Need to Move From Checkers to Chess | The Boneyard

Need to Move From Checkers to Chess

Status
Not open for further replies.

whaler11

Head Happy Hour Coach
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
44,369
Reaction Score
68,241
Warning: There are some unpopular opinions included here.

Disclaimer: Bob has made great progress to date and almost every sign is positive - this is a very specific criticism and he clearly learned some things from last year but they need to coach better on Saturdays.

There really doesn't need to be much debate on the decision to try a third fake. The only worse decision would have been to punt. I want to talk about how they painted themselves into a corner which led to it.

Of course the 2 play by plays I can find don't have the clock attached - which is going to make this a bit messy.

Situation:
Down 3, 2 timeouts a little over two minutes left - UConn gets to the Missouri 31 on the pass to Lucas.

To coach this situation correctly you need to make some decisions:

Your kicking game is shaky - what is your chance to win in OT: This informs your decision making on playing for 3 or playing for 7

If you are willing to play for overtime - at what yard line are you confident your team can make a kick?

Based on what I saw, Diaco didn't answer those questions well enough:

Based on the fake field goal they seemed to understand playing for 7 was the proper decision: If that is the case, why did they show a complete lack of urgency? The offsides and false start ran about a minute off the clock. If your goal was to play for 7 and you are only at the 31 yard line - you either need time to take things underneath or you need to make calls that put you at a higher risk of sacks or interceptions.

By the time they used the timeout with :53 seconds left they had painted themselves into a corner. If they convert the 4th and 4 - with only one timeout you are very limited in what you can do play calling wise and one play in-bounds has pretty much forced you back into a field goal. You have to save the timeout to stop the clock to kick the field goal on a play inbounds or it's a total fire drill.

If they weren't comfortable kicking a FG from 42 yards..... then why in the world on third and 10 did they call a QB draw? It's safe to assume that play is going to leave you with 4th and something but now at a more reasonable FG range.

It was the lack of seeing how their decisions add up in the endgame that left them in a position to make a ridiculous decision. If you think you need 7 - then play like you need 7. If you are willing to take 3 and take your chances in OT - then play for 3.

What you can't do is play it halfway and try to decide in the heat of the battle when your lack of strategy has left you painted in a corner. You don't trust the FG team to get 3? Even if you convert the first down you probably still will need to trust the FG team at some point. You needed to show urgency relative to the clock during the penalty sequence when the clock evaporated and you panicked - otherwise your chances of getting the 7 plummet.

They need to understand what they are trying to accomplish in the context of the score and clock. If you aren't strategic about it - you coach yourself into a loss and miss a huge opportunity.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,165
Reaction Score
32,772
We needed 4 yards and Arkeel averages exactly 4 yards per carry. He has been effective, especially at times when RJ can't find a hole. For whatever reason we aren't using him. I would have run him on 4th down and there's a VERY good chance he would have picked up the first down. I think that was the best option available.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
20,703
Reaction Score
45,143
In some respects, there are some elements of on the job training with Bob. Clock management at the end of both halves yesterday was not good. Defense bailed them out at the end. Bob clearly has to get better at end of halves situations. Your post was spot on.
 
Joined
Aug 29, 2015
Messages
20,820
Reaction Score
50,591
We needed 4 yards and Arkeel averages exactly 4 yards per carry. He has been effective, especially at times when RJ can't find a hole. For whatever reason we aren't using him. I would have run him on 4th down and there's a VERY good chance he would have picked up the first down. I think that was the best option available.

I'd take the fake field goal over a run play in that situation.
 
Joined
Sep 16, 2011
Messages
49,267
Reaction Score
170,574
Time is the last thing I was worried about, we went empty backfield that whole drive and moved the ball effectively and bled the clock. I thought it was by design, the problem is we had a penalty that stalled the drive and then Diaco lost his mind calling the fake fg. Don't think clock management was at all the problem.
 

SubbaBub

Your stupidity is ruining my country.
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
32,125
Reaction Score
24,862
If they weren't comfortable kicking a FG from 42 yards..... then why in the world on third and 10 did they call a QB draw? It's safe to assume that play is going to leave you with 4th and something but now at a more reasonable FG range.

I agree he played it halfway and was probably indecisive all the way through the TO, but I actually like the 3rd down call and thought it was pretty smart of Bob. Assuming up to that point they got the most out of the drive, they are on the 3rd and 10 from the 31. You are looking at a 48-YD FG attempt with Tarbutt if you don't gain another yard. Missou is happy to let you have that and are protecting the endzone. You can't pull any Army and throw a pick. You also have to guard against the blitz which wouldn't give BS enough time to throw the ball down field. I see four options. The TE seam route which has been all over film and surely what MU has been preparing for all week. The bubble screen to the wide out which isn't likely to get you 10 yards. A sideline pass to Thomas or Lucas which becomes and all or nothing jump all on the sides. The QB run had the biggest element of surprise, was a good bet to pick up at least 5 and possibly the first down. You would have either a first or a makeable kick to tie.

