Is the AAC more competitive after UConn

[DefenseBB]

Here are the current standings with 3 games to go before the tournament:

As I see both USF and UConn at the top, I ponder if the league is really getting better. I do believe UCF has made in-roads and is on the upswing and they even have a top 100 HoopGurlz prospect signed for next year. I look at Houston and am hopeful but still unsure. I had high hopes for Travis Mays at SMU but the jury is still out as he suffered a step back. Jamelle, for all the support we give her due to her connections has not impressed at all. This year's group is her best in awhile if not ever and it is not great. I cut Tonya some slack as she lost a key piece to injury before the year and she had the team playing well last year. Thoughts?

 

[Monte]

Still weak.

 

[shizam]

Can AAC get enough decent coaches and then keep them? No team has been able to sustain any success other than UConn and USF. Even IF they do chances are the coach will use it as launch pad to a better job. Most of these schools aren’t places an up and coming standout coach is going to put down roots. They’ll find a way into the P5

I was impressed w Temple in the tournament last year. Now they’re struggling.

 

[augustaTC]

Can AAC get enough decent coaches and then keep them? No team has been able to sustain any success other than UConn and USF. Even IF they do chances are the coach will use it as launch pad to a better job. Most of these schools aren’t places an up and coming standout coach is going to put down roots. They’ll find a way into the P5

I was impressed w Temple in the tournament last year. Now they’re struggling.

Excellent coach+very strong school support (facilities, academics, financial)+talented players = success. Generally can't get the players without the first two. I kinda hope Coach Abe at UCF is the exception to the launch pad rule. The school certainly seems to have what it takes to succeed (nice location, very good facilities, $, growing national awareness, primarily via football, etc) and I guess they may have some talent coming in next year. Looks sustainable to me. That's the model, at least these days. Pretty much depends on the Institution and the ADs to make it work.

 

[Jaybird65]

Excellent coach+very strong school support (facilities, academics, financial)+talented players = success. Generally can't get the players without the first two.

Pretty much sums it up.

 

[DefenseBB]

Excellent coach+very strong school support (facilities, academics, financial)+talented players = success. Generally can't get the players without the first two. I kinda hope Coach Abe at UCF is the exception to the launch pad rule. The school certainly seems to have what it takes to succeed (nice location, very good facilities, $, growing national awareness, primarily via football, etc) and I guess they may have some talent coming in next year. Looks sustainable to me. That's the model, at least these days. Pretty much depends on the Institution and the ADs to make it work.

I really like her as well and think she's the second best coach in the conference. My sole worry is if Phil Fulmer gets a clue, fires Holly and decides they shouldnot pick a former Lady Vol and goes after her. Imagine her defensive effort WITH TALENT that UT can bring in...but then again, it's Tennessee, they will only look at Legacy candidates, and we don't have to worry about them being truly relevant. I feel better now...

 

[FridaFriend]

I compared the records of AAC teams this year and last year against teams of the Big East and the P5 conferences. Last year the record of the AAC teams, not including UCONN, was 14-20 and this year it is 7-29. The seven victories this year were USF over LSU, Butler, Washington State, and St. Johns. Houston defeated Texas Tech. Tulane and Memphis bested Vanderbilt.

Last year, USF defeated Georgia, Butler, and North Carolina. Tulane beat NC State and Auburn. SMU bested Texas A&M, Kansas, and Boston College. Temple beat Rutgers and DePaul. Memphis bested Vanderbilt and Illinois. Houston defeated Rutgers. UCF beat Butler.

I think this shows that overall, the AAC is less competitive this year.

 

[shizam]

I compared the records of AAC teams this year and last year against teams of the Big East and the P5 conferences. Last year the record of the AAC teams, not including UCONN, was 14-20 and this year it is 7-29. The seven victories this year were USF over LSU, Butler, Washington State, and St. Johns. Houston defeated Texas Tech. Tulane and Memphis bested Vanderbilt.

Last year, USF defeated Georgia, Butler, and North Carolina. Tulane beat NC State and Auburn. SMU bested Texas A&M, Kansas, and Boston College. Temple beat Rutgers and DePaul. Memphis bested Vanderbilt and Illinois. Houston defeated Rutgers. UCF beat Butler.

