is irrelevant. That what is important is how you've done the past five years. And this board sticks to that like glue. Notre Dame? Irrelevant. Syracuse? Irrelevant. Michigan? largely irrelevant. Miami? No one cares. And this board sticks to that position no matter how many times networks pay more for brand names and televise brand name games in the prime viewing slots as opposed to more interesting games.

Note to all -- get a friggin grip. Branding is everything in college football. It's why Notre Dame can lose 5 of 6 games to the Big East over a prolonged period of time and still be viewed as in a different straosphere. The ACC took the two Big East football teams with the best brand names developed over the last fifty years. No amount of denying that is going to change the reality of the situation.

+ 100000

 

[gars44]

Can someone summarize the OP for me?

 

[ConnHuskBask]

So, Pittsburgh and Syracuse's programs will suffer in the Northeast, because they are in the ACC are we remain in reconfigured Big East with Big 12 leftovers. Got it.

 

[SAMCRO]

Can someone summarize the OP for me?

Yada, yada, yada, repeat 1000 times, and in conclusion football and tv contracts had very little to do with why SU and Pitt were selected.

 

[businesslawyer]

Can someone summarize the OP for me?

Thank you Gars. The best laugh I've had since I was thrown into worry mode on Saturday.

 

[SubbaBub]

The concensus on this board is that football branding is irrelevant. That what is important is how you've done the past five years. And this board sticks to that like glue. Notre Dame? Irrelevant. Syracuse? Irrelevant. Michigan? largely irrelevant. Miami? No one cares. And this board sticks to that position no matter how many times networks pay more for brand names and televise brand name games in the prime viewing slots as opposed to more interesting games.

Note to all -- get a friggin grip. Branding is everything in college football. It's why Notre Dame can lose 5 of 6 games to the Big East over a prolonged period of time and still be viewed as in a different straosphere. The ACC took the two Big East football teams with the best brand names developed over the last fifty years. No amount of denying that is going to change the reality of the situation.

Branding in this case is shorthand for fan following and interest levels. ND, Syr, Mich, and Miami (at least as a TV property) all still have it in spite of lacking is recent on-field success. Our brand at the moment is still theoretical at best.

 

[businesslawyer]

Branding in this case is shorthand for fan following and interest levels. ND, Syr, Mich, and Miami (at least as a TV property) all still have it in spite of lacking is recent on-field success. Our brand at the moment is still theoretical at best.

I think more interest level for the general population. There are teams with reasonable numbers of their own fans, but who no one outside their own fanbase cares a whit about. I think BYU is an example of this. Compare it to Navy -- BYU probably has more core fans -- higher attendance and higher merchandising sales -- but I'd bet you that navy has more branding, and everything else being equal draws more people who aren't core fans to the TV set.

 

[gioff23]

Carl,

Ever play risk? Swofford, personal feelings for what he did to the BE aside, made a great strategic move. He potentially cut off the B10's move east and forced us (and RU) in to the game we are now playing. It was a great strategic move for the ACC.

We and RU are now the ugly girls left at the bar when the lights come on - they can take us home if they can't court the cute Irish chick trying to remain independent or the cowgirl in the big jeans swigging her beer at the bar while bragging about her new reality show. But we're not going anywhere while we try to get tehri attention. They are not going home alone, but they cock blocked the B10 while they figure out who gets the ride home.

Your move.