Here's where I think the wheels came off. I think he looked a 42 as a big difference from 40, incorrectly abided by this two kicker mantra and decided that Tarbutt and that line weren't the answer. In the game chat we started discussing this scenario at the beginning of the drive and agreed a 40+ FG would be a toss up with going on 4th. 45+ you go for it, easy. Under 40, you kick with Puyol easy and take your chances. He ended up with a 40-45 attempt and the gears in his brain seized. The even money choice was to have Puyol kick or go for it. I don't think anyone could have blamed him for either choice. That would say he doesn't trust Tarbutt. He shouldn't trust a true frosh in that spot (Alabama had a similar brain freeze in the Kick-Six game). I also think that his go-go mentality took "going for it" to mean "really go for it". A safe 4 yd play wouldn't be nearly as cool as a Madden fake FG game winning TD.

We lose that game by 40 last year and while MU isn't a top 25 team or necessarily a good team, that was a top tier defense that didn't eat our OL alive and that was a physical OL that for the most part got stuffed by our front 7. Bob and the team had a good day, but his game management still needs a lot of work.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
2,860
Reaction Score
8,644
I'd take the fake field goal over a run play in that situation.
Good point. Our run game is statistically worse than last year (almost a half a yard per carry less). We are currently 115th out of 117th in the nation in yards per carry. Our passing game is light years ahead of last year. Go with your strength not your weakness. I would have gone with the empty backfield again and passed. There's a good chance, that whatever we did, the end result would have been the same and the only thing that would have changed would have been the content of the posts on here.
 
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
3,143
Reaction Score
2,928
Diaco will be a great coach, IMHO. What happened is that the special teams was lousy. A block punt for a safety shouldn't have hapened and the XP should have been made. It would be then 7-7. We need to fix special teams. The only thing wrong with yesterday's game was that we did 3 fake field goals.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,165
Reaction Score
32,772
JMick said:
I'd take the fake field goal over a run play in that situation.


I think most people would kick the field goal in that situation, including me. What I am saying is, play Arkeel if you want to make big plays. If Diaco wanted to go for the win, use a 4+ yard weapon. I think he missed a block and got benched for the day. We played him last year when he should have had a red shirt. Now, he's wasting away on the sideline as a sophomore. It is the one thing driving me nuts. There has been no evidence that Arkeel is anything but productive this year. We needed a home run play badly yesterday and our best playmaker wasn't out there at all.
 

whaler11

Head Happy Hour Coach
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
44,369
Reaction Score
68,241
I agree he played it halfway and was probably indecisive all the way through the TO, but I actually like the 3rd down call and thought it was pretty smart of Bob. Assuming up to that point they got the most out of the drive, they are on the 3rd and 10 from the 31. You are looking at a 48-YD FG attempt with Tarbutt if you don't gain another yard. Missou is happy to let you have that and are protecting the endzone. You can't pull any Army and throw a pick. You also have to guard against the blitz which wouldn't give BS enough time to throw the ball down field. I see four options. The TE seam route which has been all over film and surely what MU has been preparing for all week. The bubble screen to the wide out which isn't likely to get you 10 yards. A sideline pass to Thomas or Lucas which becomes and all or nothing jump all on the sides. The QB run had the biggest element of surprise, was a good bet to pick up at least 5 and possibly the first down. You would have either a first or a makeable kick to tie.

Here's where I think the wheels came off. I think he looked a 42 as a big difference from 40, incorrectly abided by this two kicker mantra and decided that Tarbutt and that line weren't the answer. In the game chat we started discussing this scenario at the beginning of the drive and agreed a 40+ FG would be a toss up with going on 4th. 45+ you go for it, easy. Under 40, you kick with Puyol easy and take your chances. He ended up with a 40-45 attempt and the gears in his brain seized. The even money choice was to have Puyol kick or go for it. I don't think anyone could have blamed him for either choice. That would say he doesn't trust Tarbutt. He shouldn't trust a true frosh in that spot (Alabama had a similar brain freeze in the Kick-Six game). I also think that his go-go mentality took "going for it" to mean "really go for it". A safe 4 yd play wouldn't be nearly as cool as a Madden fake FG game winning TD.

We lose that game by 40 last year and while MU isn't a top 25 team or necessarily a good team, that was a top tier defense that didn't eat our OL alive and that was a physical OL that for the most part got stuffed by our front 7. Bob and the team had a good day, but his game management still needs a lot of work.

The draw is the perfect call if you plan on kicking. It's puzzling if you are going to run a fake FG.
 

SubbaBub

Your stupidity is ruining my country.
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
32,125
Reaction Score
24,862
The draw is the perfect call if you plan on kicking. It's puzzling if you are going to run a fake FG.

