Those who don't remember history.... | The Boneyard

Those who don't remember history....

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The original Big East held on much longer than it should've but the death warrant was signed in the early 80s when Penn State was turned down for membership by a group of small catholic colleges who couldn't see beyond their own self-interest to meet the needs of the other member institutions or to understand just how important football would become to the future survival of major college programs.

A conference with Penn State and eventually Miami, West Virginia, etc would've been a likely survivor as a P5/P6 (the Big XII may well have ended up being the loser) and those same small catholic colleges would have enjoyed an enhanced payout bolstered by the status earned by those larger schools. Beyond that they wouldn't have to sweat out the potential of being left behind when those major conferences eventually leave the NCAA (or split to form some new division).

It's fairly ironic that after being burned by those colleges UConn (which while it hadn't been wise enough to step up yet, at least was wise enough to vote yes on Penn State) now has decided to throw its lot back with those same catholic colleges. Those same disparate interests. The only public school, the only full FBS football school, still the highest athletic department budget now in another group of schools unlikely to care or respect the needs/interests of the institution. The kind of short-term foolish thinking that kills not just the football program, but ultimately the rest of the athletic department.

Ironically all the other schools who supported Penn State's admission managed to find their way to greener pastures and a future.. while UConn has decided voluntarily to get back together with the group that couldn't see past their own self interest to support the needs of their conference brethren originally. Yep, each of those small catholic schools are once again going to be depended on by UConn for its own survival, hope it goes better this time.
 
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Was Penn State going to be Big East in football? Or just non football sports?
 
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I believe the Penn state vote was before big east football. However if they were in the basketball conference when the football thing started they likely would have joined that. They were independent at the time if I recall.
 
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At the time the Big East had yet to sponsor football; essentially Penn State was trying to pull Syracuse and BC away; they held firm and instead Penn State applied. When schools started to jump into conferences for football Penn State would've have likely joined BC and Syracuse in the Big East football conference, the assumption would be that Miami is still invited and joins and it goes from there...

The other irony is Rutgers was originally considered for Seton Hall's spot. If that had changed.. the whole history of the conference may have been altered.
 
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It's also interesting to think about what would have happened if Villanova was able to figure out its FB stadium issue in 2011. I think their big plan all along was to use the soccer stadium and play Big East ball.

Of course, that plan was scoffed at by the big schools. Rightly so, especially given (the funny part) Nova was trying to backchannel an ACC invite the entire time.

 
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Nova was offered the same upgrade deal as UConn in the 90s.. they declined then (of course this is the resurrected program, at the time of the Penn State vote they had recently dropped football).
 
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Nova dropped IA football in 1981 and nearly 40 years later are still clawing their way back. Worst devision they ever made.
 

nelsonmuntz

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The original Big East held on much longer than it should've but the death warrant was signed in the early 80s when Penn State was turned down for membership by a group of small catholic colleges who couldn't see beyond their own self-interest to meet the needs of the other member institutions or to understand just how important football would become to the future survival of major college programs.

A conference with Penn State and eventually Miami, West Virginia, etc would've been a likely survivor as a P5/P6 (the Big XII may well have ended up being the loser) and those same small catholic colleges would have enjoyed an enhanced payout bolstered by the status earned by those larger schools. Beyond that they wouldn't have to sweat out the potential of being left behind when those major conferences eventually leave the NCAA (or split to form some new division).

It's fairly ironic that after being burned by those colleges UConn (which while it hadn't been wise enough to step up yet, at least was wise enough to vote yes on Penn State) now has decided to throw its lot back with those same catholic colleges. Those same disparate interests. The only public school, the only full FBS football school, still the highest athletic department budget now in another group of schools unlikely to care or respect the needs/interests of the institution. The kind of short-term foolish thinking that kills not just the football program, but ultimately the rest of the athletic department.

Ironically all the other schools who supported Penn State's admission managed to find their way to greener pastures and a future.. while UConn has decided voluntarily to get back together with the group that couldn't see past their own self interest to support the needs of their conference brethren originally. Yep, each of those small catholic schools are once again going to be depended on by UConn for its own survival, hope it goes better this time.

This is nonsense. The main villain in conference realignment is ESPN.

Only 3 schools lost when the Big East broke up: UConn Cincinnati, and USF. The latter two were recent additions, so a case could be made that they should have been grateful just to be in the show for a few years. EVERY OTHER SCHOOL ended up ahead of where it was in the Big East. The Catholics, plus Rutgers, WVU, Miami, BCU, Syracuse, Virginia Tech and Louisville and even TCU, all make around triple or more what they made in the Big East. ESPN could have kept the Big East together with a few million more per team, but instead attacked their own partner, unleashing market forces that would explode ESPN's business model.

