Thin coaching pipeline?

[Vowelguy]

In 10 years, Geno Vic WesMoore and Kim will be out of the game. Dawn , Jeff Walz , and Kenny brooks maybe as well. (Ditto Kelly Graves and Scott Rueck.). Tara and bluder just retired.

Who is going to lead the next generation?

Only Cori Close and Adia Barnes have made a final 4 I believe.

 

[bballnut90]

In 10 years, Geno Vic WesMoore and Kim will be out of the game. Dawn , Jeff Walz , and Kenny brooks maybe as well. (Ditto Kelly Graves and Scott Rueck.). Tara and bluder just retired.

Who is going to lead the next generation?

Only Cori Close and Adia Barnes have made a final 4 I believe.

Shea Ralph, Kara Lawson, Niele Ivey, Kim Caldwell, Coach Yo, Lindsay Gottlieb and Jenny Baranczyk are all doing good things at their respective programs.

Brenda Frese should be included in the “might be out” group.

 

[nwhoopfan]

Might be a bit early to say yet, but I could see Mark Campbell being in the middle of the conversation somewhere down the road.

 

[visitingcock]

Might be a bit early to say yet, but I could see Mark Campbell being in the middle of the conversation somewhere down the road.

Every program he has been with has exceeded their previous expectations -including his assistantship at Oregon. He has proven that he can do well with transfers but needs to develop his recruiting from hs players ( which he did well in as an assistant at Oregon).

Barmore is the only great coach in wbb history who succeeded a championship level coach.

 

[Bigboote]

I think both of the Thibeaus (Thibeaux?) could be in the mix, too, if Eric would think of going into the college game. I’ve been impressed with what Carly has been doing at Fairfield.

 

[Vowelguy]

Shea Ralph, Kara Lawson, Niele Ivey, Kim Caldwell, Coach Yo, Lindsay Gottlieb and Jenny Baranczyk are all doing good things at their respective programs.

.

yes they’ve done some positive things but im not sure any are considered great yet. Whereas coaches like Geno, Pat, Tara, walz, Dawn were all considered elite by the age of 45.

 

[Basingstoke]

yes they’ve done some positive things but im not sure any are considered great yet. Whereas coaches like Geno, Pat, Tara, walz, Dawn were all considered elite by the age of 45.

Interesting observation. It should be noted that, by this yardstick, Coach Yo and Jenny Baranczyk have a little time left and Carly Thibault-DuDonis has more than a decade (2 decades + for Coach Caroline Ducharme...).

 

[stwainfan]

Overall Kim Caldwell has a 241-42 record. That's pretty good.

 

[Dillon77]

Interesting observation. It should be noted that, by this yardstick, Coach Yo and Jenny Baranczyk have a little time left and Carly Thibault-DuDonis has more than a decade (2 decades + for Coach Caroline Ducharme...).

Possible contenders:

• Robyn Fralick is just under 45 (graduated from Davidson in 2004). In 10 years as a head coach, she's 236-95 (.713), which includes three trips to the NCAA DII finals (two championships). Let's see how she progresses at Michigan State.
• The aforementioned Kim Caldwell at Tennessee.
• It's a bit early yet, but Shawn Poppie at Clemson bears paying attention to. He learned from Kenny Brooks, had a super two years at Chattanooga and Clemson was competitive with transfers, glue and tape last year. He's hit the portal again this year and had a solid HS recruiting class. Once again, early, but bears remembering as we all go forward.

 

[Dillon77]

GP Gromacki has a 621-96 record, and Tom Shirley is 905-386.

I'm not sure how any of that is pertinent to the current discussion.

???

You're looking for possible next great coaches, acknowledging there are not a lot of easy candidates and even thrown in an age milestone. So, I don't think Kim Caldwell isn't a bad choice to bring up...although I think she's in a tough conference to pull away from the pack.

