NIL is good for CBB | The Boneyard

NIL is good for CBB

Waquoit

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Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.
 
Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.
If that's your measuring stick, I guess you could look at it that way.

On the flipside, every offseason becomes a full blown free agency feeding frenzy with guys attending 4 schools in 4 years....and it potentially could ruin the heart of the NCAA Tourney where a lower ranked team simply cannot be a Cinderella anymore because their good guys jump to a big program for a paycheck instead of sticking around.

I mean, the NCAA champ was a gang of hired guns that weren't on the roster a year ago. That's a good thing?
 
Of course it’s been good for us; we’re one of the “haves” in CBB and have been positioned to benefit from our pedigree and recent success. I imagine most of the rest of D1 (but especially those outside the P4 and BE) see NIL like we see conference realignment. It wouldn’t shock me if there is a thread on the Wisconsin football forum about conference realignment being a net positive, even if it means they have to start playing the new West Coast teams. Sure, great for those who are born/grandfathered into a beneficial position. But there is a much wider perspective to take from that of the “have-nots” as well. I imagine at least 80% of D1 hates NIL and wish it were never a thing, as arguably amoral the prior system was.
 
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Great for the product on the court.

TBD on fan interest regarding that product as many have expressed negative feelings on roster churn, but ratings have been good.
 
Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.
If it's not good for the game, it won't be good for UConn (or anyone else) long term.
 
I appreciate this argument. There is a lot of change happening, a lot of it hard to swallow, so always important to take a wide perspective, bad and good.

But in this case, highlighting some of the good doesnt mean it's good in general.

We can say fast food is a positive because it's convenient, tastes good, gives people jobs and makes investors rich. But the net effect of fast food is pretty terrible. I think overall NIL is doing much harm to the sport and college athletics and it could bite us in the ass too.
 
If it's not good for the game, it won't be good for UConn (or anyone else) long term.
But it's been great for the game and UConn short term. What's your point? All I can decipher from the above is when it stops being good it will be bad. If that's what you mean, I agree.
 
I appreciate this argument. There is a lot of change happening, a lot of it hard to swallow, so always important to take a wide perspective, bad and good.

But in this case, highlighting some of the good doesnt mean it's good in general.

We can say fast food is a positive because it's convenient, tastes good, gives people jobs and makes investors rich. But the net effect of fast food is pretty terrible. I think overall NIL is doing much harm to the sport and college athletics and it could bite us in the ass too.
I heard AD Dave the other day asked about transfers and the portal and whether the admissions department was overwhelmed. He just laughed and said something like academics isn’t one of our worries when it comes to athletes transferring in.

To me what used to be college athletics is moving toward minor league sports associated with colleges.
 
Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.
I agree with most of this, especially as concerns UConn and other teams at the top of the ratings sites

I think the number of players who change teams every year for more money will decline, the exception being those who start their journey well outside of the P4 and work their way up. I wouldn't consider those guys to be mercenaries like say, AJ Storr.

I can also tell you that here in Pittsburgh, there is no excitement for Pitt men's hoops.
 
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What is bad is unlimited transfers and no contracts. (Leads to everyone being a free agent every year).
This

Besides the conference and NCAA tournaments, the fabric of CBB has been completely destroyed. No more developing players within the system. Recruiting wins do not have the same impact as they once did. Powerhouse / football programs have more than reaped the benefits.

Needs to be 1 transfer per career allowed (unless the coach you initially signed with leaves).

Only reason this entire board doesn’t think the above is because we’ve fortunately been one of the schools to be ahead of the NIL curve… for now. And interestingly enough, I think it would be an even greater advantage to UConn if other schools couldn’t buy their entire team. Coaching and development would mean more, which I believe our coach and program excel at.
 
What is bad is unlimited transfers and no contracts. (Leads to everyone being a free agent every year).
Unless colleges are willing to sign collective bargaining agreement which would then have rules in place about transferring and salary caps. But do not see it happening since colleges and the NCAA tried for years to act like big time college athletics was “students” playing sports. Of course it was okay for the schools and the coaches to reap all the benefits off of the college football and basketball athletes backs. While athletes were not even getting their medical bills payed if they suffered a permanent injury. College football and basketball was a sharecropper system.
 
