The ACC is worse off without Maryland than the other way around - Washington Post
- Thread starter Rufus
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Completely agree from an academic standpoint. We took a tour (my son became a Husky). I was really impressed. The Big got a freebie and the market.
Haha, he said basketball’s drama will be lower as will football’s ceiling, but all is well, it’s just a flesh wound. Maryland did fine and all, but it was very much a two steps forward, one-and-a-half step back. They got somethings, lost on others.
Overall very much a plus. Some fine ACC institutions but would you rather rub shoulders with Louisville or Michigan?
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Interesting perspective, but as someone in the ACC, just not feeling it. It's hard to reconcile with recent articles like
this This A.C.C. Might Be the Best Basketball League Ever
and the ACC winning 11 out of the 14 games in the ACC-B1G challenge for men's basketball a couple of months ago. The ACC was happy to have half the elite 8 a couple of years ago. No one was thinking of Maryland. But it's OK for John Feinstein to say he hates Louisville. A lot of Kentucky fans do too. He can write critical articles of Louisville if it makes him feel better.
That’s a little false narrative since they’d never be with Louisville in the ACC. But as for most fans, I’m sure they’d rather win exciting games. It was bizarre that the piece basically tried to spin as positive that basketball would be less exciting and that football would win less.
My real perspective is academically. I always wanted my kids to hang out with the best. Duke, Virginia and Wake are all good institutions. For example, if I lived in Greenwich and associated with people from Darien and Westport, would you bring Bridgeport kids in? Yes, racist, but we all know life isn’t fair. Bringing in Louisville was the equivalent of Bridgeport. Fine athletically, but no need to go over their baggage. Bad kids, bring good kids down. Just the facts of life. Maryland so impressed me. They won’t bring anyone in the Big down.
Well the fact is it’s likely NC State kids will never meet a Louisville kid in real life. Trying to extrapolate athletic competitions into real life has limitations. Namely these aren’t neighbors kids.
You don’t understand this is a club. I have done much hiring and believe me there is an association between the universities (see Ivy League). Your NC State degree loses value due to its connection with Louisville. You might not like it but that is how life works
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As a Maryland fan, I have to disagree with Feinstein's article. It appears the ACC is doing just fine and will continue to do so, and I don't see any evidence that ACC would be better if Maryland was still in the ACC and Louisville was not invited. Part of this is unfortunate, since I don't think Louisville will be punished enough for their cheating and other despicable actions over the past five (or more) years. Such cheating enabled them to get the ACC invite, and they most likely will not get bounced (even though they deserve to be booted and replaced). Even if Louisville decides to cut down on their cheating, and end up being a mediocre team, the ACC will be just fine. Of course, extolling a short term success the ACC currently has when some of its success is attributable to massive cheating and fraud by Louisville, UNC, and others is just as flawed as Feinstein.
With respect to rivalries, Maryland, in the short term, has lost out. Most of the rivalries the ACC had, still remain. They didn't seem to lose a beat when Maryland left. On the other hand, Maryland lost what little rivalries they still had while in the ACC with expansion. In my opinion, Maryland picked the right time to leave. While I understand the necessity of the ACC to expand, it lowered Maryland's standing in the league. While I am happy with Maryland's current conference association, it will take time (perhaps a long time) to establish meaningful rivalries in the Big Ten. Maryland and the ACC came out winners when Maryland left, but the ACC would have been better off with a better long term replacement.
With respect to rivalries, Maryland, in the short term, has lost out. Most of the rivalries the ACC had, still remain. They didn't seem to lose a beat when Maryland left. On the other hand, Maryland lost what little rivalries they still had while in the ACC with expansion. In my opinion, Maryland picked the right time to leave. While I understand the necessity of the ACC to expand, it lowered Maryland's standing in the league. While I am happy with Maryland's current conference association, it will take time (perhaps a long time) to establish meaningful rivalries in the Big Ten. Maryland and the ACC came out winners when Maryland left, but the ACC would have been better off with a better long term replacement.
Sounds like you love Louisville and think they are a great addition. The bottom line is that the member school presidents of the ACC are frauds to include the outgoing UVA president. If member schools (to include UVA) really gave a damn about academics, Louisville never would have been added in the first place. Why isn't the President of your beloved UVA ever taken a stand and publicly called for Louisville to kicked out of the conference after numerous scandals (one in which involved Louisville's former school president)? Only circikets. The "nothing to see here" attitude by UVA makes them complicit in Louisville's scandals. UVA is a joke!