It couldn't have happened to a nicer network.
 
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Lol yeah Nova made so many mistakes.

Did this board take a stupid pill?
Ummm, they are fighting to rebuild what they threw away long ago in a rash decision to save $$. They had a pretty solid program. Basketball is an irrelevancy. If it wasn’t, the Big12 would have taken us in a heartbeat.
 

whaler11

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Ummm, they are fighting to rebuild what they threw away long ago in a rash decision to save $$. They had a pretty solid program. Basketball is an irrelevancy. If it wasn’t, the Big12 would have taken us in a heartbeat.

Yeah basketball is an irrelevancy when Villanova wins 2 of 4 basketball NCs.

What frigging planet do some of you live on?
 
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It's also interesting to think about what would have happened if Villanova was able to figure out its FB stadium issue in 2011. I think their big plan all along was to use the soccer stadium and play Big East ball.

Of course, that plan was scoffed at by the big schools. Rightly so, especially given (the funny part) Nova was trying to backchannel an ACC invite the entire time.



This scared the out of me then I saw the date lol
 
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This is nonsense.

It’s certainly not nonsense that the small catholic schools voted narrowly for their own self interest over the greater good of the conference. Penn State being an example of one of the early conflicts. That is the same crew that UConn again is throwing their lot with.

While the TV deal was seen as the AAC not looking out for UConn, do you really think the Big East is going to vote in a way that would protect the interests of the only non-religious institution?

While I certainly hope all works out, I fear that this is another situation where short-term gain is being selected over the long-term best interest. Once again UConn’s interests are tied to schools whose mission is much different than their own and when push comes to shove history shows those institutions have voted their own short-term best interests first.
 
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It’s certainly not nonsense that the small catholic schools voted narrowly for their own self interest over the greater good of the conference. Penn State being an example of one of the early conflicts. That is the same crew that UConn again is throwing their lot with.

While the TV deal was seen as the AAC not looking out for UConn, do you really think the Big East is going to vote in a way that would protect the interests of the only non-religious institution?

While I certainly hope all works out, I fear that this is another situation where short-term gain is being selected over the long-term best interest. Once again UConn’s interests are tied to schools whose mission is much different than their own and when push comes to shove history shows those institutions have voted their own short-term best interests first.
thought the same thing - but oh well "basketball", the athletic dept as a whole be damned.
 
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thought the same thing - but oh well "basketball", the athletic dept as a whole be damned.

We’re either mildly screwed or completely screwed. Indy football is a miserable existence.
 
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We’re either mildly screwed or completely screwed. Indy football is a miserable existence.


If Navy can be football only and Wichita State basketball only in the AAC than why can't we be football only? The second closest school to us is East Carolina. It's not like we don't have a legit reason for this move.
 
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If Navy can be football only and Wichita State basketball only in the AAC than why can't we be football only? The second closest school to us is East Carolina. It's not like we don't have a legit reason for this move.

Wouldn’t they need another football only to offset?
 

SubbaBub

Your stupidity is ruining my country.
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Cincy and USF are better off than they have ever been in the AAC. The only true CR casualty is UConn. Everyone else is making more money than they were when the merry go round started.
 

Dream Jobbed 2.0

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I just love that St Johns and PC rejected Penn State. AND THESE ARE THE PEOPLE WE ARE DIEING TO GET BACK WITH
 
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Had Penn state been voted into the Big East 3 plus decades ago, it would've rivaled almost all the other conferences, financially, and ratings wise. Think about this for a second. Miami, Penn state, WVU, VaTech,Temple, Pitt, Rutgers, Syracuse, Boston College, UCONN, Navy...that would've been enough to compete nationally. Areas that are densely populated and rich in economics would have really made waves not just in college football but in almost most sports. Penn state alone would've raised the profile of almost every school. The catholic schools and Pitt didn't see the forest from the trees. It's a damned shame, but who's to say these other conferences would've poached the BIG east; it could have very well have been that the Big Eadt would've done some poaching of it's own, and probably would not need the catholic schools to be temporarily sustainable. Later on add in Lousiville and it would have been a formidable conference.
 

Waquoit

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Those that don't remember history....rehire Randy Edsall.
 

ConnHuskBask

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What in the hell makes any of you think that even had the Big East invited Penn State 30 years ago, that they wouldn't have been picked off down the line - just like every single other northeast/mid-atlantic program has been the past decade (except us).
 

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