Poll: Best Recruiting Coach (not named Geno)

[DefenseBB]

As I qualified it as Recruiting, in my perusal of the past 5 years of regular ranking players/classes, I was debating between Brenda and Kim (Sorry all you SC fans). Kim seems to be more consistent in the top 5 than Brenda who fluctuates a bit more, so for me, it's Kim Mulkey. Now if she could limit the transfers from the program...

So, who are your choices and the reasoning?

 

[Wbbfan1]

It should probably be Tara due to the Strict Academic Requirements of Stanford. Yet, she has good or great recruiting classes most years. However, the lure of Stanford due to its location is a HUGE benefit for her is there are enough players that can meet Stanford's academic Requirements.

Kim Mulkey is a great Regional Recruiter getting the majority of her players from Texas or surrounding States. There's enough talent in the Texas area, she doesn't have to recruit Nationally. Also Kim has been able to recruit dominant post players which IMO is the reason she's had so much success.

To me it comes down to MM or Dawn and I've decided to vote for MM. MM is able to recruit nationally due to the draw of Notre Dame and their winning BB tradition. I think their recent success against UConn, winning National Championships and the love some Media Pundits helps ND.

When it comes to Geno, previously he was great at recruiting the elite player(s) annually and get recruiting classes that fills needs in multiple positions. Now his recruiting success is hit or miss. IF Geno isn't able to get the highly ranked player(s) in a year, then the recruiting year has been a bust. IMO Geno has been unable to recruit players that may not be ready in their Freshmen year, but by their Junior year will develop into starters. I don't count players like Kyla Irwin as they only start because of failures in recruiting.

 

[TerpWomenFan]

I actually picked Dawn Staley because she has less to work with than Kim Mulkey. Mulkey has the whole state of Texas in her backyard while Dawn has to go all over the country and Canada to get her players. The recruitment of Boston gives her an edge to me.
Brenda has never signed a #1 overall player (Staley and Mulkey has) Also Brenda has never signed a graduate transfer player. So she is clearly behind the other two coaches. She is getting better though with the signing of Austin, Owusu and Reese. Now she needs to sign so quality graduate transfers.

 

[Floridaduck]

Maybe the coach with the #1 class...Kelly Graves?

 

[newfrontier]

Maybe the coach with the #1 class...Kelly Graves?

One number one recruiting class does not make a coach (in this case Graves) the best recruiting coach. And like it or not, the Nike connection and funding (for facilities, athletic programs and amenities, perceived career opportunities) helps him a bunch. Now if Graves sustains it and has mostly top 5 (ie. no more 1-2-3 exceptions) over the next 5-10 years then I might agree with you.

I considered TV as she has to overcome a very high academic hurdle, but on the other hand, she also has two huge advantages: 1. A Stanford degree is highly coveted not just in the USA, but around the World and 2. her location is highly desirable [there is reason why it costs 1.5 million dollars (plus) just for a tiny crap home in the area].

I considered KM, but like someone mentioned, she has a large pool of good to very good players in Texas that she can readily draw from. Of course her location might actually be minus for some folk (thus a plus for voting purposes). I consider her on court personality a minus she overcomes too, but I can't give her credit for overcoming a self-inflicted wound.

I conclude by choosing MM. Notre Dame's athletic reputation/history and the fact that a ND degree is desirable to achieve helps her recruit Nationally. Her location is a minus. Her tradition of winning is helpful in the circular argument sense, and having players join the pros helps her resume too.

Another question to ask - which coach does more or the most with less?

 

[DallasBUFan]

One number one recruiting class does not make a coach (in this case Graves) the best recruiting coach. And like it not, the Nike connection and funding (for facilities, athletic programs and amenities, perceived career opportunities) helps him a bunch. Now if Graves sustains it and has mostly top 5 (ie. no more 1-2-3 exceptions) over the next 5-10 years then I might agree with you.

I considered TV as she has to overcome a very high academic hurdle, but on the other hand, she also has two huge advantages: 1. A Stanford degree is highly coveted not just in the USA, but around the World and 2. her location is highly desirable [there is reason why it costs 1.5 million dollars (plus) just for a tiny crap home in the area].

I considered KM, but like someone mentioned, she has a large pool of good to very players in Texas that she can readily draw from. Of course her location might actually be minus for some folk (thus a plus for voting purposes). I consider her on court personality a minus she overcomes too, but I can't give her credit for overcoming a self-inflicted wound.

