OT: Isaiah Thomas

[Kitaman]

This kid is special. Its all season and not just the playoffs. I'm not a Celtic fan but am loving IT.

So what does he have that Bazz doesn't have? Or why is he (as a short player) performing so well?

 

[bazzdog]

This kid is special. Its all season and not just the playoffs. I'm not a Celtic fan but am loving IT.

So what does he have that Bazz doesn't have? Or why is he (as a short player) performing so well?

He was incredible last night. Looks like he's quicker than Bazz. I haven't seen much of Bazz lately but I don't think he can break down his man like Isaiah.

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

Quickness, handle and he is an absolute magician at the rim.

 

[Kitaman]

Quickness, handle and he is an absolute magician at the rim.

Now that you mention it, he doesn't get his shot blocked a lot when driving, and can fight through contact. The thing is he doesn't (or can't) dunk like Nate Robinson but still takes it to the rack without fear. Nonetheless he continues to give small college guards hope and a good possibility of an NBA career. Celtics certainly have a good one in this kid.

And to think the Kings and Suns let him go. Goes to show that no matter how talented you are, for the non-superstars, its all about the right team and its current situation (i.e. opportunity).

Kemba locked in the right situation in Charlotte.

 

[polycom]

He was incredible last night. Looks like he's quicker than Bazz. I haven't seen much of Bazz lately but I don't think he can break down his man like Isaiah.

Lol...of course he cant. IT is exponentially better than Bazz. IT is a top 20 player in the NBA and a top 10 guard.

 

[HuskyHawk]

This kid is special. Its all season and not just the playoffs. I'm not a Celtic fan but am loving IT.

So what does he have that Bazz doesn't have? Or why is he (as a short player) performing so well?

Let's be honest here. Bazz has tremendous savvy and instincts, but doesn't have NBA athleticism, and was pretty average athletically in college. Thomas can change directions and accelerate at unreal speed, and is more or less unguardable as a result. If you watched the Bulls series, game 3-4 in Chicago he simply scored every time down the floor for several minutes, until the Bulls tripled him, at which point he drove and kicked and the Celtics hit 3s.

The athlete he most reminds me of most is Barry Sanders.

 

[PAHusky]

IT has a beautifully refined offensive game and impressive athleticism but gets exposed often on defense. The Wizards opened up last night by going right at him and got him in a bit of foul trouble before inexplicably going away from that (not to take anything away from Stevens adjusting by switching on the screens to try to get IT off of Wall). You have to think that the Celtics need to figure out how to hide him a bit more on defense because Lebron and the Cavs, should both teams get to the conference finals, will try to isolate him via PnR just like they did to Curry in the finals last year.

 

[Dogdeacon]

I thought and said Isaiah simply could not continue to do what he did in the regular season once the playoffs came along. Given last night and what he's done thru some uniquely trying circumstances I could not have been more wrong. Maybe someone finds a way to stop him, but Isaiah's 16-2017 season thru the PLAYOFFS is every bit as amazing and as 'must see' as Curry's 2015-16 regular season was. Down 6 with 2:30 last night that game is OVER if Isaiah doesn't make a 3. Defenses have adjusted and Isaiah's getting rejected at the rim a lot more often in the playoffs, yet somehow, particularly in the 4th Q he's still finding a way to get it done. If you aren't watching this series you are missing some great offensive basketball.

 

[FartMan69]

So what does he have that Bazz doesn't have? Or why is he (as a short player) performing so well?

Serious question?

 

[DonaldDraper]

Quickness, handle and he is an absolute magician at the rim.

I like the Celts and watching IT is a pleasure. This video about Hoiberg's complaints is pretty descriptive for what the NBA refs will allow you to get away with. I feel like it should serve as a handbook for guards who want to learn how to push the envelope on the rules. If you can get away with it at the college level I would love to see Jalen steal some of these hesitation moves.

 

[superjohn]

This kid is special. Its all season and not just the playoffs. I'm not a Celtic fan but am loving IT.

So what does he have that Bazz doesn't have? Or why is he (as a short player) performing so well?

