OT: Biggest Threat to the Heat

[JaYnYcE]

Charles Oakley just said it was the Knicks on first take. He feels that the Bulls are done and that they should rest Rose and play for a lottery pick. He also said Boston is a middle of the road team, 4 or 5 seed and that he can't put BK ahead of the Knicks because JJ and Williams haven't played together yet.


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[Adios]

What does he smoke?

 

[aceboon]

lol

 

[UConn990411]

He's a bumbling duck*ing idiot.

The Celtics and Heat went to 7 games last year, and both teams addressed their needs as well as anyone this offseason (the Celtics got a whole lot deeper, the Heat added 3-point shooters to its roster). While even the biggest die hard Boston fan can't feel too good about the Celtics beating Miami in a series, they, more than anyone in the East, have at least a puncher's chance.

The Knicks, Nets, and Pacers simply aren't good enough, and the Bulls seem resigned to waiting till 2013-14 to try to contend again.

I think everyone with half a brains knows that if the Heat are to be de-throned, it will be by a Western Conference team - namely the Thunder, Lakers, or Spurs (with the latter being the least likely).

 

[HuskyBballFan]

First Take is not where you should be getting your analysis.

 

[caw]

Charles Oakley just said it was the Knicks on first take. He feels that the Bulls are done and that they should rest Rose and play for a lottery pick. He also said Boston is a middle of the road team, 4 or 5 seed and that he can't put BK ahead of the Knicks because JJ and Williams haven't played together yet.


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I assume he meant in the East?

Chicago - Huge dropoff if Rose is injured all/most of the year, still they picked up Hinrich/Teague to fill in, which is decent and they will play good defense. If they can rest Rose and get him back for the playoffs, they could be dangerous. Knicks and about 4 other teams should jump them in the standings.

Miami - Decent upgrade on the bench with Allen and Lewis.

Indiana - Pretty much stayed the same as last year, but no drop-off either.

Boston - Lost Ray but picked up a ton of depth and some youth in Terry, Lee, Sullinger, Melo, possibly Jeff Green. If they can stay healthy that is a much deeper team than last year, especially once Bradley comes back. It killed them to only have 3 healthy guards in last year's playoffs. Pierce and Garnett are still going to be fighting old man time, so nothing is a given, but this team might be better than last year's, it is on paper. They may not have anyone as scary/dangerous as Ray on the team in end of game situations (Terry/Lee/Bradley are not close) but the depth is impressive.

Atlanta - Not a team I expect to be great, but they are good enough to stay about where they were last year.

Orlando - Lost their best and second best players for a bunch of junk. They should be fighting Charlotte for worst team in the East.

New York - Good upgrades on the bench (though old), not sure if they are better than the Celtics, or the Heat for that matter, but they should (if healthy) be a top 3-4 team in the East.

Philadelphia - Huge upgrades, not a fan of Hawes at PF, but they have the best center in the East and a decent 1-3. I think they will make a big jump also. Bynum could cause the Heat some trouble.

Milwaukee - Good enough not to be horrid, not good enough to be a threat to anyone past a game or two. Golden State 2.0

Detroit - Too young and Knight is a horrid PG. I like the potential down low with Monroe/Drummond though.

Toronto - Rookie center, rookie SG, they might make the playoffs, but only because other teams drop off. I expect them to be around 9-10

Brooklyn - Not a fan of their team to cause any real damage, but they have a decent 1-3. Reminds me too much of the past few Atlanta teams (with a better PG).

Cleveland - Good young talent, not a good team this year. I think Waiters can be good next to Irving (I think a lot of SGs would look good next to Irving) but he needs to stay in shape, he looked fat during Summer League.

Washington - Lots of improvements, no excuses for Wall next year. He needs to prove he's a good PG though. Right now he is a great athlete and that's it.

Charlotte - I love what they have done the past two years, but they aren't there yet. I do think they will surprise a few teams though.

I'd probably rank them as follows:

Champs:
Miami

Contenders:
Boston
New York
Indiana
Philadelphia

Likely playoffs:
Brooklyn
Chicago
Atlanta
Washington

Outside looking in:
Milwaukee
Toronto
Detroit - close to the next group, only Monroe keeps them here IMO.

Bottom of the Barrel:
Charlotte
Cleveland
Orlando

 

[sparky]

LBJ had a stellar playoff and Wade did not. I think the men in green are much better than last year, but need Bradley healthy. There are no other teams in the East that will contend. With the addition of Ray the Heat have a legit threat to spread the floor and score. Their bench is repleat with fill ins that can help, but not consistently. They did however come up big in the playoffs. All that being said, it will be hard for for boston to win the East unless Wade does not come back 100%. Rondo could be the wild card provided he can be relevant from the outside, if not the men in green will be 2nd. The West will be WILD with DH in LA. He is a liability at the end of games and his back may come in question. The lakers are old and the Thunder will roll on.