If it's not good for the game, it won't be good for UConn (or anyone else) long term.
I think it's more accurate to say that UConn has managed the evolving NIL dynamic better than the vast majority of colleges. I give everyone, but particularly Dave Benedict props for getting out ahead of the NIL environment from the get go.

Even with all the success, I don't love the roster turnover. NIL and unlimited transfers have effectively created de facto unlimited free agency. As you point out, in the long-term, it's not going to be good for the sport.
 
NIL, at least this moment in time, is good for UConn basketball. For just about every other team other than a handful of exceptions, NIL is destroying their programs and their departments.
Very accurate - it's great to be a UConn fan right now, we are at the peak. Best program(s), coach in the game. We pretty much get who we target in recruiting. The schedule is at it's peak. The entertainment value is at it's highest. Have to hope we hold position so a real conference sees the value in the next reshuffle.
 
Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.

Money and collegiate sports don't mix.

The spirit of college athletics is about the student athlete. It shouldn't be viewed as professional in any way.

The first obligation of any student athlete is about being a representative at the student body

Right now, none of this about school or education.

You have guys that don't even attend class being paid to play sports.

You have guys a year removed from college that spent time in professional developmental leagues returning to play college sports.

Is it fun to watch? Yes. Is it good for college sports? No.
 
Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.

I agree. It ends the ridiculous pretense that the top programs like Duke and Kentucky were not cheating, because now it is not cheating. NIL has also exposed a lot of "top" coaches as frauds.

I think this will spiral without a salary cap, and it appears that the schools understand this, but for now it is a lot of fun.
 
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I agree. It ends the ridiculous pretense that the top programs like Duke and Kentucky were not cheating, because now it is not cheating. NIL has also exposed a lot of "top" coaches as frauds.

I think this will spiral without a salary cap, and it appears that the schools understand this, but for now it is a lot of fun.
Now there are schools finding loopholes in scheduling to host their own Amazon series. If ever the sign that it's no longer a student based sport.

Half the sport is going to be Europeans/Internationals at some point. Future state is it should be have a salary cap, funded by the NBA, mid majors are minor league teams for majors. They should create a relegation system as well to move high majors into mid majors. Might as well go all out.
 
Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.
Interesting side impact it may/will have on youth sports prior to college. There is an opportunity to make sizable amount of money for larger group of athletes then those who will make it to pros. Realistically an average hoops/football player may not only get a free education, but also set themselves for mortgage free life or have sizable investment opportunity early in life. So now many kids and their parents have an additional incentive. Interesting to see how it impacts all those premier clubs and circuits and their enrollment.
 
It’s good for UConn so far because we’re lucky to have Hurley and also lucky that we won b2b chips at the exact right time.

But long term I’m not so sure it’s good. The big boys in the p2 are coming for college basketball and their pockets are way deeper than ours. Or on a positive note, maybe cbb will be a more profitable sport, so the p2 will consider adding UConn?

Also shouldn’t UConn be getting its own deal w Amazon too?
 
If Duke in a few years has 100 million in NIL and Uconn has 20 million, are you gonna say NIL is good?

NIL is great if you dont have a great program and a great coach to level the playing field. We have both.
 
As the rules currently stand, this seems like NIL will hurt the sport.
  • nobody is purely paying for the product on the court, I think we’re paying for the team name on the front of the jersey. If we really wanted to watch the best players, more of us would probably be watching G league, which gets no eyeballs due to no jersey association (and crappy style). So fundamentally some of the strength of college basketball is a fan’s connection to their team.
  • as players jump team to team, I think fans will lose connection with teams. I know I loved seeing development of three and four year players (and recruiting battles to get them), and even Uconn might not get to see significant player loyalty and development anymore.
  • Cinderellas and major upsets will be fewer and further between as they get picked-over annually, hurting fan excitement.

