Organizational DNA

[Jaydumo20]

Carl Williams, Caleb's Dad, said that he didn't want his son to go to the Bears because that's where QB's go to die. Not the euphemism id use but there is truth in it. The Bears have not produced or maintained good QB play in the modern era.

Despite a high payroll, teams like Mets and Cubs have struggled to produced rings. Even with changes in front office, coaches personnel, etc.

Then there's UConn and those like us.
3 different coaches, different AD's, different conferences, but still grabbing titles.

Most would say culture is the reason but that term that needs definition. It's a convenient buzz word that makes us feel we have scientifically explained something kind of eerie. Calhoun, Geno, KO and Dan Hurley are very different coaches. They don't follow a secret Coaches Handbook unique to UConn. If it's culture, what kind of force is that?

Is there a culture of losing? Winning? Some may say "The Bears culture has always been defense first which explains the lack of QB play" but that would ignore the fact that the Bears have consistently tried to draft or acquire high level quarterbacks with little success.

What is in the water?

*****Note: this is not a post about the Bears. They are an example. What makes a winner a winner, or a loser a loser over decades and decades.

 

[JMick]

It's just an odd psychological phenomenon like Tony Hawk and the 900. Once it's shown it can be done, the barrier to entry goes way down. No one knows why, it just does.

 

[Jaydumo20]

It's just an odd psychological phenomenon like Tony Hawk and the 900. Once it's shown it can be done, the barrier to entry goes way down. No one knows why, it just does.

I think this is the best explanation I've found. It has to also work in the negative though: once you've convinced yourself that you're never gonna be able to do a 900 you won't.

There's the desperation factor, too. Men or Women who are intently trying to find a partner push any possible match away because of that manic energy.

 

[Deepster]

Interesting topic, especially being a Husky, Mets and Jets fan. Three teams at different spots in the discussion.

1. Seeing recruits take pictures with our 6 trophies. Going to games and seeing the "Basketball Capital of the World" unfurl. Hearing recruits talk about coming here because we chase and win titles. We definitely have the DNA.
   
   
2. Watching the Wilpons fumble their way for years in a market like NY was very frustrating. Every year when the team stumbled, it was "same ol' Mets". Not anymore. Cohen has totally changed the DNA of that team. The stadium is awesome. The facilities and the way the players and their families are treated are second to none (Manaea and Winker made it clear they wanted to resign here for that reason). And of course, Soto turning down the Yankees to come here is something that never, ever would have happened under Wilpon.
   
   
3. The Jets are the ultimate losers. It starts at the top with a completely incompetent owner. They don't have their own stadium. Bill Belichick and Peyton Manning both turned down being part of the franchise. And anyone who comes there from another team gets the Jets stink on them in no time. You can watch the coaches get slowly eaten alive by the failure and press. I have followed that team for 50 years and I honestly don't think I'll ever even see them IN a Super Bowl.

 

[Jaydumo20]

Interesting topic, especially being a Husky, Mets and Jets fan. Three teams at different spots in the discussion.

1. Seeing recruits take pictures with our 6 trophies. Going to games and seeing the "Basketball Capital of the World" unfurl. Hearing recruits talk about coming here because we chase and win titles. We definitely have the DNA.
   
   
2. Watching the Wilpons fumble their way for years in a market like NY was very frustrating. Every year when the team stumbled, it was "same ol' Mets". Not anymore. Cohen has totally changed the DNA of that team. The stadium is awesome. The facilities and the way the players and their families are treated are second to none (Manaea and Winker made it clear they wanted to resign here for that reason). And of course, Soto turning down the Yankees to come here is something that never, ever would have happened under Wilpon.
   
   
3. The Jets are the ultimate losers. It starts at the top with a completely incompetent owner. They don't have their own stadium. Bill Belichick and Peyton Manning both turned down being part of the franchise. And anyone who comes there from another team gets the Jets stink on them in no time. You can watch the coaches get slowly eaten alive by the failure and press. I have followed that team for 50 years and I honestly don't think I'll ever even see them IN a Super Bowl.

The Mets example is going to be telling. I think you are spot on with all of this and are clearly coming from a place of longtime relationships with these teams.

There is a different feel to the Uncle Stevie Mets but there is the same feeling surrounding the Jets. Hearing Aaron Glenn's intro press conference, he said all the right things but it just seems like a bunch of platitudes because of the likely results.