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I'm not hearing a lot of calls to kick Louisville out of the conference. The UVA President is certainly not going to get involved with how another university president spends his/her university's endowment funds. The auditors at Louisville took issue with the spending, but Louisville President Ramsey was president of the university and the foundation. Perhaps they should re-evaluate the conflicts of interests in that, but that's not the place of the UVA President to comment. They are finding another president.
The Adidas Scandal is sort of just being investigated with little public information. It appears to affect many schools, so it has to play out before anyone gets too excited about it. And worrying about academics regarding Louisville is pointless. Academics wasn't what the ACC needed at the time. If they did, they would have looked at Rice, who is top 20. They needed football, and so far Louisville has delivered. They didn't really need basketball, but that was a bonus. I preferred sticking with choices on the east coast, but the football powers wanted Louisville, so we got Louisville.
Louisville delivered? What they delivered is poor academics and 4 scandals. Your entire "everything is fine" post is crap. It's about integrity and UVA has none. UVA certainly should have commented and taken a stand against one of their corrupt conference members, but UVA along with the other conference members have no integrity. Glad you admit that UVA and the ACC could care less about academics. It's dumpster fire of a conference and should be disbanded.
You are such a troll. I thought a year or so ago you said you would never post again on this board? Can't help being a troll, huh?
You are such a troll. I thought a year or so ago you said you would never post again on this board? Can't help being a troll, huh?
Please, they don't care about academics and scandals. Their flagship school had been found guilty of cheating with no repercussions at all! However, the ACC is thriving and making a lot of money thanks to ESPN and the taxpayers of CT!
I think most ACC fans would rather have kept Maryland. But that wasn’t an option. Since Maryland really had no main rival (at least no one that claimed them), it was much easier to switch in Louisville and keep things moving even if Louisville wasn’t their first choice.
Fishy
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There’s no question that the ACC is weaker and more compromised without Maryland.
Have you see what Louisville has been up to since they got into the ACC?
They’re a crime spree masquerading as a community college.
Plus the ACC now has a gaping hole in their footprint that goes from Virginia to Boston. Adding a few zip codes in Kentucky doesn’t change the math there.
Have you see what Louisville has been up to since they got into the ACC?
They’re a crime spree masquerading as a community college.
Plus the ACC now has a gaping hole in their footprint that goes from Virginia to Boston. Adding a few zip codes in Kentucky doesn’t change the math there.
Maryland did fill a geographic niche that is empty now. Though in terms of college viewership, I think Louisville is second only to Birmingham for getting eyeballs to watch ESPN (it’s the #1 college basketball town, usually top 20 in college football). Money is indeed driving the bus.
Fishy
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Here’s the rub...
With Louisville, you get great ratings in Louisville.
With Maryland, you get good ratings in Maryland and DC.
Do you want a teeny pie or do you want a really big pie?
Money does drive the bus which is why the Big Ten took Maryland and left you with Louisville.
To Boston? Are the Providence Friars more popular than BC?
Fishy
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I have no idea what you’re asking. That didn’t make any sense.
....the ACC has no market between Virginia and Boston besides maybe NYC and Syracuse?
That was simple English. I wasn't asking. I was insinuating a point.
I was making a point about BC by bringing up Providence.
I know I have communication weaknesses, but I am questioning your comprehension skills.I guess the ACC has no Atlantic coast market worthwhile past Virginia. The inland markets are not even worth noting. Louisville, Pittsburgh and Syracuse. Notre Dame would have the most pull in the Northeast. Not sure how that arrangement is working out. Seems to be mutually beneficial to some degree. Somehow, Notre Dame's hockey program left for the Big Ten.
It’s honestly probably closer than you’d think. This is like that Nate Silver piece which has Birmingham having as many college football fans as Chicago. Even if you wanted to quibble, there is simply a vast difference in how certain markets consume college sports and “big pies” and “little pies” don’t always explain enough. In shorthand, Maryland is probably more attractive in a cable world, Louisville probably in a streaming one.
That said, Maryland was more desirable in 2012 for both the ACC and the B10. The B10 desired markets for their broadcast network and both conferences preferred Maryland’s school profile. Louisville brought nothing for the B10. It did however shore up some deficits the ACC needed, namely eyeballs and competitiveness on the field.
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I don't think there is any way to positively spin losing a large state flagship university situated in an incredibly valuable media market. I get that The ACC did what it felt it had to do at the time by bringing in Louisville, but their inclusion seemed like a short term solution to a long term problem. Louisville always seemed like a castle built on sand. The foundations of their key programs were built on two of the shadiest coaches in the business. UConn to this day seemed like the far smarter long term choice IMO. I'm still amazed how that whole situation played out.