OT: Amelia Earhart survived...really? | The Boneyard

OT: Amelia Earhart survived...really?

Blakeon18

Dormie
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
4,120
Reaction Score
13,255
Does This Photo Show Amelia Earhart After Her Plane Disappeared? - History in the Headlines

I confess to finding mysteries like this one fascinating....whether the evidence is strong or crumbly.
The link takes you to this subject. Apparently History Channel is airing the entire show on Sunday night July 9.

Did she and her co-pilot survive the crash? Well...that's a better shot than Elvis currently living in Missoula Montana or other theories of him currently roaming the good ole USA.
 
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
6,651
Reaction Score
14,696
Does This Photo Show Amelia Earhart After Her Plane Disappeared? - History in the Headlines

I confess to finding mysteries like this one fascinating....whether the evidence is strong or crumbly.
The link takes you to this subject. Apparently History Channel is airing the entire show on Sunday night July 9.

Did she and her co-pilot survive the crash? Well...that's a better shot than Elvis currently living in Missoula Montana or other theories of him currently roaming the good ole USA.
Fascinating yes, and probably a real money maker. People do like this stuff and I'm foolish enough to watch it too.
But, alas, I classify it right in with Bigfoot, flying saucers, the Loch Ness Monster and others.
 

CL82

NCAA Men’s Basketball National Champions - Again!
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
59,023
Reaction Score
219,723
Take a look at the picture. Earhart is turned away, so while the woman in the picture certainly looks like her, identifying her is problematic. On the other hand her navigator is looking right into the camera and is a spot on match. I think the issue is whether the photo was taken before or after her plane went down.
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
11,335
Reaction Score
25,045
Does This Photo Show Amelia Earhart After Her Plane Disappeared? - History in the Headlines

I confess to finding mysteries like this one fascinating....whether the evidence is strong or crumbly.
The link takes you to this subject. Apparently History Channel is airing the entire show on Sunday night July 9.

Did she and her co-pilot survive the crash? Well...that's a better shot than Elvis currently living in Missoula Montana or other theories of him currently roaming the good ole USA.

Yes--she survived. I met her 25 years ago in Tuckerton, NJ. She was not on a mission for FDR
In Australia, she and her co=pilot, turned the Aircraft to 2 other flyers and took a ship to India where they awaited the arrival of the aircraft--it never arrived. So they sailed to Seattle --and forever maintained a low profile.
Anastasia, the Russian Royalty supposedly killed by Soviets--was living in the same compound with Amelia---
It was a gated community---

I met Elvis 15 years ago in New Orleans---he was doing a drag impression of a female doing an impression of Elvis---it obviously was Elvis-- a bit overweight

I found all three, via the Internet--and if it's on the Internet --it's FACT!!
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
11,335
Reaction Score
25,045
Fascinating yes, and probably a real money maker. People do like this stuff and I'm foolish enough to watch it too.
But, alas, I classify it right in with Bigfoot, flying saucers, the Loch Ness Monster and others.

I saw them all ---and they are REAL---Nessie isn't a monster, just a lovable lizard ---Big foot --is an insult heaped upon a nice person, a bit hairy, but LeBron James feet are bigger--if you were in my home when my wife gets mad--you too would see flying saucers!!!
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
11,335
Reaction Score
25,045
I'd rather have them crashing, out of fuel, than starving to death in a Japanese death camp.
You'll never know---any island the Japanese were on --had she/they landed there-would have sent many messages back to Japan about them--so somewhere, someone, documents, would give her/their location-status. and a high value person like her would be shipped to Tokyo. Island people now talking were not alive then, most likely, or they would have had little contact with the outside world to see her pictures--remember--radio went to the horizon with out great power or skip--not great distances- no TV, no Satellite , not Internet--and no Boneyard---
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
35,879
Reaction Score
33,064
Take a look at the picture. Earhart is turned away, so while the woman in the picture certainly looks like her, identifying her is problematic. On the other hand her navigator is looking right into the camera and is a spot on match. I think the issue is whether the photo was taken before or after her plane went down.
They identified a 38' item on a barge towed by the ship in the picture, and her plan was 38' long. I'm pretty convinced that is Amelia and Fred Noonan in that picture. Since she never planned to be there, I would assume her plane did land nearby, and they did survive the landing.
 