 

[JaYnYcE]

I think what people don't take into consideration is that Boston took a 3-2 lead without Bosh. They figured out how to beat the Heat when it was just LeBron / Wade and company. As soon as Bosh returned he added the biggest part of what Miami loves to do in getting the oppositions Bigs out of the paint. With that being said, I believe we have better big man depth at this point than Boston does at the moment in Chandler, STAT, Camby and Thomas and could get even better with the addition of either KMart, Amundson, or Birdman.


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[Kitaman]

I think what people don't take into consideration is that Boston took a 3-2 lead without Bosh. They figured out how to beat the Heat when it was just LeBron / Wade and company. As soon as Bosh returned he added the biggest part of what Miami loves to do in getting the oppositions Bigs out of the paint. With that being said, I believe we have better big man depth at this point than Boston does at the moment in Chandler, STAT, Camby and Thomas and could get even better with the addition of either KMart, Amundson, or Birdman.


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If you continue posting I just might return to watching 'my' Knicks. You should consider applying for the marketing department. You are slowly turning me. However I'm a really big frustrated, suffering and disappointed Knick ship out at sea for many, many years.

 

[JaYnYcE]

If you continue posting I just might return to watching 'my' Knicks. You should consider applying for the marketing department. You are slowly turning me. However I'm a really big frustrated, suffering and disappointed Knick ship out at sea for many, many years.

Come in, the waters great! No but seriously I just want the Knicks to focus on winning the division first and foremost away from Boston's stranglehold the past 5 seasons.


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[Huskies4ever]

I assume he meant in the East?

Chicago - Huge dropoff if Rose is injured all/most of the year, still they picked up Hinrich/Teague to fill in, which is decent and they will play good defense. If they can rest Rose and get him back for the playoffs, they could be dangerous. Knicks and about 4 other teams should jump them in the standings.

Miami - Decent upgrade on the bench with Allen and Lewis.

Indiana - Pretty much stayed the same as last year, but no drop-off either.

Boston - Lost Ray but picked up a ton of depth and some youth in Terry, Lee, Sullinger, Melo, possibly Jeff Green. If they can stay healthy that is a much deeper team than last year, especially once Bradley comes back. It killed them to only have 3 healthy guards in last year's playoffs. Pierce and Garnett are still going to be fighting old man time, so nothing is a given, but this team might be better than last year's, it is on paper. They may not have anyone as scary/dangerous as Ray on the team in end of game situations (Terry/Lee/Bradley are not close) but the depth is impressive.

Atlanta - Not a team I expect to be great, but they are good enough to stay about where they were last year.

Orlando - Lost their best and second best players for a bunch of junk. They should be fighting Charlotte for worst team in the East.

New York - Good upgrades on the bench (though old), not sure if they are better than the Celtics, or the Heat for that matter, but they should (if healthy) be a top 3-4 team in the East.

Philadelphia - Huge upgrades, not a fan of Hawes at PF, but they have the best center in the East and a decent 1-3. I think they will make a big jump also. Bynum could cause the Heat some trouble.

Milwaukee - Good enough not to be horrid, not good enough to be a threat to anyone past a game or two. Golden State 2.0

Detroit - Too young and Knight is a horrid PG. I like the potential down low with Monroe/Drummond though.

Toronto - Rookie center, rookie SG, they might make the playoffs, but only because other teams drop off. I expect them to be around 9-10

Brooklyn - Not a fan of their team to cause any real damage, but they have a decent 1-3. Reminds me too much of the past few Atlanta teams (with a better PG).

Cleveland - Good young talent, not a good team this year. I think Waiters can be good next to Irving (I think a lot of SGs would look good next to Irving) but he needs to stay in shape, he looked fat during Summer League.

Washington - Lots of improvements, no excuses for Wall next year. He needs to prove he's a good PG though. Right now he is a great athlete and that's it.

Charlotte - I love what they have done the past two years, but they aren't there yet. I do think they will surprise a few teams though.

I'd probably rank them as follows:

Champs:
Miami

Contenders:
Boston
New York
Indiana
Philadelphia

Likely playoffs:
Brooklyn
Chicago
Atlanta
Washington

Outside looking in:
Milwaukee
Toronto
Detroit - close to the next group, only Monroe keeps them here IMO.