Like we said, he was playing it halfway. If BS picks up 2 more yards, I think he kicks. If BS gets stuffed for a minimal gain, he goes for it on 4th. I think for some reason the 42 yd thing short circuited his brain because Tarbutt is the 40+ kicker. I think Bob is that kind of clipboard crazy.
 

whaler11

Head Happy Hour Coach
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
44,369
Reaction Score
68,241
Like we said, he was playing it halfway. If BS picks up 2 more yards, I think he kicks. If BS gets stuffed for a minimal gain, he goes for it on 4th. I think for some reason the 42 yd thing short circuited his brain because Tarbutt is the 40+ kicker. I think Bob is that kind of clipboard crazy.

Maybe but that gets back to the orginial point. You have to make those decision prior to being faced with them. If you need the 23 yard line to kick then if you aren't at the 23 yard line don't panic and unleash crazy.
 
Joined
Aug 29, 2015
Messages
20,820
Reaction Score
50,591
I think most people would kick the field goal in that situation, including me. What I am saying is, play Arkeel if you want to make big plays. If Diaco wanted to go for the win, use a 4+ yard weapon. I think he missed a block and got benched for the day. We played him last year when he should have had a red shirt. Now, he's wasting away on the sideline as a sophomore. It is the one thing driving me nuts. There has been no evidence that Arkeel is anything but productive this year. We needed a home run play badly yesterday and our best playmaker wasn't out there at all.

I couldn't disagree with you more. You are making this team out to be the Arkeel Newsome show, and it's not. It's not that I wouldn't trust the kid with the ball in his hands, it's the fact that our offensive line was getting destroyed all day long. You're missing the point completely.
 
Joined
Sep 16, 2011
Messages
49,267
Reaction Score
170,574
I think most people would kick the field goal in that situation, including me. What I am saying is, play Arkeel if you want to make big plays. If Diaco wanted to go for the win, use a 4+ yard weapon. I think he missed a block and got benched for the day. We played him last year when he should have had a red shirt. Now, he's wasting away on the sideline as a sophomore. It is the one thing driving me nuts. There has been no evidence that Arkeel is anything but productive this year. We needed a home run play badly yesterday and our best playmaker wasn't out there at all.
Every post you've ever made ties into Newsome. We get it you like the kid but making every thread about him is kind of silly.
 

nelsonmuntz

Point Center
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
44,322
Reaction Score
33,525
If Diaco was playing chess yesterday, that move was the equivalent of using his Queen as bait for a pawn.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
2,860
Reaction Score
8,644
I think most people would kick the field goal in that situation, including me. What I am saying is, play Arkeel if you want to make big plays. If Diaco wanted to go for the win, use a 4+ yard weapon. I think he missed a block and got benched for the day. We played him last year when he should have had a red shirt. Now, he's wasting away on the sideline as a sophomore. It is the one thing driving me nuts. There has been no evidence that Arkeel is anything but productive this year. We needed a home run play badly yesterday and our best playmaker wasn't out there at all.
Averaging 4 yards a carry is no guarantee he will gain 4 yards.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,165
Reaction Score
32,772
superjohn said:
Every post you've ever made ties into Newsome. We get it you like the kid but making every thread about him is kind of silly.


That's not true at all, though I've made several over the last week. I just think it is pretty obvious that he would help tremendously. I can't remember if it was against Nova or Army but he basically saved us because things were getting a little scary and he moved the ball on several carries when Johnson couldn't and then he got shelved again. The kid was a fumble machine last year but he is holding onto the ball and moving it now.

We lost a game by 3 points and he barely saw the field. It is perplexing. I'll stop posting about it because I hate when other people harp on a point and I'll take my medicine for doing it, but I believe he is a difference maker for an offensively challenged team that needed one more score to win a game.
 
Joined
Jun 3, 2013
Messages
1,361
Reaction Score
2,630
Diaco didn't make the decision soon enough. Calling time out let Missouri coach up the D on how to defend against the fake field goal. Should have put in Tarbut to make kicking the FG more plausible and went immediately for the fake. Puyol kicks too low and slow for the current state of the O line.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
2,860
Reaction Score
8,644
Not the point. Use the weapons you have rather than the ones you don't. We used Boyle instead him or Shirreffs to go for the win.
Then pass the ball. Passing has been our strength on offense this year. Running has been our weakness. If you want to use your top weapon, then pass to Noel Thomas.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,165
Reaction Score
32,772
Devland said:
Then pass the ball. Passing has been our strength on offense this year. Running has been our weakness. If you want to use your top weapon, then pass to Noel Thomas.


Well, I can't argue with that, kid is phenomenal. I'm not really sure how we always seem to have some wildly talented players but we do.
 

Dooley

Done with U-con athletics
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
9,961
Reaction Score
32,818
You didn't say anything unpopular whaler. Agree with everything you said. I kind of think the 2nd fake was a desperation bailout call after they realized that they had some poor clock management at the end

Re-learning how to win. There will likely be a few more of these head scratchers this season unfortunately.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Online statistics

Members online
248
Guests online
1,826
Total visitors
2,074

Forum statistics

Threads
158,049
Messages
4,132,304
Members
10,017
Latest member
mollykate


Top Bottom