Quickness, strength, and way better ability around the rim. He's also mastered carrying the ball better than anyone in the league without getting called for it, makes his hesitations and crossovers incredibly hard to defend.

 

[upstater]

I like the Celts and watching IT is a pleasure. This video about Hoiberg's complaints is pretty descriptive for what the NBA refs will allow you to get away with. I feel like it should serve as a handbook for guards who want to learn how to push the envelope on the rules. If you can get away with it at the college level I would love to see Jalen steal some of these hesitation moves.

Since Hoiberg said that I've been watching slow motion of his handle. He never picks up or palms the ball. He pushes it. There is a big difference. He is so quick that that long stride of his gets him into space which allows him to push it like he's on a fast break. His stutter step is quick and fast, so I know why Hoiberg said it, BUT--not a travel.

 

[gtcam]

Serious question?

Perhaps Kit was asking a question to open up a discussion............................
If it isn't sarcasm or negativity sometimes people just don't get it

 

[gtcam]

Since Hoiberg said that I've been watching slow motion of his handle. He never picks up or palms the ball. He pushes it. There is a big difference. He is so quick that that long stride of his gets him into space which allows him to push it like he's on a fast break. His stutter step is quick and fast, so I know why Hoiberg said it, BUT--not a travel.

I like Hoiberg but this is kind of small for him
For crying out loud - he coaches and watches the king of taking advantage - D Rose
The NBA players do things that would foul them out in 15 minutes of the college game.
IT does exactly what so many others do but is so quick about it that to the untrained eye its a blur - the guy is a phenom for his size.

 

[JSM1970]

Agreed, shouldn't even be in the same sentence

Lol...of course he cant. IT is exponentially better than Bazz. IT is a top 20 player in the NBA and a top 10 guard.

 

[JSM1970]

The Kings must wake up everyday and think we traded IT for Alex Oraki, who is that again?

Love it

Quickness, strength, and way better ability around the rim. He's also mastered carrying the ball better than anyone in the league without getting called for it, makes his hesitations and crossovers incredibly hard to defend.

 

[husky429]

Lol...of course he cant. IT is exponentially better than Bazz. IT is a top 20 player in the NBA and a top 10 guard.

I'd say top 10 player and top 5 guard without question.

Isaiah is on another level than Bazz at basically everything, which really shouldn't be a slight to Bazz, IT is just out of this world good.

His handle is excellent, but the reason why he's SO good is because he can move vertically as well as horizontally. Most guard can move north south that well and are limited penetrating the lane. His speed is freakish. Having a good shot to keep defenders honest only makes it better.

IT's footwork is OUTSTANDING for a guard. He knows how to keep his man on his hip, close the gate, lean just right to draw contact. On offense he is constantly aware of the angle of his defenders feet and hips, he has internalized this so well that it's become natural for him to attack the opponents weaknesses. He is strong and tough (see losing his tooth and still scoring 39), and super well conditioned. That's the reason for his 4th quarter onslaughts. His competitiveness is crazy compared to most other guys in the league right now. Dude would spit fire to win games.

Rather than Shabazz, I think his best Uconn comp would be Alterique. A short, super-strong guard, with an elite handle and a good shot. I guarantee you that Gilbert is talking about IT's game with Chillious. IT is exactly what AG should aspire to be.

 

[AtlHusky]

How about his illegal FTs? He makes over 90%, but he breaks a rule by crossing the stripe before the ball hits the rim/backboard. I haven't seen a lot of him, but did notice it last night so I paused the TV and snapped a pic (which also shows a Wizard lane violation). Here is the NBA rule:

• 9b. The free throw shooter may not step over the plane of the free throw line until theball touches the basket ring, backboard or the free throw ends.

Anybody have an issue with this? I'm not sure that it really is an advantage unless he's going for a rebound.

 

[gtcam]

NO
No issue at all

 

[husky429]

How about his illegal FTs? He makes over 90%, but he breaks a rule by crossing the stripe before the ball hits the rim/backboard. I haven't seen a lot of him, but did notice it last night so I paused the TV and snapped a pic (which also shows a Wizard lane violation). Here is the NBA rule:

• 9b. The free throw shooter may not step over the plane of the free throw line until theball touches the basket ring, backboard or the free throw ends.

