Interesting blog RE freshmen | The Boneyard

Interesting blog RE freshmen

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Agreed, by the end of the year they are missing meaningful minutes in what could be 10 to 12 total games against good teams like auburn, msu, arkansas, etc.
 
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I felt the same way with Durham and Enoch's playing time last year averaging a combined 20 mins a game. Not as many blowout losses but season was over shortly after it started. Hopefully this situation doesn't end same way with both players transferring.
 
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I felt the same way with Durham and Enoch's playing time last year averaging a combined 20 mins a game. Not as many blowout losses but season was over shortly after it started. Hopefully this situation doesn't end same way with both players transferring.
I couldn't agree more. Last year Enoch rotted on the bench in favor of Brimah and Facey when we knew we were going nowhere. I argued myself electronically hoarse last year. Vance and Enoch handled badly by KO last year. This year KO is playing transfers and grad students instead of guys who we want to keep. I honestly believe that KO thinks the team is going to make a run to the tournament and he can't play the freshmen. That's how bad it has gotten.
 

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I felt the same way with Durham and Enoch's playing time last year averaging a combined 20 mins a game. Not as many blowout losses but season was over shortly after it started. Hopefully this situation doesn't end same way with both players transferring.
To think, if we played these dudes they’d still be here
 
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This is a ridiculous blog.

Our freshmen essentially play 2 positions as none of them are guards. It's pretty hard to have more than two of Whaley, Carlton, Williams, and Diarra on the floor at the same time. People would demand that Ollie be fired immediately if he tried a lineup with 3 of the freshmen bigs on the floor at the same time. And, some of the lack of freshman playing time has to do with foul trouble. When they get 2 fouls in the first half, they sit. In the past 5 games, the freshmen are averaging ~62 minutes/game. In the Temple blow out, they played 85 minutes. I don't know how the freshmen could play that many more minutes given that none of them are ball handlers.

Here are Diarra's stats over the last 14 games: 8.9 fouls per 40 minutes and 6.1 rebounds per 40 minutes. He has more fouls than rebounds over the past 14 games! These are not good stats for a big. He played 8 minutes against USF and had 4 fouls.

Whaley is averaging 3.2 rebounds per 40 minutes over the last 14 games! And, he has been averaging 22 minutes per game over the time! How many more minutes can you play him?

Carlton has been playing major minutes as he has shown improvement and he is contributing.
 

intlzncster

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I argued myself electronically hoarse last year. Vance and Enoch handled badly by KO last year. This year KO is playing transfers and grad students instead of guys who we want to keep. I honestly believe that KO thinks the team is going to make a run to the tournament and he can't play the freshmen. That's how bad it has gotten.

He's fighting for his job man. What do you expect?
 
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This is a ridiculous blog.

Our freshmen essentially play 2 positions as none of them are guards. It's pretty hard to have more than two of Whaley, Carlton, Williams, and Diarra on the floor at the same time. People would demand that Ollie be fired immediately if he tried a lineup with 3 of the freshmen bigs on the floor at the same time. And, some of the lack of freshman playing time has to do with foul trouble. When they get 2 fouls in the first half, they sit. In the past 5 games, the freshmen are averaging ~62 minutes/game. In the Temple blow out, they played 85 minutes. I don't know how the freshmen could play that many more minutes given that none of them are ball handlers.

Here are Diarra's stats over the last 14 games: 8.9 fouls per 40 minutes and 6.1 rebounds per 40 minutes. He has more fouls than rebounds over the past 14 games! These are not good stats for a big. He played 8 minutes against USF and had 4 fouls.

Whaley is averaging 3.2 rebounds per 40 minutes over the last 14 games! And, he has been averaging 22 minutes per game over the time! How many more minutes can you play him?

Carlton has been playing major minutes as he has shown improvement and he is contributing.
You missed the entire point of the article.

