Midseason All-WNBA teams/Awards

[bballnut90]

Who ya got? I'm not following the GGFFC format, just putting the 5 most deserving players on each team, in no particular order
1st Team:
Breanna Stewart, Seattle
Diana Taurasi, Phoenix
Sylvia Fowles, Minnesota
Elena Delle-Donne, Washington
Brittney Griner, Phoenix

2nd team:
Liz Cambage, Dallas
Candace Parker, LA
Sue Bird, Seattle
Skylar Diggins, Dallas
Maya Moore, Minnesota

MVP: Stewart
ROY: Wilson
COY: Hughes
MIP: Howard

Had a hard time leaving Cambage off 1st team but had to go with Fowles/Griner. 2nd team I was tempted to put Wilson on there, but her team is just 7-12 and players like Moore/Parker/Diggins are all on better teams and having strong seasons so I went with them. Bird is also very deserving of being on 2nd team at this point in the year and might sneak on to first team if they're strict on the format.

Lots of other players having good years as well including Chiney Ogwumike, Nneka Ogwumike, Jewell Loyd, Kayla McBride, Tiffany Hayes, Tina Charles, A'ja Wilson, Chelsea Gray, and Tina Charles.

Overall, it has been a much more unpredictable season in the W. Makes it more fun from a viewer standpoint IMO. At this point my guess is that we'll see Phoenix/Seattle/Minnesota the finals will be Phoenix vs. Minnesota with Phoenix taking it. In the DT era, Phoenix has won 20+ games in just 3 out of 13 seasons, but in each of those seasons they went on to win the title. This year they're on pace to win about 24-27 games. Minnesota is looking good as of late (minus the Fever game) but it's an even year so they wont win. A lot can change.

 

[MilfordHusky]

I largely agree. I’d take Nneka over Parker, though.

Some people would overlook Sue, who is averaging just under 10 ppg, but her A:TO is a staggering 7.5 to 1.6. She directs the traffic on the league’s best offense.

 

[bballnut90]

I largely agree. I’d take Nneka over Parker, though.

Some people would overlook Sue, who is averaging just under 10 ppg, but her A:TO is a staggering 7.5 to 1.6. She directs the traffic on the league’s best offense.

That's what sold me. Career high in assists at 37 and Seattle is playing extremely well after underperforming the last few seasons.

 

[ucbart]

From and attitude and desire standpoint, I would take Nneka over Parker, but from a basketball standpoint, as much as I don't like CP3, she is just sooooooooo good. IMO, she actually allows Nneka to appear better than she is.

 

[ucbart]

Yes, do you watch the Sparks? Parker does so many things offensively that open the floor up for Nneka.

 

[diggerfoot]

From and attitude and desire standpoint, I would take Nneka over Parker, but from a basketball standpoint, as much as I don't like CP3, she is just sooooooooo good. IMO, she actually allows Nneka to appear better than she is.

Sorry in advance if this derails the thread somewhat, but this one comment draws together various ruminations I've had. I agree with how good Parker is; I would put her in a category of three uniquely gifted basketball players: Parker, EDD and Stewart (historically Jackson also fits the bill). I omit players like Moore only because of her height, and players like Fowles because their gifts are not quite as diverse. Her desire also seems impeccable given the conditions under which she won two NCAA championships. However, I question the statement that she makes Ogwumike better.

+/- stats have limited applicability. They are meaningless for one game; they are meaningless for comparing players from different teams. However, over the course of a season they provide the most meaningful indicator we have of how a player potentially affects team play. Early in their careers (even earlier for Moore over Parker), there was a season when Moore had one of the best +/- stat on the Lynx, and they won the championship that year. Parker had a comparatively poor +/- stat for the Sparks that same year, yet she won the MVP if I recall correctly. That suggests Parker's greatness as a player transcends her value to the team.