It was pretty easy to nominate Coach Fralick from MSU because she's gotten to NCAA finals -- three times -- albeit at the DII level.

 

[Vowelguy]

My question was poorly formed.

What I asking is not so much who will be the next 'top' coaches, but will any of them be 'great'? And if there are fewer great coaches, what does that do for the game and player development?

I know that every generation thinks their era is the best never to be reproduced, and that my question can be discounted on that basis.
But the fact that none of the younger generation has really broken through by their 40s seems notable.

It could be that the overall quality of coaches and players has improved so it's harder to ascend early. Or that with the W and foreign leagues, ex-players are getting a later start.

 

[bballnut90]

My question was poorly formed.

What I asking is not so much who will be the next 'top' coaches, but will any of them be 'great'? And if there are fewer great coaches, what does that do for the game and player development?

I know that every generation thinks their era is the best never to be reproduced, and that my question can be discounted on that basis.
But the fact that none of the younger generation has really broken through by their 40s seems notable.

It could be that the overall quality of coaches and players has improved so it's harder to ascend early. Or that with the W and foreign leagues, ex-players are getting a later start.

I think it's too early to draw the conclusion if any of the young coaches will be great. Every dominant coach has taken time to find their footing and endured some ups and downs. Geno didn't win a title until his 10th year and only reached a Final Four once in his first nine seasons. It took Pat Summitt 13 years to win a title, Tara Vanderveer 12 and Dawn Staley 17 years. It took Muffet about 25 years to turn Notre Dame into a consistent powerhouse, and it took Kim Mulkey 9-10 years to turn Baylor into a national power.

For comparison sake, Shea Ralph, Kara Lawson and Niele Ivey are all in year 5 or 6. I think a lot of these programs are one marquee recruit away from doing great things, or are currently in the process of building their program to do great things in the next few seasons. We have some great young coaches in the game, they just need time to continue to improve. More opportunities will come up as the older generation of coaches phase out in the next 5-10 years.

Worth noting, it's also much harder to land a P4 job in your 30s as a head coach than it was 30-40 years ago. In recent years, Kim Caldwell is the only one I can think of who has hit the ground running from a younger age at a P4 school, and she was still 35 and considered a very risky hire. Everyone else has been in their late 30s or early 40s. Comparatively, Pat/Tara started coaching in their early 20s and Geno was 31 when he landed his head coaching gig at UCONN.

 

[ConnMotors]

Another thought on this would any of these younger coaches jump at the chance to coach at UConn, Texas, South Carolina, LSU, Oregon or Maryland?

 

[darrell]

Another thought on this would any of these younger coaches jump at the chance to coach at UConn, Texas, South Carolina, LSU, Oregon or Maryland?

Very similar to Kenny Brooks leaving VPI for Kentucky, I can absolutely see that. Mark Campbell is my dark horse replacement for Geno. He’s done a great job at TCU.

 

[ConnMotors]

Very similar to Kenny Brooks leaving VPI for Kentucky, I can absolutely see that. Mark Campbell is my dark horse replacement for Geno. He’s done a great job at TCU.

I don’t think that She’s would leave Vanderbilt for UConn. And, my choice Carla Berube has not jumped at a higher D1 school.

 

[JDuro]

Another thought on this would any of these younger coaches jump at the chance to coach at UConn, Texas, South Carolina, LSU, Oregon or Maryland?

I’ll certainly will be following Wayne Gandy beginning his HC career at Grand Canyon as someone who could put himself in the mix to succeed Dawn.

 

[JellyBean]

Molly Miller, Coach Yo, Nicki Collen, Kristin Haynie, Megan Griffith, Allsion Pohlman, Lisa Fortier, Shauna Green, Teri Moren, Kenny Brooks, Amy Wright, Robyn Fralick, and Dawn Plitzuweit. Oh, KBA.