I think this shows that overall, the AAC is less competitive this year.

Great info. Though less competitive is understating it. How about ATROCIOUSLY less competitive.

 

[BroadwayVa]

Here are the current standings with 3 games to go before the tournament:

As I see both USF and UConn at the top, I ponder if the league is really getting better. I do believe UCF has made in-roads and is on the upswing and they even have a top 100 HoopGurlz prospect signed for next year. I look at Houston and am hopeful but still unsure. I had high hopes for Travis Mays at SMU but the jury is still out as he suffered a step back. Jamelle, for all the support we give her due to her connections has not impressed at all. This year's group is her best in awhile if not ever and it is not great. I cut Tonya some slack as she lost a key piece to injury before the year and she had the team playing well last year. Thoughts?

Is the AAC getting to be a stronger WBB league, sure. Are they the B.E. or ACC --Heck NO.
Each year teams are getting the Geno message. So why are they not comparable to say some weak teams like Baylor, or Texas or ND? Simple: Those that are getting better have good coaches a nd decent money for the program. Coaches alone won't solve all ills. Should Geno take over Jamelle's duties, with her salary, he may not do any better. The College/University has not bought into the benefits of a good top WBB program. ]
Some good coaches in the AAC, some good talent. The B.E. wasn't super great for a while.
You don't just add water and mix, it's not an instanteous process.

 

[DefenseBB]

Is the AAC getting to be a stronger WBB league, sure. Are they the B.E. or ACC --Heck NO.
Each year teams are getting the Geno message. So why are they not comparable to say some weak teams like Baylor, or Texas or ND? Simple: Those that are getting better have good coaches a nd decent money for the program. Coaches alone won't solve all ills. Should Geno take over Jamelle's duties, with her salary, he may not do any better. The College/University has not bought into the benefits of a good top WBB program. ]
Some good coaches in the AAC, some good talent. The B.E. wasn't super great for a while.
You don't just add water and mix, it's not an instanteous process.

Broadway-I don't think you and I are on the same wavelength here. A thousand mile journey starts with a single step and in the conference, we mostly have "have nots" that I only see UCF and maybe Houston with any gleaning of hope. Maybe SMU potentially. I am not saying add water.
Let's clear something up for the full forum now-Coaches salaries are not really the issue:
UCF-Katie Abrahamson-Henderson gets $375k
USF-Jose Fernandez $425
Cin-Jamelle $467
Temple-Tonya $556
Memphis-Melissa McFerrin $200+
Wichita-Keitha Adams $315
The median salary of the P5 is $475, meaning half are above and half are below. What isn't calculated are the salaries for private institutions (Tulane, SMU) or assistants, which does affect coaching. I was surprised at how much these coaches actually make.

What does affect programs are the funding of the program to recruit, pay assistants, upgrade facilities, market the program which are all critical factors.

My question's genesis is from when the ACC added Florida State and Miami into the league to improve it's football legitimacy. I would have thought with USF and UConn as powers from the Big East, that in the 5 years (this is year 5) we would have seen programs getting competitive (any programs) and while I mentioned UCF in year 2 here of Coach Abe, they were not good OOC. To still only be getting 2 bids for the NCAA is year 5 is not good.

 

[BroadwayVa]

Broadway-I don't think you and I are on the same wavelength here. A thousand mile journey starts with a single step and in the conference, we mostly have "have nots" that I only see UCF and maybe Houston with any gleaning of hope. Maybe SMU potentially. I am not saying add water.
Let's clear something up for the full forum now-Coaches salaries are not really the issue:
UCF-Katie Abrahamson-Henderson gets $375k
USF-Jose Fernandez $425
Cin-Jamelle $467
Temple-Tonya $556
Memphis-Melissa McFerrin $200+
Wichita-Keitha Adams $315
The median salary of the P5 is $475, meaning half are above and half are below. What isn't calculated are the salaries for private institutions (Tulane, SMU) or assistants, which does affect coaching. I was surprised at how much these coaches actually make.