CL82

NCAA Men’s Basketball National Champions - Again!
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
59,023
Reaction Score
219,723
They identified a 38' item on a barge towed by the ship in the picture, and her plan was 38' long. I'm pretty convinced that is Amelia and Fred Noonan in that picture. Since she never planned to be there, I would assume her plane did land nearby, and they did survive the landing.
I agree. The question is when was it taken? Could it have been at an earlier stop and that's why no one thought it was remarkable at the time?
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
11,335
Reaction Score
25,045
I agree. The question is when was it taken? Could it have been at an earlier stop and that's why no one thought it was remarkable at the time?

If Amelia, not my grand daughter Amelia, where about and where she had been --was found--factually don't you believe this would be front page news for papers, and headline stories on TV???
Not a word except an Former FBI agent says he found her---and after the FBI history in Boston--we know they don't lie--OfTEN, just big.
 

UcMiami

How it is
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
14,157
Reaction Score
47,007
I tend to favor the previous 'new discovery' of stuff on Gardner Island. The idea of Japanese captivity or execution seems always to run into the issue of Japanese record keeping which was extensive. That a unique prisoner would disappear from all records strikes me as strange.
 

Bliss

Mizzou Ballyhoo
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Messages
627
Reaction Score
936
If she had become a POW the Japanese would have exploited her capture with numerous "I was spying for the U.S." episodes and she would have been freed to return home after their surrender, assuming they hadn't executed her by that point. The only possibility that makes any sense to me is a fatal ocean crash.
 

JS

Moderator
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
2,001
Reaction Score
9,695
I can't tell anything from that picture. :D
If you click on it, you should get the opportunity to enlarge it.

I see several areas of coincidence that lead me to believe it may be for real.

1. The picture shows a group including some apparent Marshall Islanders and two Caucasians.

2. Caucasian #1 is a woman sitting on the edge of the dock with her back to the camera. She has the same build as Earhart. She has the same bobbed hair. She's wearing pants (typical of the tomboyish Earhart).

3. Caucasian #2, the tall man at far left of the group, has a distinctive triangular receding hairline. Looks a lot like copilot Noonan. Quite a coincidence for someone who looks like that to be in the same picture with someone who looks like she could be Earhart.

4. The "Earhart" woman is staring to her right at something apparently being towed on a barge. The analysts promoting this new evidence say it looks like a plane, and they apply rules of thumb to say it's the same size as Earhart's. The towing vessel has been specifically identified.

As to the time of the picture, the location is marked on the photo -- a particular harbor. It shouldn't be difficult to determine if and when Earhart and Noonan stopped there on their regular course, prior to disappearing.

As to why the Japanese wouldn't have made propaganda out of it had they considered her a POW or spy, I don't know. As to her death in a crash being the only explanation for her disappearance, I think the conjecture is that she died of natural causes (malaria, dysentery or something) while in captivity. If it happened early on, it might explain why the Japanese hadn't yet figured out what to do.

Final comment, like Blake and others I find this fascinating but have an extra reason.

My mother was an Earhart. My son's middle name is Earhart. I'm named after my grandfather, who my own father referred to as "Mr. E." His brother, my great-uncle, met Amelia and chatted with her about where their families originally came from, way back. Turned out to be the same town.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
732
Reaction Score
3,007
She could not have been a POW (at the time) because we were not at war yet. It would have been a major international incident if the Japanese had admitted to having detained and not returned them.

Perhaps a local commander thought they were spies or that they had seen something the Japanese wanted to hide; and, since no one knew they were in Japanese hands, they could be disposed of without repercussions.

Concerning communications evidence, I don't think that there was much communications about a lot that that the Japanese were doing - Nanking for instance.
 
Joined
Jun 27, 2015
Messages
399
Reaction Score
2,294
Count me a sceptic. I looked at the picture and as far as I'm concerned it could be any one of thousands, millions?, of men and women in that part of the world at that time.
 

UcMiami

How it is
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
14,157
Reaction Score
47,007
If you click on it, you should get the opportunity to enlarge it.

I see several areas of coincidence that lead me to believe it may be for real.