 

[Dillon77]

I think it's too early to draw the conclusion if any of the young coaches will be great. Every dominant coach has taken time to find their footing and endured some ups and downs. Geno didn't win a title until his 10th year and only reached a Final Four once in his first nine seasons. It took Pat Summitt 13 years to win a title, Tara Vanderveer 12 and Dawn Staley 17 years. It took Muffet about 25 years to turn Notre Dame into a consistent powerhouse, and it took Kim Mulkey 9-10 years to turn Baylor into a national power.

For comparison sake, Shea Ralph, Kara Lawson and Niele Ivey are all in year 5 or 6. I think a lot of these programs are one marquee recruit away from doing great things, or are currently in the process of building their program to do great things in the next few seasons. We have some great young coaches in the game, they just need time to continue to improve. More opportunities will come up as the older generation of coaches phase out in the next 5-10 years.

Worth noting, it's also much harder to land a P4 job in your 30s as a head coach than it was 30-40 years ago. In recent years, Kim Caldwell is the only one I can think of who has hit the ground running from a younger age at a P4 school, and she was still 35 and considered a very risky hire. Everyone else has been in their late 30s or early 40s. Comparatively, Pat/Tara started coaching in their early 20s and Geno was 31 when he landed his head coaching gig at UCONN.

Thanks for (very well) articulating what was jumbling around in my brain, particularly the last paragraph. Compared to now, I think NCAA women's hoops was in a somewhat nascent stage when a lot of the icons mentioned got starts at very young ages. That doesn't/rarely happens anymore and because of the popularity of the sport, there are more players going to more teams. Because of the advent of and growth of technology, more teams can take advantage of the internet to learn about and reach out to said players and influencers.

As such, I think it takes some rising coaches (Ralph, Lawson, Ivey, Berube) a bit longer to get to the stage to begin/maintain a prolonged run at the top of the sport, such as we saw with Geno (most of the time) McGraw (throughout the teens), Mulkey (at a few schools) and Staley (since Wilson).

Or, a circuitous route via different levels or non-P5 schools (a Robyn Fralick, for instance).

We might never see prolonged runs as nearly untouchable coaches (once Geno retires), but there will a lot of good ones.

 

[cancontent]

Molly Miller, Coach Yo, Nicki Collen, Kristin Haynie, Megan Griffith, Allsion Pohlman, Lisa Fortier, Shauna Green, Teri Moren, Kenny Brooks, Amy Wright, Robyn Fralick, and Dawn Plitzuweit. Oh, KBA.

That got me chuckling. How did she come last considering you bleed blue and maize? 😂

 

[Vowelguy]

Molly Miller, Coach Yo, Nicki Collen, Kristin Haynie, Megan Griffith, Allsion Pohlman, Lisa Fortier, Shauna Green, Teri Moren, Kenny Brooks, Amy Wright, Robyn Fralick, and Dawn Plitzuweit. Oh, KBA.

Nicki Collen has done ok at Baylor , but the program has taken a step back from Mulkey. Don’t think she’s going to go down in history as a great.

Teri Moren has done a great job at Indiana but she has had her chances. I’m inclined to think she’s got a ceiling.

Kenny Brooks is really good but not sure he will still be going 10 years from now.

 

[ochoopsfan]

Karlie Samuelson

 

[nwhoopfan]

Karlie Samuelson

That opens up a whole 'nother can of worms if we're going to start projecting people who haven't even started being head coaches yet!

 

[nwhoopfan]

Ooh, I got another one. Lindy La Rocque.

 

[HuskylnSC]

10 YEARS!!!!! Caroline DuCharme! She may never leave UConn. Two years as a GA. Then other admin positions (video coordinator, recruiting coordinator) open up, then a seat on the bench and then.... It could happen

 

[Vowelguy]

10 YEARS!!!!! Caroline DuCharme! She may never leave UConn. Two years as a GA. Then other admin positions (video coordinator, recruiting coordinator) open up, then a seat on the bench and then.... It could happen

So could me becoming head coach.