I conclude by choosing MM. Notre Dame's athletic reputation/history and the fact that a ND degree is desirable to achieve helps her recruit Nationally. Her location is a minus. Her tradition of winning is helpful in the circular argument sense, and having players join the pros helps her resume too.

Another question to ask - which coach does more or the most with less?

You picked the coach who's recruiting has left her team unranked for the first time in over 200 weeks......

 

[Gamecockfan77]

I made the homer pick.

What Staley has done at South Carolina is remarkable given what the program was when she arrived.

She's twice had the #1 class in the nation and this past one was constructed from Ohio, Illinois, Canada, and the Virgin Islands.

She in a very real way recruited the fan base for the games as much as she recruited the players.

......

Obviously the other coaches on this list recruit very well also. They are all reasonable choices.

But South Carolina is a perennial top 10 now with a roster that largely isn't regional. That was Geno's comment on South Carolina. Staley would need to go national to be a contender.

Maybe she's there.

 

[shiverz45]

I made the homer pick.

What Staley has done at South Carolina is remarkable given what the program was when she arrived.

She's twice had the #1 class in the nation and this past one was constructed from Ohio, Illinois, Canada, and the Virgin Islands.

She in a very real way recruited the fan base for the games as much as she recruited the players.

......

Obviously the other coaches on this list recruit very well also. They are all reasonable choices.

But South Carolina is a perennial top 10 now with a roster that largely isn't regional. That was Geno's comment on South Carolina. Staley would need to go national to be a contender.

Maybe she's there.

Her class was #2 in 2014 behind UCLA, but agree with everything else.

 

[newfrontier]

You picked the coach who's recruiting has left her team unranked for the first time in over 200 weeks......

So, sounds like you agree her recruiting has been very good to keep her team ranked for almost 4 years straight. I think losing all 5 of last years starters (to the WNBA draft) explains why they are struggling a bit from inexperience. I'm sure MM's team will back in thick of things next year.

 

[Crazyhorse]

Staley is one of the best for sure. D. Henderson had been coming to FSU camps since middle school and the staff thought she would come to FSU, one visit to South Carolina and it was over.

 

[DefenseBB]

Maybe the coach with the #1 class...Kelly Graves?

The problem with that is he has not had any track record other than the Sabrina/Hebard class. So he needs to do it more than 2 times is 6 years. Then I would consider him a top recruiter
2015 not in top 20
2016 #3
2017 not in top 20
2018 not in top 20
2019 not in top 20
2020 #1

 

[DefenseBB]

Staley is one of the best for sure. D. Henderson had been coming to FSU camps since middle school and the staff thought she would come to FSU, one visit to South Carolina and it was over.

OF this group NOT named Geno...just sayin...

 

[bballnut90]

I actually picked Dawn Staley because she has less to work with than Kim Mulkey. Mulkey has the whole state of Texas in her backyard while Dawn has to go all over the country and Canada to get her players. The recruitment of Boston gives her an edge to me.
Brenda has never signed a #1 overall player (Staley and Mulkey has) Also Brenda has never signed a graduate transfer player. So she is clearly behind the other two coaches. She is getting better though with the signing of Austin, Owusu and Reese. Now she needs to sign so quality graduate transfers.

I voted for Brenda but your response makes a lot of sense. Brenda lands a crap ton of top kids and was an excellent recruiter from the get go at Maryland, pulling in Langhorne/Harper/Toliver/Coleman in 2 years. I'd probably go with Mulkey or Staley for reasons you pointed out.

Graves should be in consideration too if we're talking about recent precedent. He pulled in Sabrina/Hebard, then pulled Sabally who was was better than her HG ranking, got Boley/Moore/Prince from the transfer market, has a big 2020 class coming and the younger Sabally on board who is supposed to be excellent.

 

[Floridaduck]

The problem with that is he has not had any track record other than the Sabrina/Hebard class. So he needs to do it more than 2 times is 6 years. Then I would consider him a top recruiter
2015 not in top 20
2016 #3
2017 not in top 20
2018 not in top 20
2019 not in top 20
2020 #1

I did not realize that the qualifications involved just multiple American HS recruits per year.
Graves "not in the Top 20". No, he didn't need large classes after 2016. He didn't need a lot of bodies the year he brought in Satou Sabally and Erin Boley in 2017. Nyarra Sabally and Taylor Chavez added the following year. Then in 2019 transfers Minyon Moore and Sedona Prince plus 3 veteran international players in Holly Winterburn, Jaz Shelley, and Lucy Cochrane. This is all "recruiting", I think, and a pretty good record.