1. The picture shows a group including some apparent Marshall Islanders and two Caucasians.

2. Caucasian #1 is a woman sitting on the edge of the dock with her back to the camera. She has the same build as Earhart. She has the same bobbed hair. She's wearing pants (typical of the tomboyish Earhart).

3. Caucasian #2, the tall man at far left of the group, has a distinctive triangular receding hairline. Looks a lot like copilot Noonan. Quite a coincidence for someone who looks like that to be in the same picture with someone who looks like she could be Earhart.

4. The "Earhart" woman is staring to her right at something apparently being towed on a barge. The analysts promoting this new evidence say it looks like a plane, and they apply rules of thumb to say it's the same size as Earhart's. The towing vessel has been specifically identified.

As to the time of the picture, the location is marked on the photo -- a particular harbor. It shouldn't be difficult to determine if and when Earhart and Noonan stopped there on their regular course, prior to disappearing.

As to why the Japanese wouldn't have made propaganda out of it had they considered her a POW or spy, I don't know. As to her death in a crash being the only explanation for her disappearance, I think the conjecture is that she died of natural causes (malaria, dysentery or something) while in captivity. If it happened early on, it might explain why the Japanese hadn't yet figured out what to do.

Final comment, like Blake and others I find this fascinating but have an extra reason.

My mother was an Earhart. My son's middle name is Earhart. I'm named after my grandfather, who my own father referred to as "Mr. E." His brother, my great-uncle, met Amelia and chatted with her about where their families originally came from, way back. Turned out to be the same town.
Very interesting. But I am still skeptical - the recovery operation to get a crash landed plane onto the boat would have taken days if not weeks, involved a significant number of people and money and locals. This photo was taken at the end of that time period and if believed includes both Noonan and Earhart casually watching the recovery operation's conclusion with no indication that they are in anyway under duress with maybe ten islanders standing around on the wharf and on the boat tied to it. Hard to believe if they were at that time free to move around that they hadn't found some way to communicate, and if they are actually already 'captive' it is a very casual situation for such captivity and is surprising they or the islanders did not leave any trace of what would have been an extraordinary moment.
That ONI photographed the scene and preserved the photograph, but with no record of what it showed is also odd - if it was an important moment of an extraordinary event one would expect some reference. If it was one of thousands/millions of photographs of non-extraordinary events date/place is all you would expect.
 

Biff

Mega Monster Moderator
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
3,300
Reaction Score
24,898
If you click on it, you should get the opportunity to enlarge it.

I see several areas of coincidence that lead me to believe it may be for real.

1. The picture shows a group including some apparent Marshall Islanders and two Caucasians.

2. Caucasian #1 is a woman sitting on the edge of the dock with her back to the camera. She has the same build as Earhart. She has the same bobbed hair. She's wearing pants (typical of the tomboyish Earhart).

3. Caucasian #2, the tall man at far left of the group, has a distinctive triangular receding hairline. Looks a lot like copilot Noonan. Quite a coincidence for someone who looks like that to be in the same picture with someone who looks like she could be Earhart.

4. The "Earhart" woman is staring to her right at something apparently being towed on a barge. The analysts promoting this new evidence say it looks like a plane, and they apply rules of thumb to say it's the same size as Earhart's. The towing vessel has been specifically identified.

Unfortunately Counselor your analysis totally falls apart in your point number 4. You falsely interpret that the woman in question is looking at the towed barge. You make this mistake by focusing too closely on one minute detail missing the forest for the trees. If you pull back a little you can see that the woman is staring to her right because she's shocked to see Elvis is on the dock (apparently due to his having left an area building).

new_theory.jpg
 

JS

Moderator
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
2,001
Reaction Score
9,695
Very interesting. But I am still skeptical -
Skepticism is healthy. A modest rebuttal if I may. I won't bother to answer Biff, who's just mean.

1. We don't know how or if the plane "crash landed." They could've found an isolated airstrip on one of the islands in the vicinity or managed to land relatively intact on an extensive beach and/or ended up in nearby shallows. Then who knows what it would take to roll or lift the plane onto a barge in order to take it to a port. A work gang for sure, but perhaps not people who knew the import of the unscheduled visitors they were dealing with. Insufficient ink in the Marshall Islands Gazette to a circumnavigation attempt that wasn't supposed to have anything to do with the locality.