I fear future generations just might not pick up an interest in college basketball like some of us did when we were younger and the sport was perceived as a little more pure.

The best parallel I can think of is boxing. When I was a kid in the 70s, it was huge, front and center. It survived through the 70s 80s and 90s, riding on the backs of perhaps older folks and a few superstars. But certain things put cracks in the foundation. Four different belts, infrequent big matchups, promoters worried about the now as opposed to developing the sport. As a sports fan at the time, I wasn’t completely sold that anything about it was fair or legitimate. Then along came MMA that offered so much that was missing. I haven’t watched a boxing match that wasn’t basically a gimmick in 15 years.

I do believe college bball is few small changes in salary caps, transfer limits, and contract durations away from having a great long-term sport.
 
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It’s good for UConn so far because we’re lucky to have Hurley and also lucky that we won b2b chips at the exact right time.

But long term I’m not so sure it’s good. The big boys in the p2 are coming for college basketball and their pockets are way deeper than ours. Or on a positive note, maybe cbb will be a more profitable sport, so the p2 will consider adding UConn?

Also shouldn’t UConn be getting its own deal w Amazon too?

We really did. If we never get out, it won't be because we didn't do all the right things. Have to hope some of these conferences that really can't win in FB make the decision to focus on hoops as it grows further (B12/ACC).

I'd think if Amazon decides to scale out their content, UConn is next in line.
 
I don’t care what’s going on as long as UConn keeps competing for championships. If/when that stops I will hate everything.
 
It's a disaster long term. Look, Michigan literally bought a basketball championship this year. How else to describe it?

Financially it is not sustainable. The Big Ten schools - yes the B10 - mostly lost money last year: NCAA Revenue Sharing & NIL Estimates 2025 (and a lot - Rutgers is in trouble). Those that did profit had razor thin margins.

The college landscape will devolve to the point where programs focus on one or perhaps two sports at most, and buy their way to the top. Think Nebraska in women's volleyball, Penn State wrestling, Texas Tech softball. The Big Ten and to a lesser extent the SEC will dominate almost every sport, with a few programs (like UConn hopefully, Duke, UNC, etc) having the funds to compete. We will see competitive balance of only 20 or so teams in every sport, with a standard top 5 EVERY year. Some schools won't even field teams in some sports. Mid-major competitiveness will be gone. Hurley doesn't want to play Tier 3/4 teams at all any more. There's no point, it's lose-lose even if you win.

Scroll down this link NCAA Revenue Sharing & NIL Estimates 2025 and look at Penn State's NIL spend. Almost $1.5 million on wrestling. Seriously? $3 million on all of men's basketball. That's almost certainly less than what UConn spent on EITHER Hines or Mullins. Their entire basketball spend is less than what we spent on ONE player - and we aren't close to the top spenders. And, very sad, only $120K TOTAL (that's ALL sports) for women's teams. ALL SPORTS. LSU is know to give $500K to individual gymnasts. I mean, come on. This is ridiculous. And that is a B10 school.

Lack of interest will cause some programs to self-destruct, the connection to the team will fade. Donations are already collapsing for some schools: Will Revenue Sharing result in Booster fatigue? – NCAA Revenue Sharing & NIL Estimates 2025
You think boosters at Kentucky aren't having second thoughts?

Look at LSU - next year will be an entire roster of mercenary foreign players, including the bench. Not an exaggeration. LSU will focus on football, maybe women's basketball. They won't care about the other sports.

This will not be good.
 
It's a disaster long term. Look, Michigan literally bought a basketball championship this year. How else to describe it?

Financially it is not sustainable. The Big Ten schools - yes the B10 - mostly lost money last year: NCAA Revenue Sharing & NIL Estimates 2025 (and a lot - Rutgers is in trouble). Those that did profit had razor thin margins.