For the Mets: They have shown integrity and have made the right moves with their money. Total culture shift. Soto is a better use of $$$ than Jason Bay. That comparison says it all for me.

 

[CL82]

I think it's made up of two components. The first one is already been discussed above. Once the barriers been broken, it becomes easy to think. "why not us?"

I think there's a second element that is one of logistics. Once you've been to a final four as a team understand the demands the time pressure the logistics of getting from location to location, etc. it is more predictable so it is easier to do those things successfully. Winning a championship is a hard thing and just not having the distractions of little screw ups is an edge.

 

[Edward Sargent]

When you talk of culture you have to throw in the Pender's, Reid's, Daily's, and Mora's names as well. When I went to UConn sports wasn't as big a factor as it is today. UConn was the only school I could afford and I was the first kid in my family to go to college. I started out at Stamford Branch which was a great move. I had some of the greatest teachers and established a foundation that carried me through graduate school, work and now retirement. Looking back on it now I would not trade my education for any other. Our coaches and teams reflect and represent a larger culture that is UConn

 

[Lafayette]

Heartily agree on culture.

Hurley gets an asterisk though because DNA and environment growing up under Bob Hurley the apple doesn’t fall far.

Best example IMHO is the Detroit Lions.

Perennial playoff sniffer despite having had Megatron and Sanders they got a new coach Campbell and players want to play better for him. 15-2 last year. They also go for the best athlete at their draft position. Gotta be players who want to play hard for them.

I think Calhoun had that. Hurley has that. I even think Pitino has that. Coach K too.

There are coaches that can go program to program and improve each dramatically..those are amazing coachs

 

[TheShot1990]

Interesting topic, especially being a Husky, Mets and Jets fan. Three teams at different spots in the discussion.

1. Seeing recruits take pictures with our 6 trophies. Going to games and seeing the "Basketball Capital of the World" unfurl. Hearing recruits talk about coming here because we chase and win titles. We definitely have the DNA.
   
   
2. Watching the Wilpons fumble their way for years in a market like NY was very frustrating. Every year when the team stumbled, it was "same ol' Mets". Not anymore. Cohen has totally changed the DNA of that team. The stadium is awesome. The facilities and the way the players and their families are treated are second to none (Manaea and Winker made it clear they wanted to resign here for that reason). And of course, Soto turning down the Yankees to come here is something that never, ever would have happened under Wilpon.
   
   
3. The Jets are the ultimate losers. It starts at the top with a completely incompetent owner. They don't have their own stadium. Bill Belichick and Peyton Manning both turned down being part of the franchise. And anyone who comes there from another team gets the Jets stink on them in no time. You can watch the coaches get slowly eaten alive by the failure and press. I have followed that team for 50 years and I honestly don't think I'll ever even see them IN a Super Bowl.

Good points, but the Mets have made it to the World Series five times and won two of them. Their most recent appearance was 2015 and they came close to picking off the Dodgers last year, so they have occasional success.

Nobody compares in patheticism to the Jets.

 

[Jaydumo20]

Heartily agree on culture.

Hurley gets an asterisk though because DNA and environment growing up under Bob Hurley the apple doesn’t fall far.

Best example IMHO is the Detroit Lions.

Perennial playoff sniffer despite having had Megatron and Sanders they got a new coach Campbell and players want to play better for him. 15-2 last year. They also go for the best athlete at their draft position. Gotta be players who want to play hard for them.

I think Calhoun had that. Hurley has that. I even think Pitino has that. Coach K too.

There are coaches that can go program to program and improve each dramatically..those are amazing coachs

Good call on the Lions. It did take someone like DC to turn it around. Which brings me to something that has bugged me, in line with all this: I'll use the Lions-
Over 70+ years, with tons of money, and a supportive fan base, I can't understand how with all the smart football people who have come through that organization, only 1 person was able to get them to be a real playoff team. Couldn't Marty Mornhingweg have called up Marv Levy or somebody and asked "who do you think would be a good QB to draft?" Or get some high paid ivy league efficiency expert to tell them what's going wrong? How can you hire football people and get it wrong for 7 decades. Haaaa!!!

 

[Lafayette]

Good call on the Lions. It did take someone like DC to turn it around. Which brings me to something that has bugged me, in line with all this: I'll use the Lions-
Over 70+ years, with tons of money, and a supportive fan base, I can't understand how with all the smart football people who have come through that organization, only 1 person was able to get them to be a real playoff team. Couldn't Marty Mornhingweg have called up Marv Levy or somebody and asked "who do you think would be a good QB to draft?" Or get some high paid ivy league efficiency expert to tell them what's going wrong? How can you hire football people and get it wrong for 7 decades. Haaaa!!!