2. For the same reason, the gendarmes/Japanese army presence might not have jumped them the minute they arrived. Agree they don't appear to be under visible duress -- yet. Some questioning (whether or not they told the truth) and some cables back and forth would have ensued before an arrest. In the meantime, they've just drawn some curious bystanders.

3. My impression of the photo is that it wasn't meant to capture the two visitors. If it had been, there's no apparent reason for the photographer not to get closer. Again, a general harbor shot because people onshore (probably not Americans; maybe local humint sources) didn't know the significance.
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
11,335
Reaction Score
25,045
She could not have been a POW (at the time) because we were not at war yet. It would have been a major international incident if the Japanese had admitted to having detained and not returned them.

Perhaps a local commander thought they were spies or that they had seen something the Japanese wanted to hide; and, since no one knew they were in Japanese hands, they could be disposed of without repercussions.

Concerning communications evidence, I don't think that there was much communications about a lot that that the Japanese were doing - Nanking for instance.
Communications by Japanese forces were by radio or ship carrying messages--or word of mouth
no real radio, no tv, no internet, yet they communicated. It is factually called the Rape of Nanking--should have been called the Rape and Mass murders of Nanking.
 

ocoandasoc

Fan of MizzoUConn
Joined
Nov 20, 2012
Messages
360
Reaction Score
1,169
I've examined the photo and "evidence." [mod edit]

(Wait... isn't that Judge Crater sitting in the boat with the Lindbergh baby and the czar's youngest daughter on his lap?)

Seriously, though, real historical experts on Earhardt's disappearance have weighed in and declared this little more than a hoax. Just PR hype to interest people in a new documentary.

My favorite part is where they talk about the "unique hairline" of the man they identify as Noonan... that's a very common pattern baldness. My guess is these were missionaries. And BTW, I actually spent some time 50 years ago recovering aircraft. Her plane would have sunk like a stone.. no way that boat could be towing it.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
11,335
Reaction Score
25,045
Very interesting. But I am still skeptical - the recovery operation to get a crash landed plane onto the boat would have taken days if not weeks, involved a significant number of people and money and locals. This photo was taken at the end of that time period and if believed includes both Noonan and Earhart casually watching the recovery operation's conclusion with no indication that they are in anyway under duress with maybe ten islanders standing around on the wharf and on the boat tied to it. Hard to believe if they were at that time free to move around that they hadn't found some way to communicate, and if they are actually already 'captive' it is a very casual situation for such captivity and is surprising they or the islanders did not leave any trace of what would have been an extraordinary moment.
That ONI photographed the scene and preserved the photograph, but with no record of what it showed is also odd - if it was an important moment of an extraordinary event one would expect some reference. If it was one of thousands/millions of photographs of non-extraordinary events date/place is all you would expect.

The USA has exceptional equipment that can maintain the integrity of a picture while enlarging the area viewed---If Noonan is actually in the picture-I'm sure it would be known. You'd have be pretty intimate with Amelia to know if this is her back. Who alive to day has that level of knowledge?
Many people from many levels of investigative organizations or groups have had the opportunity to view this and therefore analyze it---Why is it--this isn't a frontpage story on every paper in the land?
Apparently, they too are skeptical.
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
11,335
Reaction Score
25,045
Does This Photo Show Amelia Earhart After Her Plane Disappeared? - History in the Headlines

I confess to finding mysteries like this one fascinating....whether the evidence is strong or crumbly.
The link takes you to this subject. Apparently History Channel is airing the entire show on Sunday night July 9.

Did she and her co-pilot survive the crash? Well...that's a better shot than Elvis currently living in Missoula Montana or other theories of him currently roaming the good ole USA.

Thanks Blakeon18----not much basketball --but it sure struck a nerve --conspiracies, mysteries and the unknowns grab the interest of some people of a bit of intellect.
I'm more interested in did the ancients dump an old oaken boat load of money down a well--but right now I'm busy watching paint dry..
It's obvious you haven't been to Montana--Elves is there, hes hard to recognize--he's just a skeleton of his former self.
 

Online statistics

Members online
305
Guests online
1,903
Total visitors
2,208

Forum statistics

Threads
158,961
Messages
4,175,621
Members
10,047
Latest member
Dixiedog


.
Top Bottom