What does affect programs are the funding of the program to recruit, pay assistants, upgrade facilities, market the program which are all critical factors.

My question's genesis is from when the ACC added Florida State and Miami into the league to improve it's football legitimacy. I would have thought with USF and UConn as powers from the Big East, that in the 5 years (this is year 5) we would have seen programs getting competitive (any programs) and while I mentioned UCF in year 2 here of Coach Abe, they were not good OOC. To still only be getting 2 bids for the NCAA is year 5 is not good.

I believe we are on the same page. I may have confused the issue saying Should Geno take Jamelle's place and salary--etc. No I was not speaking salaries--although that is also a factor--I was speaking to the lack of Universities spending the dollars necessary to create a decent program.
The length of time the AAC has been in business isn't really a strong factor. Kids have to identify good coaching and Universites willing to give them exposure, etc then "maybe" they will come. Winning obviously helps. But I always throw the Geno thing in: He took Uconn a program in deep do do and not winning--he got a buy in from the Admin--and with personality--recruited and promoted his plan--. Geno is a lot of things--but his is not ultimately unique in building a program--point is he did it, but not without Admin/Uconn support and buy in. If he can do it--bring it from below the AAC level teams --to a top 20 team those in the AAC can at least try but they need help from the Admin's. It takes a saleman/coach.
I'm pretty sure we agree.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Broadway-I don't think you and I are on the same wavelength here. A thousand mile journey starts with a single step and in the conference, we mostly have "have nots" that I only see UCF and maybe Houston with any gleaning of hope. Maybe SMU potentially. I am not saying add water.
Let's clear something up for the full forum now-Coaches salaries are not really the issue:
UCF-Katie Abrahamson-Henderson gets $375k
USF-Jose Fernandez $425
Cin-Jamelle $467
Temple-Tonya $556
Memphis-Melissa McFerrin $200+
Wichita-Keitha Adams $315
The median salary of the P5 is $475, meaning half are above and half are below. What isn't calculated are the salaries for private institutions (Tulane, SMU) or assistants, which does affect coaching. I was surprised at how much these coaches actually make.

Wow - impressive salaries, yes. But obviously lacking anyone beside Geno and arguably Tonya Cardoza that are really what would be considered well paid if they were in a P5 school. Of course, there are a lot of P5 schools that don't pay their coaches very well as well. But the half that are over the medium you indicate for the P5 includes some really impressive salaries (for what you would expect for women's basketball).

I think the USF salary is sad for such an accomplished coach. Given what salaries are. Personally, I think salaries for college coaches are absurd, but I don't hold that against them, coaches should be paid fairly by industry standards.

 

[DefenseBB]

I think the USF salary is sad for such an accomplished coach.

I did the salary research last week and as I said all the coaches I listed are actually right at the average for top coaches. Some are paid crazy amounts that just don't warrant what they have done-Nikki Fargas for example is paid $1mil+ at LSU and that's ridiculous vs. her poor results. Holly gets $650k.
5 of the Big 10 coaches get less than $450k so our AAC salaries commensurate what most AD's are willing to pay for non-revenue sports.

As far as Jose goes, he does have a good size "program budget" especially given his attendance that is pretty a paltry at 2,690. I wonder why the school doesn't market better. They have 2 main contributing factors going for them-WCBB has an older demographic which suits South Florida better than white on rice and he has a significant "spanish" flavor to his roster so most of the populace would probably know is play calls to the the team....

Coach Abe at UCF has their attendance up to 3,302 this year IN YEAR 2!!! 2 years ago they had 672 per game, so she has something special going on there. She is the one most at risk to losing to a P5 school that cares about WCBB. Hopefully that AD has sold her on their commitment to build.

I get there are a limited number of these roles and a superstar is well worth paying for with limited considerations. Even Geno is at or near his maximum as the revenue stream is capped. I am pretty psyched the attendance has climbed and is now blowing the Men's program out of the water- 7,787 this year.

One last point the UConn attendance would place them 36th on the Men's list, with 10,558 just ahead of Xavier, who happens to be the #4 team in the country!!!