I'm not joining the "dump on Parker" bandwagon that's popular these days. Her performance at Tennessee verifies she can carry a team, but that may be part of her problem. Ironically, I think Moore had this same problem as a senior at UConn; it's why I've theorized that Moore is better for a team with experienced players who won't just watch her take over, while Taurasi is better for a team with inexperienced players whose confidence she will elevate. In any case, I suspect you think Parker is making Ogwumike better because she is the facilitator in their two person offense. However, how many times have UConn fans bemoaned the lack of aggression in post players demanding the ball? It could be that Ogwumike makes facilitation easy for a teammate. This part is rampant speculation, since I no longer watch the WNBA, but historical results suggest that Ogwumike may be more valuable to Parker than vice-versa.

 

[UcMiami]

Digger - nice post. I also find +/- a very problematic stat even on individual teams because it gets distorted by the players on the floor for the opponent. Teams tend to match up bench minutes so a good bench player can excel at +/- simply because she/he is playing most of her/his minutes against the opponents questionable bench. And a player like Stewart who plays more minutes than other starters can get penalized for the minutes played with bench players vs. the other starters on her own team. I seldom agree with value to the team in individual games represented by +/- so why would I believe the values over a full season even if the larger data set should balance out some of the single game anomalies?

Interesting comment about Maya vs DT at Uconn, but I think another factor was positional, forward vs. guard in ability to influence a game.

Agree that Nneka and Parker can stand on their own - equally dependent or equally independent (Moore and Charles at Uconn were a similar pair and Moore and Fowles now are similar.)

I am less likely to separate out Parker, EDD, or Stewart from other superstars - yes they have versatility from the three to the basket, but they are not really post players and get eaten alive on defense if they are tasked with defending superior posts. And their three point shooting is not consistent. Jackson as the first of the breed stands out more to me, and also had the desire and fire and strength to be a strong post defender.

 

[nwhoopfan]

From and attitude and desire standpoint, I would take Nneka over Parker, but from a basketball standpoint, as much as I don't like CP3, she is just sooooooooo good. IMO, she actually allows Nneka to appear better than she is.

Nneka looked just fine at the beginning of the year when Parker was out injured.

 

[MilfordHusky]

My view on Nneka and Parker is that both help the other. Nneka’s cuts help Candace’s assists, and Candace’s passes help Nneka’s shooting and scoring. L.A. underachieved relative to their talent until Agler appeared. I suspect that Nneka’s work ethic and hustle have rubbed off on Candace.

 

[willtalk]

In respect to Parker- Her problem is that she believes she is better than she really is. The Sparks have been hurt this year when she attempts to control the ball on offense. Her two man game with Parker and others works when she is stationary because her length from the outside lets her see over and make passes to cutting players. He passing to stationary players are not as good and sometimes really bad because she attempt to put them into tighter or none existent windows. Her turnovers in the last two games where passes that where usually short or completely off the mark right to the opposition. Other then on fast breaks, when she attempts to garner assists off the dribble in the half court she has really sucked this season.

I could understand why when Toliver was playing point that it was better for Parker to handle the ball more, but at present they have both Sims and Gray who are much better ball handlers. Gray also see's the court better and is a better passer. Both Gray and Sims are better off the dribble passers of drives in the half court. Parker should limit herself to passing from a stationary position and driving purely to set herself up for scores.

She doesn't fight for rebound unless they are right too her. That has really hurt the team this year. The other teams have been getting lots of O boards. He defense is also sporatic. She is a highly skilled player who when she is on can help carry and offense. But when she is no is often a liability on the court. That has been the case quite a bit this season.

 

[MSSportsGuy]

Not wanting to hijack a threat but just putting in my two cents on what some are saying about Parker but.....

