Patriots, am I the only one... | The Boneyard

Patriots, am I the only one...

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who thinks this is a bunch of adoo about nothing? I'm not even a Pats fan, and I don't see what the big deal is. I'm trying to dial up some outrage, but all I dial up is that the Colts come off as a bunch of b(tches.
 

Chin Diesel

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who thinks this is a bunch of adoo about nothing? I'm not even a Pats fan, and I don't see what the big deal is. I'm trying to dial up some outrage, but all I dial up is that the Colts come off as a bunch of b(tches.


I've yet to hear any current or ex-NFL express shock or outrage. It appears every QB gets to doctor the ball to their liking and it's a gentlemen's agreement on self-policing. Colts felt Brady went too far.

As I said in another thread, this situation is this generations George Brett pine tar.
 

Fishy

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That is a very generous reading of the situation given that the Colts expressed concern not more than three days ago.

It doesn't appear that "every QB gets to doctor the ball".
 
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I've yet to hear any current or ex-NFL express shock or outrage. It appears every QB gets to doctor the ball to their liking and it's a gentlemen's agreement on self-policing. Colts felt Brady went too far.

As I said in another thread, this situation is this generations George Brett pine tar.
Look a little harder pretty much every single former NFL player I've heard sounded pretty pissed about it.
 
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That is a very generous reading of the situation given that the Colts expressed concern not more than three days ago.

It doesn't appear that "every QB gets to doctor the ball".
And the Colts expressed concern about it on November 16th. For the people who don't care about the cheating just because the Patriots are so much better than the Colts, how do you feel about it if they did the exact same thing against Baltimore? You would really have to put your head in the sand to think they didn't do it against the much better team (Baltimore).
 

Chin Diesel

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That is a very generous reading of the situation given that the Colts expressed concern not more than three days ago.

It doesn't appear that "every QB gets to doctor the ball".


Google the Eli Manning story from a few years ago. Every ex-NFL'er on ESPN radio from Golic to Theismann, Schlereth, etc said they all do it. Phil Simms was on the air earlier this year talking about how Aaron Rogers likes to over inflate the balls. Brad Johnson supposedly bragged about $7K to get the balls to his liking at the Super Bowl.

The common theme is that every team's QB works with the equipment manager and the manager knows what the QB expects. Before each game the QB will go through a bunch of the footballs and let the manager know which ones to give to the refs for the game.

It's like goldilocks. Some QB's like 'em hard, some like 'em soft and some like them in the middle.

Any divide in player reaction can be split between active players and retired players. Retired players aren't trying to win games any more.
 

Chin Diesel

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And the Colts expressed concern about it on November 16th. For the people who don't care about the cheating just because the Patriots are so much better than the Colts, how do you feel about it if they did the exact same thing against Baltimore? You would really have to put your head in the sand to think they didn't do it against the much better team (Baltimore).


As I said this was like George Brett and the pine tar. Billy Martin had been tipped off about Brett's bat before the HR against Gossage. He just waited until the most opportune time to spring the trap.
 
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Google the Eli Manning story from a few years ago. Every ex-NFL'er on ESPN radio from Golic to Theismann, Schlereth, etc said they all do it. Phil Simms was on the air earlier this year talking about how Aaron Rogers likes to over inflate the balls. Brad Johnson supposedly bragged about $7K to get the balls to his liking at the Super Bowl.

The common theme is that every team's QB works with the equipment manager and the manager knows what the QB expects. Before each game the QB will go through a bunch of the footballs and let the manager know which ones to give to the refs for the game.

It's like goldilocks. Some QB's like 'em hard, some like 'em soft and some like them in the middle.

Any divide in player reaction can be split between active players and retired players. Retired players aren't trying to win games any more.
The Aaron Rodgers thing has been covered over and over again, reading comprehension people.
 

Fishy

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Aaron Rodgers was complaining that he isn't allowed to inflate the ball to his liking. In his opinion, there should be a minimum inflation level, but not a maximum.

In other words, he's forced to play by the rules.

Tom Brady, however, doesn't feel so inclined.

And therein lies the rub - it's a rule. There is actually a procedure in place to ensure compliance and the Patriots willfully deflated the balls after they had been inspected.