Bottom of the Barrel:
Charlotte
Cleveland
Orlando

Don't know about Atlanta, they should drop. Didn't they lose Joe Johnson?

 

[caw]

Don't know about Atlanta, they should drop. Didn't they lose Joe Johnson?

I like their guard situation even better than some of the other teams below them. I guess you could put them somewhere between those teams they are with and teams below.

 

[HeGotGame]

Your delusional view of the Knicks is embarrassing. The Knicks suck, they have for years and will continue to suck for years to as long as they have people like Dolan making roster decisions. They have won 1 playoff game in the last decade. 1.

You really think players like Melo and Amare and going to get you anywhere? There is a reason Melo was on the bench in crunch time in the Olympics, sure he can destroy Nigeria (which made you so giddy you took the time to sign onto a message board and "chant" "Melo Melo") but he is not a player who teams can build NBA franchise around and expect to win anything of importance. And "STAT" ha, he will get hurt, again, and all that tutoring from Hakeem will not mean anything. The Melo and Amare experiment has had 2 years and resulted in a grand total of 1 playoff win.

Oakley is a former Knick, are you surprised he said this?

Mike Woodson is an average who coach who can take average talent and get them to the 1st round where they lose. He is the perfect fit for the Knicks.

Keep thinking the corpses of Camby, Kidd and Thomas will do anything. Raymond Felton had a great season in NY under Dantoni, but Dantoni isnt there anymore. Post Dantoni Felton has been average.

Sorry for the rant but Knicks fans drive me nuts, they are so delusional and you take the cake. I cannot wait until they are 42-40 and the 6 seed, if they are lucky, and lose in the 1st round again. This team has been .500 in the last month of the season the last two years, it will be 3 this year.

Charles Oakley just said it was the Knicks on first take. He feels that the Bulls are done and that they should rest Rose and play for a lottery pick. He also said Boston is a middle of the road team, 4 or 5 seed and that he can't put BK ahead of the Knicks because JJ and Williams haven't played together yet.


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[UConn990411]

I think what people don't take into consideration is that Boston took a 3-2 lead without Bosh. They figured out how to beat the Heat when it was just LeBron / Wade and company. As soon as Bosh returned he added the biggest part of what Miami loves to do in getting the oppositions Bigs out of the paint. With that being said, I believe we have better big man depth at this point than Boston does at the moment in Chandler, STAT, Camby and Thomas and could get even better with the addition of either KMart, Amundson, or Birdman.

...and the Heat went 3-0 against the Pacers without Bosh. Are we simply supposed to dismiss those first 5 games of the Boston series?

I wouldn't pick the Celtics to beat the Heat (in fact, I wouldn't pick them to win more than 2 games), but it's laughable to think the Knicks have a better chance between the two teams.

 

[JaYnYcE]

...and the Heat went 3-0 against the Pacers without Bosh. Are we simply supposed to dismiss those first 5 games of the Boston series?

I wouldn't pick the Celtics to beat the Heat (in fact, I wouldn't pick them to win more than 2 games), but it's laughable to think the Knicks have a better chance between the two teams.

The Celtics are a better team than the Pacers and have more veteran guys who've been there before. I think with time that Pacers squad may be an elite team but at the moment I would put Boston above them.

I just don't know who will guard Bosh and protect the paint when the Heat plays Boston. Bradley will help nullify Wade, but who is going to protect your paint? Rookies? I'm not familiar with all the off-season moves by Boston besides Terry, Green, Allen, Lee and the resigning of KG. I don't know why Stiemsma wasn't brought back because he showed a ton of promise last year off the bench.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and it's a fair argument that this board is most likely pro Boston for certain professional sports so I won't try to sway anyone. I think having a ton of Big Men in your rotation can only help to stop Miami and it was good to hear a former professional basketball player who played not only for the Knicks, but also for the Bulls in Jordan's early years.


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[UConn990411]

Who will protect the paint for Boston? I'm gonna go with Kevin Garnett - the guy was 2nd Team All-Defense and the third best center in the NBA last season (after Howard and Bynum) once he switched to the position full time.

The Celtics did not bring Stiemsma back simply because they could not afford him. Howard, they re-signed Chris Wilcox to the vet's minimum, drafted Jared Sullinger, and brought in Jason Collins as insurance. Health is a question mark with two of those guys (and age is a question mark with KG), but that's a pretty solid frontcourt on paper.

And anyway, big men are becoming less and less important in today's NBA. Did you happen to catch any of the Finals? Miami's and OKC's best lineups both had their starting SFs playing PF, and their starting PFs playing center. (Same with Boston and San Antonio.) That's the direction the NBA is heading in. So while quality big men are nice to have, they are far from an essential need to win an NBA championship.