I read this board because I am a fan of the game and enjoy the informative and sometimes spirited conversations. There is a lot of wisdom and class from most of the posters and it's great to comment and read about a sport that is barely mentioned outside of a few places even at the peak of the season. I also shake my head because to read these threads Ive seen posts which said:

EDD lacks passion, doesn't play defense and is afraid of top competition
Wilson can't take physical contact and can only go to her left
Diggins can't shoot, flops all over the floor and is a diva
Griner isn't a good rebounder for her size and should be a more dominant player
Parker thinks she's better than she is, takes plays off, and is a diva

All of these things are true sometimes. No player, not even the UConn fantastic five, is perfect in all aspects of the game at all times on the court themselves. I'm not criticizing the Husky greats because they are easily some of the best players in the world. However, so are the women I mentioned above. My point is it's very easy for us as fans to point out flaws we see in players we've watched so closely for so long. I posted earlier that I felt the Lynx were struggling because Whalen, Augustus and Brunson were all aging collectively and couldn't give as much as before. There is truth in the statement but my goodness those ladies have logged so many minutes over so many years for great teams and have earned their accolades. I myself can't do the things I could at 25 so why should I think others don't have the same issue? I should have just kept my mouth shut.

This is a UConn board, not a women's basketball board. I don't think I've seen many posts at all that are mean spirited or derogatory. Clearly it's natural to stick up for your own players and criticize a rival. Very few posts do this but I just wanted to give my two cents.

 

[Rixxx]

MSSportsGuy, I can speak for myself and appreciate your regular comments. I appreciate the fans from ND, SC, Baylor, Rutgers, TN, OSU, and others that contribute to the BY. It just makes the BY a more interesting place to visit.

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

IMHO Candace Parker's is 100% for Candace Parker, 1st, last and always!
There isn't a TV camera that CP3 doesn't know their location before every game!
Since her TN years she is a great athlete that can dominant with 30 points and 18 RB's one game and 6 points on 3 for 20 shooting and 2 RB's the next! She can shut down the best opponent then give an ole defense time and again in the next game!
As they said about Reggie Jackson, "there's not enough mustard to cover that hot dog!"
On the Sparks, Nneka O. is "the straw that stirs the drink!"
Beanna Stewart and EDD are 2 big girls that make CP3 look like she's standing still!

 

[bballnut90]

IMHO Candace Parker's is 100% for Candace Parker, 1st, last and always!
There isn't a TV camera that CP3 doesn't know their location before every game!
Since her TN years she is a great athlete that can dominant with 30 points and 18 RB's one game and 6 points on 3 for 20 shooting and 2 RB's the next! She can shut down the best opponent then give an ole defense time and again in the next game!
As they said about Reggie Jackson, "there's not enough mustard to cover that hot dog!"
On the Sparks, Nneka O. is "the straw that stirs the drink!"
Beanna Stewart and EDD are 2 big girls that make CP3 look like she's standing still!

Can you cite 1 example of when she went 3-20 and had 2 rebounds?

 

[ctkaiser]

That's what I noticed vs Sun the other night. Didn't always feel like playing. Always seems to have something to say to refs, teammates during time outs. No doubt a tremendous talent but nobody outworks either Ogumike.

 

[shizam]

I’m not sold on Chiney yet. She’s not that good nor as high impact as Parker. Love Aja and Nneka. You can have Chiney ANYTIME.

 

[shizam]

Not wanting to hijack a threat but just putting in my two cents on what some are saying about Parker but.....

I read this board because I am a fan of the game and enjoy the informative and sometimes spirited conversations. There is a lot of wisdom and class from most of the posters and it's great to comment and read about a sport that is barely mentioned outside of a few places even at the peak of the season. I also shake my head because to read these threads Ive seen posts which said:

EDD lacks passion, doesn't play defense and is afraid of top competition
Wilson can't take physical contact and can only go to her left
Diggins can't shoot, flops all over the floor and is a diva
Griner isn't a good rebounder for her size and should be a more dominant player
Parker thinks she's better than she is, takes plays off, and is a diva

All of these things are true sometimes. No player, not even the UConn fantastic five, is perfect in all aspects of the game at all times on the court themselves. I'm not criticizing the Husky greats because they are easily some of the best players in the world. However, so are the women I mentioned above. My point is it's very easy for us as fans to point out flaws we see in players we've watched so closely for so long. I posted earlier that I felt the Lynx were struggling because Whalen, Augustus and Brunson were all aging collectively and couldn't give as much as before. There is truth in the statement but my goodness those ladies have logged so many minutes over so many years for great teams and have earned their accolades. I myself can't do the things I could at 25 so why should I think others don't have the same issue? I should have just kept my mouth shut.