The college landscape will devolve to the point where programs focus on one or perhaps two sports at most, and buy their way to the top. Think Nebraska in women's volleyball, Penn State wrestling, Texas Tech softball. The Big Ten and to a lesser extent the SEC will dominate almost every sport, with a few programs (like UConn hopefully, Duke, UNC, etc) having the funds to compete. We will see competitive balance of only 20 or so teams in every sport, with a standard top 5 EVERY year. Some schools won't even field teams in some sports. Mid-major competitiveness will be gone. Hurley doesn't want to play Tier 3/4 teams at all any more. There's no point, it's lose-lose even if you win.

Scroll down this link NCAA Revenue Sharing & NIL Estimates 2025 and look at Penn State's NIL spend. Almost $1.5 million on wrestling. Seriously? $3 million on all of men's basketball. That's almost certainly less than what UConn spent on EITHER Hines or Mullins. Their entire basketball spend is less than what we spent on ONE player - and we aren't close to the top spenders. And, very sad, only $120K TOTAL (that's ALL sports) for women's teams. ALL SPORTS. LSU is know to give $500K to individual gymnasts. I mean, come on. This is ridiculous. And that is a B10 school.

Lack of interest will cause some programs to self-destruct, the connection to the team will fade. Donations are already collapsing for some schools: Will Revenue Sharing result in Booster fatigue? – NCAA Revenue Sharing & NIL Estimates 2025
You think boosters at Kentucky aren't having second thoughts?

Look at LSU - next year will be an entire roster of mercenary foreign players, including the bench. Not an exaggeration. LSU will focus on football, maybe women's basketball. They won't care about the other sports.

This will not be good.
Schools will drop programs, no sense flying teams around the country that make no money and football and men's basketball are the only revenue generators outside of a handful or random sports teams at a handful of schools. Some schools will drop academic programs, others will drop football and or basketball because they will be far less competitive and can no longer justify the spend.

This is terrible for college basketball, Universities and college sports in general.
 
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The idea of unlimited transfers being bad. Not forcing the kids to be stuck at a school that doesn't want them has been a positive change
But that doesnt negate the fact that many of us dont like the result. They can both be true. Giving them unlimited transfers can be good for them and also tarnish the product. As fans, we cant be forced to like it.
 
Ratings are up, off-season interest is up, more good players are staying in school. UConn is getting 500K for one neutral site game. Does that happen without NIL? I'm not a fan but it's been a net positive so far for the game and UConn.
I think it would be better if it was revenue sharing instead of NIL. Athletes who play on a team share in the proceeds rather than being paid
 
As the rules currently stand, this seems like NIL will hurt the sport.
  • nobody is purely paying for the product on the court,
That is every sport in America right now. Why should CBB be different?
 
That is every sport in America right now. Why should CBB be different?
I’m not sure what your point is? My point was that cbb thrives on fan connection. I suggested fan connection is lessened through players transfering multiple times chasing $$, or when rosters lack continuity and development within a program. Fan connection for lower tiers could wane as they get stripped of their stars and become feeder programs to the rich.

Other sports have salary caps, contracts, etc to help competitiveness and continuity.

So that is how cbb is currently different.
 
But that doesnt negate the fact that many of us dont like the result. They can both be true. Giving them unlimited transfers can be good for them and also tarnish the product. As fans, we cant be forced to like it.
You're entitled to that opinion, I would suggest those fans stop watching if they don't like the product. I think it has been a massive benefit so I'll be watching as much as ever
 
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You're entitled to that opinion, I would suggest those fans stop watching if they don't like the product. I think it has been a massive benefit so I'll be watching as much as ever
I think 3 or 4 schools in as many years isn’t “forcing kids to stay at schools they don’t like” so much as it is them taking advantage of the Wild West we are in.
 
What is bad is unlimited transfers and no contracts. (Leads to everyone being a free agent every year).
I'm all for what NIL was intended for, but what we have is free agency without guardrails. To my knowledge, there are no other team sport that doesn't have contracts, some sort of attempt at competitive balance in the form of salary caps, taxes or some sort of deterrent that sometimes still falls short.

Something has to change. This is simply not sustainable.
 
