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Message: [QUOTE="champs99and04, post: 2739884, member: 488"] The Wizards were a league average team with Jordan on the floor and about -3 with him off. That's better than I gave him credit for and certainly impactful, but I'm still stopping well short of MVP candidate. In other words, they are about a 41 win team with him and a 33 win team without him. Perhaps if he doesn't get hurt he leads them to the playoffs. Then again, the win totals you posted probably overstates his level of impact. Kobe's problem was as much the game passing him by than it was being washed. The great players typically score until their very last day. It's the other things - the efficiency, the production defensively, the durability - that typically goes first. [/QUOTE]