So I guess I didn't know the rules of Great Recruiter game. I thought it would have mattered that Graves has added complimentary players like these to his core 2016 group (still playing) of Sabrina, Ruthie, Lydia, and Morgan Yaeger.

 

[DefenseBB]

I did not realize that the qualifications involved just multiple American HS recruits per year.
Graves "not in the Top 20". No, he didn't need large classes after 2016. He didn't need a lot of bodies the year he brought in Satou Sabally and Erin Boley in 2017. Nyarra Sabally and Taylor Chavez added the following year. Then in 2019 transfers Minyon Moore and Sedona Prince plus 3 veteran international players in Holly Winterburn, Jaz Shelley, and Lucy Cochrane. This is all "recruiting", I think, and a pretty good record.

So I guess I didn't know the rules of Great Recruiter game. I thought it would have mattered that Graves has added complimentary players like these to his core 2016 group (still playing) of Sabrina, Ruthie, Lydia, and Morgan Yaeger.

What’s great about a forum is you can create your own poll! I chose something easily monitored and with a track record and as “recruiting grad transfers is relatively new and no easily identifiable metric (who’s to say Minyon is a top player?) I used tools at my disposal. Have at it to your specifics but then again that would require thought and effort on your behalf but I look forward to whatever your iteration is....

 

[Knoxville]

Holly Warlick

 

[domerduck]

If the real question is "who is the best recruiting coach right now". I'd also have to go with Graves, but can't cast that vote. #2 I'd go Tara, but you didn't ask for #2 so I guess no vote can be cast.

 

[domerduck]

The problem with that is he has not had any track record other than the Sabrina/Hebard class. So he needs to do it more than 2 times is 6 years. Then I would consider him a top recruiter
2015 not in top 20
2016 #3
2017 not in top 20
2018 not in top 20
2019 not in top 20
2020 #1

I do think the recruiting rankings do not really cover international players unless they xfr to US high schools their senior year. Those rankings are all involved in for profit clubs serving the US kids and it seems you used the ones from ESPN. During those 5 years, Kelly recruited several international players who are all currenlty on the team: 3 Australians, 2 Germans, and one very good player from England. None of those players played in the US. Kelly, who was active recruiting international kids when with Gonzaga, has parlayed the stronger Oregon Brand name and better location to get the best in the world. His 2015 class had Maite Cazorla from Spain who's done well in the WNBA and in 2017 added another top Spaniard (Aino Ayusa) who is now a pro in Europe.

To explain how screwed up those ESPN class rankings as it relates to international players, in 2017 the top 100 had only 6 international players and Satou was 3rd at 36 behind Maeva Djaldi-Tabdi (#27) who doesn't start at Cuse and #35 Julia Reisingerova who never played in college. Prospects Nation had Sabally the #1 international recruit (in par as #1 Wing with Megan Walker) and neither of the other two were in their international ranking. That Oregon 2017 class had only three players, all international, inlcuding the German Sabally #6 Anelli Maley (Australia), and #10 Spaniard Ayusa. Satou started about game 5 as a Freshman and the other two played 30+ games as Freshmen on an Elite 8 Oregon team. Both Anelli and Aina leveraged their Oregon experience to become pros in their respective countries and certainly are very talented, ven through neither was ranked ESPN top 100. Also no one can contest that Sabally is one of the top college players n the game right now, certainly should have been top 5 on any objective ranking.

These international women are now playing very good bball. Geno and others are now following suit looking at the international players especially given the success of Satou. In the future I am sure ESPN will get batter including them . I do appreciate the effort you did to put together the poll and understand you had to make choices,. Still I think your approach is an aribrtrary distinction which makes no sense when it is really an opinion poll anyways.

 

[DefenseBB]

I do think the recruiting rankings do not really cover international players unless they xfr to US high schools their senior year. Those rankings are all involved in for profit clubs serving the US kids and it seems you used the ones from ESPN. During those 5 years, Kelly recruited several international players who are all currenlty on the team: 3 Australians, 2 Germans, and one very good player from England. None of those players played in the US. Kelly, who was active recruiting international kids when with Gonzaga, has parlayed the stronger Oregon Brand name and better location to get the best in the world. His 2015 class had Maite Cazorla from Spain who's done well in the WNBA and in 2017 added another top Spaniard (Aino Ayusa) who is now a pro in Europe.