Recap.

There is a rule.

The Patriots know the rule.

The Patriots present balls within the limits of the rule.

The Patriots then break the rule.

It can't be explained away, mitigated or equivocated.

Sorry.
 

uconnbill

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When Boston sports station WEEI state that this is wrong and he is an ex Patriot player. It is wrong and they should be fined and lose a draft pick. This goes to the integrity of the game or lack there of for doing something like this.
 
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I'm not impressed with all the outrage. A more surprising thing was that each team actually gets to use their own balls. It's crazy that a team gets to use "their ball" when on offense. Why doesn't the NFL use the same ball for every team? I was told that the reason is because every QB likes the ball with a slightly different feel. Brady likes them a bit softer, Rogers harder. Some like them scuffed. Every QB has their preference. This is an easy problem to solve. The NFL needs to get the balls ready and use the same ones for everyone. The teams do not get to touch or doctor the ball in any way.
 
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The NFL could solve this issue real quick. Have the home team supply all the balls, the refs inspect and have NFL appointed football handlers(who are attached to the referee crew) on the sidelines to assist the refs. Everyone plays with the same football, no funny business on the sidelines.

If in fact the Pats intentionally doctored the balls to gain an advantage in a playoff game to determine who goes to the Superbowl
the head coach(who must have complete control on what happens on his sideline) and starting QB(who is most directly affected by a doctored football, your not going to suspend the entire wide receiver core) should be suspended from playing in Super Bowl and the Patriots team should lose ALL draft picks for one season. That would put a stop to the disappearing air trick. That might sound harsh to some but slaps on the wrist are laughed at by millionaires, being publicly humiliated isn't quite as funny especially when their wallet is lighter for it.
 

CAHUSKY

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Aaron Rodgers was complaining that he isn't allowed to inflate the ball to his liking. In his opinion, there should be a minimum inflation level, but not a maximum.

In other words, he's forced to play by the rules.

Tom Brady, however, doesn't feel so inclined.

And therein lies the rub - it's a rule. There is actually a procedure in place to ensure compliance and the Patriots willfully deflated the balls after they had been inspected.

Recap.

There is a rule.

The Patriots know the rule.

The Patriots present balls within the limits of the rule.

The Patriots then break the rule.

It can't be explained away, mitigated or equivocated.

Sorry.
Totally agree but don't understand why it's the lead story on every espn show and covered on every national news show. Fine them and move on. Who cares?
 
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Look a little harder pretty much every single former NFL player I've heard sounded pretty pissed about it.
Hypocrits much? Like no NFL OL hold on many plays, DBs never interfere, WRs never push off/interfere, players aren't on performance enhancing stuff, teams other than the Patsies don't try to steal signals, etc. etc. etc. May the Seahawks beat the Patsies to a pulp, but some of Seattle's players will likely cheat in some fashion as well in the Super Bowl. No one likes the Patriots, simple enough as they're sort of a Boston team, but fans of many other teams are just tired of their teams losing too often to New England.
 

Chin Diesel

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Aaron Rodgers was complaining that he isn't allowed to inflate the ball to his liking. In his opinion, there should be a minimum inflation level, but not a maximum.

In other words, he's forced to play by the rules.

Tom Brady, however, doesn't feel so inclined.

And therein lies the rub - it's a rule. There is actually a procedure in place to ensure compliance and the Patriots willfully deflated the balls after they had been inspected.

Recap.

There is a rule.

The Patriots know the rule.

The Patriots present balls within the limits of the rule.

The Patriots then break the rule.

It can't be explained away, mitigated or equivocated.

Sorry.


I'm all about bringing down the hammer on the team if they are found to have intentionally messed with the game balls in any way once the officials checked them. That alone is enough to hammer the team regardless of what type or level of tampering was done.

I am suspicious that maybe, just maybe, officials don't weigh the balls or stick a needle in every ball before every game.

I am certain that the ball boys and/or equipment manager know exactly how to prep the footballs to Brady's liking.

I am certain that the Colts had knowledge of the possible PSI discrepancies prior to the game and could have notified the refs to check the balls prior to the opening kickoff.