 

[zls44]

What the hell Knick fans are you taking to that dont think Dolan is the problem and the franchise is a joke? Its just an incredibly tough franchise to support.

Love Chandler. He deserves better than this franchise.

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[JaYnYcE]

Who will protect the paint for Boston? I'm gonna go with Kevin Garnett - the guy was 2nd Team All-Defense and the third best center in the NBA last season (after Howard and Bynum) once he switched to the position full time.

The Celtics did not bring Stiemsma back simply because they could not afford him. Howard, they re-signed Chris Wilcox to the vet's minimum, drafted Jared Sullinger, and brought in Jason Collins as insurance. Health is a question mark with two of those guys (and age is a question mark with KG), but that's a pretty solid frontcourt on paper.

And anyway, big men are becoming less and less important in today's NBA. Did you happen to catch any of the Finals? Miami's and OKC's best lineups both had their starting SFs playing PF, and their starting PFs playing center. (Same with Boston and San Antonio.) That's the direction the NBA is heading in. So while quality big men are nice to have, they are far from an essential need to win an NBA championship.

That's great that KG will protect the paint. With that taken care of, who will Boston put on Bosh? He's a very skilled Big Man who can hit a consistent jump shot and needs to be accounted for. That's where my big man point comes from really. Miami is dynamic, athletic and will run you out of the gym but if you can figure out how to take Bosh out of the equation by putting a good big defender on him while not sacrificing leaving the rim, then that's a good start IMO.


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[JaYnYcE]

What the hell Knick fans are you taking to that dont think Dolan is the problem and the franchise is a joke? Its just an incredibly tough franchise to support.

Love Chandler. He deserves better than this franchise.

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Chandler wasn't traded here or forced to come here against his will. Knicks offered him a healthy contract and he's been great for us.

Knicks have improved every year since the 2010-2011 season and are looking to have a promising season. I'm not claiming championships or that we will beat the Heat. Just saying that on paper we have a very formidable squad and are deep at multiple positions for the first time since, I really don't know actually. The 90's? You can't blame (some) Knick fans for being excited for this upcoming season.

And I don't care for Dolan nor do I let him stop me from rooting for my Knicks. There's nothing he can do that he hasn't already done that's going to stop that.


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[JaYnYcE]

Chicago Bulls Rumors
‏@chicagobullsbot
New York Knicks seem favorites to land Kenyon Martin due to Melo/JR Smith past history and the Knicks likely to give him the most minutes.

I think if we can pull this off we would have arguably the best front court depth in the NBA. I think he goes to the Lakers personally because he's been living in LA from playing for the Clippers last season and he has a better shot at getting a ring there.


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[UConn990411]

That's great that KG will protect the paint. With that taken care of, who will Boston put on Bosh? He's a very skilled Big Man who can hit a consistent jump shot and needs to be accounted for. That's where my big man point comes from really. Miami is dynamic, athletic and will run you out of the gym but if you can figure out how to take Bosh out of the equation by putting a good big defender on him while not sacrificing leaving the rim, then that's a good start IMO.

Brandon Bass, Jeff Green in spurts, KG when Bosh is playing center (which is a lot, especially in crunch time).

 

[JaYnYcE]

Brandon Bass, Jeff Green in spurts, KG when Bosh is playing center (which is a lot, especially in crunch time).

And that doesnt make you nervous? The moment KG leaves that paint LBJ, Wade and Chalmers will kill that rim.

I wish you guys all the best with your personel and your defensive rotations of Jeff Green, KG and Brandon Bass against Bosh and the penetrators of the Heat.

 

[21Huskies]

Knicks fans think they are playing a video game.

they forget that just because a player has 'talent' that he still has to produce. when you use the ball as much as Melo does and you play as inefficiently as he does, you'll never win a postseason series against a good team... ever.

the only way they win is if Melo defers more and takes higher % shots. they don't have a horrible roster, but guys like Melo kill teams chances in 7 game series. because while he might have 2 35 point 50% shooting games that win for his team, he'll have 4 25 shot 40% shooting games that single handidly take his team out of contention.

 

[JaYnYcE]

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[UConn990411]

And that doesnt make you nervous? The moment KG leaves that paint LBJ, Wade and Chalmers will kill that rim.

I wish you guys all the best with your personel and your defensive rotations of Jeff Green, KG and Brandon Bass against Bosh and the penetrators of the Heat.

LOL, I feel a lot better about that than relying on Amare staying healthy and Kidd and Camby's carcasses producing.