I’m not sure what your point is? My point was that cbb thrives on fan connection. I suggested fan connection is lessened through players transfering multiple times chasing $$, or when rosters lack continuity and development within a program. Fan connection for lower tiers could wane as they get stripped of their stars and become feeder programs to the rich.
Your connection as a fan may be lessened but the paradigm has shifted. Michigan is the poster child for lack of continuity and their fan connection has never been higher. Same with St John's. You underestimate how fans adjust. Lower tier fans know they are never going to win the title. They want to win the league and maybe claim a scalp in the dance. That's the way I felt before UConn was in the Big East. This system gives them hope if they can get a good coach. Cycle of life.
 
Schools will drop programs, no sense flying teams around the country that make no money and football and men's basketball are the only revenue generators outside of a handful or random sports teams at a handful of schools. Some schools will drop academic programs, others will drop football and or basketball because they will be far less competitive and can no longer justify the spend.

This is terrible for college basketball, Universities and college sports in general.
It's called the free market. This is probably a good thing. It will expose the universities that shouldn't be in business due to poor financial practices and will also expose smaller schools using athletics to keep the doors open.
 
It's called the free market. This is probably a good thing. It will expose the universities that shouldn't be in business due to poor financial practices and will also expose smaller schools using athletics to keep the doors open.
I don't think education should be strictly a free market endeavor. If it was we would have schools at every level closing up shop. All our HBCU's would be gone. Our research would suffer. Our inner city schools would fall further behind and many would close.
 
I don't think education should be strictly a free market endeavor. If it was we would have schools at every level closing up shop. All our HBCU's would be gone. Our research would suffer. Our inner city schools would fall further behind and many would close.
I do think the government can be used to fund research in public (and private) universities effectively. I don't think it should be strictly free market either when it comes to public universities. However, with regards to private schools, they are just that: private. If they cannot remain solvent financially, they should not be in business. I am anti- for-profit schools as I don't think education should be a for-profit enterprise but non-profits should balance the books.

With regards to sports, I think most schools have too many (even UConn). If you are taking funds from the academic side (unless there is a large marketing benefit- like that for us or other top 100 Division 1 schools), you are doing it wrong.

US IOC will not suffer if hundreds of universities drop sports because the kids getting left behind are not realistic Olympic hopefuls. The best kids will migrate to the surviving programs.

UConn really should cut its men's track program and a corresponding number of women's sports.

We could then focus on the big five (basketball, baseball, football, soccer, hockey) and golf (fully endowed) on the men's side and the women's sports we are good at.


As an aside on HBCUs: I'm not totally sure how I feel about them as they are a relic of segregation, but I do think that some of the public ones should be converted into non-HBCU four-year institutions.
 
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I think it's bad in the sense that it makes it very, very difficult for some teams to compete without a major investment. I think it's bad that I'd think the coaching rise from low, to mid, to high major for that random guy might be all but done. You can't have any continuity if your best players are going to transfer every year.

As a UConn fan, we are exceedingly fortunate that we hired the right coach, who was a bit ahead of the game in roster construction by having multi-year transfers and having multiple guys play four years. I fear that that is completely dead, as we started to shift in our recruiting strategy to only "top" guys who will probably be around only for a year or two.

If I were a Seton Hall fan or something, I'd be livid. You have a really good coach, play in a very good conference, and it's impossible to field a consistent team year-to-year, retain any players, or get big $$ transfers. At some point, Shaheen has to tire of it, and then back to being completely mediocre they go.
 
I'm all for what NIL was intended for, but what we have is free agency without guardrails. To my knowledge, there are no other team sport that doesn't have contracts, some sort of attempt at competitive balance in the form of salary caps, taxes or some sort of deterrent that sometimes still falls short.

Something has to change. This is simply not sustainable.
Some structure is needed.
 
It’s going to force us to leave the big east. It doesn’t make sense to have one team has a 15m budget, and most of the others sre in the 5-8m neighborhood. This is on top of us being a state funded school that can absorb operational loses and us having much better pedigree than the other programs. The other teams will complain they can’t compete.
 

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