It's been a very painful experience rooting for Detroit for many, many years.

 

[Deepster]

Good call on the Lions. It did take someone like DC to turn it around. Which brings me to something that has bugged me, in line with all this: I'll use the Lions-
Over 70+ years, with tons of money, and a supportive fan base, I can't understand how with all the smart football people who have come through that organization, only 1 person was able to get them to be a real playoff team. Couldn't Marty Mornhingweg have called up Marv Levy or somebody and asked "who do you think would be a good QB to draft?" Or get some high paid ivy league efficiency expert to tell them what's going wrong? How can you hire football people and get it wrong for 7 decades. Haaaa!!!

The sad thing is, the window may be closing for the Lions. They lost a lot of players/coaches in the offseason. Up and coming division.

I also feel like this year is a very important year for the Bills. I see their window closing as well and Josh Allen can't be superman forever.

 

[NowInStorrs]

One could say say that certain organizations have just got loyalty, got royalty inside their DNA.

 

[auror]

In leagues with 30 teams and only 1 team that wins the championship, there's an 18% chance a specific team would go 50 years without winning a title. Across the entire league, there's a roughly 50% chance that some team doesn't win a title in 50 years. And both of those are assuming equal team strength, which is not a good assumption.

If you get unlucky and don't draft a good QB or hire the right coach, those odds would go way up. There is skill to hiring and drafting, ownership management and coaching play a factor, but way more luck than we'd generally like to admit. It's much more romantic to talk about culture, despite the fact that every coach hired in a major sports league has roughly the same culture ideas and implementation (because they all worked for someone on the way up who was trained by someone else already in the same league, etc.).

Leagues with recruiting (and some extent free agency) lead to snowball dynasties, though salary caps and the like can mitigate that effect. But for UConn's sake, getting the first title increases prestige which increases fan support which increases resources which increases recruiting ability which increases team strength which leads to championships which increases prestige which increases... you get it. That's how a blue blood becomes a blue blood.

 

[Jaydumo20]

One could say say that certain organizations have just got loyalty, got royalty inside their DNA.

UConn for sure. We just win again and win again like Wimbledon.

 

[Jaydumo20]

In leagues with 30 teams and only 1 team that wins the championship, there's an 18% chance a specific team would go 50 years without winning a title. Across the entire league, there's a roughly 50% chance that some team doesn't win a title in 50 years. And both of those are assuming equal team strength, which is not a good assumption.

If you get unlucky and don't draft a good QB or hire the right coach, those odds would go way up. There is skill to hiring and drafting, ownership management and coaching play a factor, but way more luck than we'd generally like to admit. It's much more romantic to talk about culture, despite the fact that every coach hired in a major sports league has roughly the same culture ideas and implementation (because they all worked for someone on the way up who was trained by someone else already in the same league, etc.).

Leagues with recruiting (and some extent free agency) lead to snowball dynasties, though salary caps and the like can mitigate that effect. But for UConn's sake, getting the first title increases prestige which increases fan support which increases resources which increases recruiting ability which increases team strength which leads to championships which increases prestige which increases... you get it. That's how a blue blood becomes a blue blood.

I agree with a lot of this. Especially the formal reasons for a teams "snowball dynasty" (great term, btw).

There is still some inexplicable stuff that I guess we can call "luck" but to say it's random in these cases misses something, in my opinion.

On a microcosmic level- we can say that when a player gets in "the zone" they are there because of hard work and skill building over the years. That's partially true; but it ignores the fact that the player is subject to laws outside of his control as to when and where that "zone" will appear. They are just as surprised as we are when every shot they take goes in. And just as dismayed when they cant get it back at will. I think this works on an organizational level too, to some degree.

 

[Scoe]

Getting culture changing players, ones who will force change. Getting guys who have old school family values. Getting guys who will make sacrifices, who come to UConn to be a better player, are told not what they want to hear but what they need to hear and are willing to take on that challenge and succeed.

I bet you Hurley and Geno really puts recruits through a rigerous recruiting process very much similar to nfl teams interviewing qbs for the draft, to see if that player is right for this program. Sure it never guarantees success but the success rate is pretty damn high.

That championship DNA is rubbing off a bit onto our other sports as well.