Anybody have an issue with this? I'm not sure that it really is an advantage unless he's going for a rebound.

He's too short to get the rebound anyways, ha!

Yeah, it's against the rules, but a lot of guys do it. You know that you're good when people start complaining you "carry" and "cheat on free throws"... Every star pushes the limit of what they can get away with. It's part of the game.

 

[JSM1970]

Just guards, top 5?

Who would you take/replace to put him in top 5?

Lowry
Derozan
Dame Dolla
CP3
Booker
Harden
Kyrie
Russ
Steph
Klay
Wall
Beal
Conley

And leaving a few guys off who could be in the discussion

I love him, but he's nowehrre near a top 10 guard. Huge defensive liability and one dimples

I'd say top 10 player and top 5 guard without question.

Isaiah is on another level than Bazz at basically everything, which really shouldn't be a slight to Bazz, IT is just out of this world good.

His handle is excellent, but the reason why he's SO good is because he can move vertically as well as horizontally. Most guard can move north south that well and are limited penetrating the lane. His speed is freakish. Having a good shot to keep defenders honest only makes it better.

IT's footwork is OUTSTANDING for a guard. He knows how to keep his man on his hip, close the gate, lean just right to draw contact. On offense he is constantly aware of the angle of his defenders feet and hips, he has internalized this so well that it's become natural for him to attack the opponents weaknesses. He is strong and tough (see losing his tooth and still scoring 39), and super well conditioned. That's the reason for his 4th quarter onslaughts. His competitiveness is crazy compared to most other guys in the league right now. Dude would spit fire to win games.

Rather than Shabazz, I think his best UConn comp would be Alterique. A short, super-strong guard, with an elite handle and a good shot. I guarantee you that Gilbert is talking about IT's game with Chillious. IT is exactly what AG should aspire to be.

 

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

How about his illegal FTs? He makes over 90%, but he breaks a rule by crossing the stripe before the ball hits the rim/backboard. I haven't seen a lot of him, but did notice it last night so I paused the TV and snapped a pic (which also shows a Wizard lane violation). Here is the NBA rule:

• 9b. The free throw shooter may not step over the plane of the free throw line until theball touches the basket ring, backboard or the free throw ends.

Anybody have an issue with this? I'm not sure that it really is an advantage unless he's going for a rebound.

If Isiah Thomas is grabbing his own board off a free three my issue is with the 6 guys lined up.

 

[RayIsTheGOAT]

Just guards, top 5?

Who would you take/replace to put him in top 5?

Lowry
Derozan
Dame Dolla
CP3
Booker
Harden
Kyrie
Russ
Steph
Klay
Wall
Beal
Conley

And leaving a few guys off who could be in the discussion

I love him, but he's nowehrre near a top 10 guard. Huge defensive liability and one dimples

Well it's hard to lump all shooting guards and point guards into one category like you did.
He's definitely not a top 5 PG but he is a top 10 PG.

The only PGs I would take over Isaiah are
CP3
Steph
Russell
Kyrie
Wall
Lowry
And we can haggle over whether Harden is a 1 or a 2

Then IT is somewhere sandwiched between Conley, Kemba and Lillard. IT also fits very well with the Celtics offense, I'm sure those other guys would put out similar, if not better production in Brad Stevens' system.

 

[polycom]

Well it's hard to lump all shooting guards and point guards into one category like you did.
He's definitely not a top 5 PG but he is a top 10 PG.

The only PGs I would take over Isaiah are
CP3
Steph
Russell
Kyrie
Wall
Lowry
And we can haggle over whether Harden is a 1 or a 2

Then IT is somewhere sandwiched between Conley, Kemba and Lillard. IT also fits very well with the Celtics offense, I'm sure those other guys would put out similar, if not better production in Brad Stevens' system.

Lillard and Conley are both better than IT.

 

[JSM1970]

On a different point, how good did Rozier look in his minutes.

Assuming C's get the #1 and take Fultz it will very interesting what their backcourt looks like going into 2018-19.

I don't think they give IT a max deal or anywhere close.

Lillard and Conley are both better than IT.