This is a UConn board, not a women's basketball board. I don't think I've seen many posts at all that are mean spirited or derogatory. Clearly it's natural to stick up for your own players and criticize a rival. Very few posts do this but I just wanted to give my two cents.

Should Whalen be playing this year? Players like Kayla McBride deserve more All Star consideration. She is 24th in voting Whalen 13th. I love watching McBride play, she’s skilled and fearless. I used to enjoy Whalen. Now she is fearless and over the hill. I certainly hope this is her last year. Tough seeing her play like this. She WAS so good.

 

[MSSportsGuy]

Should Whalen be playing this year? Players like Kayla McBride deserve more All Star consideration. She is 24th in voting Whalen 13th. I love watching McBride play, she’s skilled and fearless. I used to enjoy Whalen. Now she is fearless and over the hill. I certainly hope this is her last year. Tough seeing her play like this. She WAS so good.

I do believe Whalen deserves to go out on her own terms given her contribution to the league, national team and the Lynx. She's slowed down but can still put up numbers, just not with the frequency as before.

McBride has been a fav of mine since the ND days. I enjoyed watching she and Diggins against the Huskies. I had no stake in the game at all and didn't exactly cheer for the Irish but appreciated the fact they were not afraid of UConn and the two teams played some fantastic contests.

 

[Dillon77]

I do believe
McBride has been a fav of mine since the ND days. I enjoyed watching she and Diggins against the Huskies. I had no stake in the game at all and didn't exactly cheer for the Irish but appreciated the fact they were not afraid of UConn and the two teams played some fantastic contests.

K-Mac is one of my faves, as well, and I've been a fan of the Irish for virtually the entire duration of their existence! She continually works on her game and to watch highlights of her now will show that work: she can score on drives, pull-up jumpers and the spot-up three. Plus, she's got an excellent handle and can help a lead guard break pressure.
Also pleased to see how her confidence has grown over the years. Granted, she's with members of her ND base here, but she looks confident and relaxed here (third from left).

BTW, that's current Irish wing Jackie Young on the far left, who is developing more of K-Mac's relentlessness every year. She has her modest approach, as well.

 

[MSSportsGuy]

BTW, that's current Irish wing Jackie Young on the far left, who is developing more of K-Mac's relentlessness every year. She has her modest approach, as well.

Yes I recognize Young. She and the other Irish starters, especially Arike, will be remembered by MSU fans for a long time lol.

 

[bballnut90]

Here's my "Almost End of WNBA Season Awards"


1st Team:
Breanna Stewart, Seattle
Candace Parker, LA (up from 2nd team)
Liz Cambage, Dallas (up from 2nd team)
Elena Delle-Donne, Washington
Diana Taurasi, Phoenix

2nd team:
Sylvia Fowles, Minnesota (down from 1st team)
Brittney Griner, Phoenix (down from 1st team)
Sue Bird, Seattle
Tiffany Hayes, Atlanta (up from no team)
Chelsea Gray, LA (up from no team)


MVP: Stewart
ROY: Wilson
COY: Hughes
MIP: Howard


Not a ton of movement from the first list I put out a month ago other than Cambage/Parker swapping with Fowles/Griner and Hayes/Gray bumping out Moore and Diggins.

Lots of other players having strong years who could make a claim to be on a team with a strong finish or playoff run, including Loyd, the Ogwumikes, Moore, Diggins-Smith, Wilson, McBride, Charles, Vandersloot, Bonner, and McCoughtry. I'll make another list in a couple of weeks when the season is done.