To explain how screwed up those ESPN class rankings as it relates to international players, in 2017 the top 100 had only 6 international players and Satou was 3rd at 36 behind Maeva Djaldi-Tabdi (#27) who doesn't start at Cuse and #35 Julia Reisingerova who never played in college. Prospects Nation had Sabally the #1 international recruit (in par as #1 Wing with Megan Walker) and neither of the other two were in their international ranking. That Oregon 2017 class had only three players, all international, inlcuding the German Sabally #6 Anelli Maley (Australia), and #10 Spaniard Ayusa. Satou started about game 5 as a Freshman and the other two played 30+ games as Freshmen on an Elite 8 Oregon team. Both Anelli and Aina leveraged their Oregon experience to become pros in their respective countries and certainly are very talented, ven through neither was ranked ESPN top 100. Also no one can contest that Sabally is one of the top college players n the game right now, certainly should have been top 5 on any objective ranking.

These international women are now playing very good bball. Geno and others are now following suit looking at the international players especially given the success of Satou. In the future I am sure ESPN will get batter including them . I do appreciate the effort you did to put together the poll and understand you had to make choices,. Still I think your approach is an aribrtrary distinction which makes no sense when it is really an opinion poll anyways.

So as I say to the MSU fans, let’s see Kelly do it AFTER his program defining player leaves. He has 1 Final Four. And as I also have said to others, you don’t like the choices, write in your own, which you did and he is an acceptable choice. I gave my reason as to why I didn’t include him. So NO, “right now” was not a criteria I chose. But I appreciate your excessive and obnoxious post on why something for dialogue and fun was so wrong. It has now solidified my rooting for UConn and anyone playing Oregon. Go BEAVERS!

 

[domerduck]

So as I say to the MSU fans, let’s see Kelly do it AFTER his program defining player leaves. He has 1 Final Four. And as I also have said to others, you don’t like the choices, write in your own, which you did and he is an acceptable choice. I gave my reason as to why I didn’t include him. So NO, “right now” was not a criteria I chose. But I appreciate your excessive and obnoxious post on why something for dialogue and fun was so wrong. It has now solidified my rooting for UConn and anyone playing Oregon. Go BEAVERS!

Sorry I wasted your time with my "excessive and obnoxious post." I did try to complement your initative by stating "I do appreciate the effort you did to put together the poll and understand you had to make choices," but my thought ws that you might want a rationale why Graves might be worthy to be in your poll beyond Floridaduck's efficient statment "Maybe the coach with the #1 class...Kelly Graves?" I guess I'll ignore responding to your posts in the future so we can avoid this type of negative exchange.

As for your rooting since I live in Corvallis I do support your "Go Beavs". Still I am looking forward to Oregon getting another chance to play UConn in Connecticut this coming February 3 and next season in Eugene.

 

[Figurehead]

Sounds an impeach or not to impeach poll. Depending on who set it up they can get what they want out of it.

 

[newfrontier]

Sounds an impeach or not to impeach poll. Depending on who set it up they can get what they want out of it.

I suggest current politics not be referenced (directly, tangentially or even mildly) unless one wants to potentially ignite an "off topic" mess on this board that might possibly get ugly. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[DallasBUFan]

Sorry I wasted your time with my "excessive and obnoxious post." I did try to complement your initative by stating "I do appreciate the effort you did to put together the poll and understand you had to make choices," but my thought ws that you might want a rationale why Graves might be worthy to be in your poll beyond Floridaduck's efficient statment "Maybe the coach with the #1 class...Kelly Graves?" I guess I'll ignore responding to your posts in the future so we can avoid this type of negative exchange.

As for your rooting since I live in Corvallis I do support your "Go Beavs". Still I am looking forward to Oregon getting another chance to play UConn in Connecticut this coming February 3 and next season in Eugene.

You are trying to use his international recruiting as a reason why he should be. But only one of them is in the wnba. I can name several other coaches that had an international players drafted. Also, part of the reason he has the no.1 recruiting class is because he has five players. Outside of this class what else has he done on a consistent basis like the others named.

 

[npignatjr]

I suggest current politics not be referenced (directly, tangentially or even mildly) unless one wants to potentially ignite an "off topic" mess on this board that might possibly get ugly. Just my 2 cents worth.

with all due process of lack thereof I do agree. Go UConn

 

[DeeHusky]

Niele Ivey (I think Niele was more responsible for a lot of players ending up in South Bend than MM) or Jeff Walz