I am certain that the Colts tried gamesmanship to try and get in the Pats' head by doing it at halftime.
 

Chin Diesel

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And Aaron Rodgers admits to overinflating the balls and seeing if officials notice.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/sto...ntz-deflate-gate-new-england-patriots-packers

Nantz: We talked to [Aaron] Rodgers about 'How do you like your footballs?' Because, you know, you can rub them up before the game. [Phil], you really kind of created that for everybody else in the league.

Simms: I don’t know if I did, because the quarterbacks got tired of them complaining. But he said something [that] was unique: 'I like to push the limit to how much air we can put in the football, even go over what they allow you to do and see if the officials take air out of it.' Because he thinks it’s easier for him to grip. He likes them tight. Of course, he’s got very big hands and you can tell that by watching him play.

Nantz: You’ve never heard of a guy really desiring a football to be fat and overinflated before, have you?

Simms: Everybody wants it smaller and soft, so they can dig their fingers into. He’s such a feel thrower. You can tell. The one touchdown he threw down the field to the tight end is such feel; then he flicks it. That shows you he just has great control of it, with his fingers and hand.

Nantz: He said, 'God gave me big hands and a strong grip.'

Simms: You know, the officials do check those footballs and sometimes maybe even get lucky and put an extra half pound of air in there to help Aaron Rodgers out.
 
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It's not the QB's that's the issue here. THis is similar to the spygate thing. There are things that happen in football, and rules are pushed, but the Patriots clearly go a step beyond with pushing the limits, and they get caught.

When the balls are apparently as deflated as they were, across the board, there seems to be a different purpose than the QB's comfort with the ball.

Think about it.

Try stripping the ball from a running back that can squeeze a ball and dig their fingers in for grip, or stripping the ball from a receiver that's made a catch, or stripping it from a QB that's going down for a sack, when they all can squeeze that pig like a sponge.

I think if someone were to put the time and effort in to do a good statistical study, you'll find that Tom Brady, and the New England Patriot running backs, and receivers do not fumble the ball very much, and you'll probably find that players that have played in multiple teams, fumble less when they are in New England, and if you are really good at statistics, you can probably go back in time and find the point where they started deflated balls regularly for that purpose.
 
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This is kind of riveting and at the same time, when you really think about it, kind of stupid. So the Patriots are on offense and are using a flat ball. At every play stoppage a ref picks up the ball and spots it. If the ball was so flat that it was giving the Patriots some sort of shocking advantage, why don't the refs or an opposing player make a big deal out of it then and there? It seems kind of dramatic that people think the ball was so soft that the Pats couldn't fumble it but the officials never noticed this "flatness". We made it through 3 hours of game time between play, play stoppages, and breaks without it coming up and now the Pats never fumble because they use a flat football?

I agree, it is clearly cheating. However, it is cheating like all the other cheating in sports, built in with a wink and a nod.
 

HuskyHawk

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The reality is that there were already several known violations of this rule by other teams during the season. Nobody else got more than a warning, quietly, outside of the press. The NFL looks the other way. It always has. When the Patriots are involved though, suddenly it is "cheating". Many other teams were taping signals too by the way, anyone who thinks the Patriots were the only ones is nuts.

http://www.boston.com/sports/footba...he-patriots/CJH7vZuOzpndShIVLseY4O/story.html
 

HuskyHawk

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This is kind of riveting and at the same time, when you really think about it, kind of stupid. So the Patriots are on offense and are using a flat ball. At every play stoppage a ref picks up the ball and spots it. If the ball was so flat that it was giving the Patriots some sort of shocking advantage, why don't the refs or an opposing player make a big deal out of it then and there? It seems kind of dramatic that people think the ball was so soft that the Pats couldn't fumble it but the officials never noticed this "flatness". We made it through 3 hours of game time between play, play stoppages, and breaks without it coming up and now the Pats never fumble because they use a flat football?

I agree, it is clearly cheating. However, it is cheating like all the other cheating in sports, built in with a wink and a nod.

Not only that, but the balls were changed to the backup balls at halftime. All of which were properly inflated. The third quarter was when the Pats dominated the most.
 
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