1) The article clearly states they're talking about the blowouts, so Diarra's stats over the last 14 games are meaningless. The author isn't arguing the stats are good, he's arguing these guys are better served in the future by playing more minutes now, when the game is out of reach.
2) Diarra had 2 fouls in the first half, but didn't play a minute in the second half according to the article. There's no arguing that he didn't play because of foul trouble. He didn't play because of the coach's decision.
Also, the suggestion that they aren't playing due to foul trouble would require that they're on the bench so that they don't foul out. What is he saving them for? Let them play, if they foul out so what? We're getting blown out anyway. It's just nonsensical to argue that a guy with 2, 3, or even 4 fouls shouldn't be played in the last 5 minutes of a game we're losing by 20 because he might foul out.
3) Ollie advocates "positionless basketball", and against a team getting whatever they want inside (like WSU) we could absolutely have Carlton, Diarra, Polley, Adams, and Vital on the floor.
 
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He's fighting for his job man. What do you expect?

Agreed he is. Won’t it do him better to say we’re losing but getting development for next year. Rather than going full out and getting blown out.
 
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This will do wonders for recruiting and incoming players desires to come here..
 
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You missed the entire point of the article.

1) The article clearly states they're talking about the blowouts, so Diarra's stats over the last 14 games are meaningless. The author isn't arguing the stats are good, he's arguing these guys are better served in the future by playing more minutes now, when the game is out of reach.
2) Diarra had 2 fouls in the first half, but didn't play a minute in the second half according to the article. There's no arguing that he didn't play because of foul trouble. He didn't play because of the coach's decision.
Also, the suggestion that they aren't playing due to foul trouble would require that they're on the bench so that they don't foul out. What is he saving them for? Let them play, if they foul out so what? We're getting blown out anyway. It's just nonsensical to argue that a guy with 2, 3, or even 4 fouls shouldn't be played in the last 5 minutes of a game we're losing by 20 because he might foul out.
3) Ollie advocates "positionless basketball", and against a team getting whatever they want inside (like WSU) we could absolutely have Carlton, Diarra, Polley, Adams, and Vital on the floor.
You are missing my point. You can only play 2 of Diarra, Carlton, Whaley, and Williams at a time at best. And, Whaley and Carlton have been playing major minutes. Over the past 10 games, Carlton is averaging ~22 minutes per game. He would have played more, but he was limited by 4 fouls in 3 of the games. Over the past 12 games, Whaley is averaging 23 minutes per game, which as I pointed out, is why we have been crushed on the boards as he is not rebounding.

As for the end of blowouts, Polley, Whaley, and Williams did play at the end of the Wichita State game. Carlton got his 4th foul with >10 minutes to go in the game and he wasn't playing well as he had 1 rebound. Williams played instead with Polley and Whaley at times. Anybody who watched the game would have said play Williams over Carlton based on how they were playing.

I get it how people are down on Ollie, but criticizing him for lack of playing time for the freshmen is absurd. In the blowouts against Wichita St and Temple, the freshmen played 65 and 85 minutes and it is hard to play more than 2 of them at a time.
 

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This is a ridiculous blog.

Our freshmen essentially play 2 positions as none of them are guards. It's pretty hard to have more than two of Whaley, Carlton, Williams, and Diarra on the floor at the same time. People would demand that Ollie be fired immediately if he tried a lineup with 3 of the freshmen bigs on the floor at the same time. And, some of the lack of freshman playing time has to do with foul trouble. When they get 2 fouls in the first half, they sit. In the past 5 games, the freshmen are averaging ~62 minutes/game. In the Temple blow out, they played 85 minutes. I don't know how the freshmen could play that many more minutes given that none of them are ball handlers.

Here are Diarra's stats over the last 14 games: 8.9 fouls per 40 minutes and 6.1 rebounds per 40 minutes. He has more fouls than rebounds over the past 14 games! These are not good stats for a big. He played 8 minutes against USF and had 4 fouls.

Whaley is averaging 3.2 rebounds per 40 minutes over the last 14 games! And, he has been averaging 22 minutes per game over the time! How many more minutes can you play him?

Carlton has been playing major minutes as he has shown improvement and he is contributing.

I'll make it simple. This team should never again play a 3 guard lineup with Adams, Vital and Anderson all three in at the same time, unless we are nursing a lead and need FT shooting and ball handling in the last two minutes.

It causes several problems, including a lack of rebounding, forcing Larrier to defend the 4 (which he is bad at), and dysfunction among the guards. It also means that those younger bigs are on the pine more than they should be. Two of Carlton, Diarra, Whaley and Polley should be in almost at all times (minus when we give DO a couple of minutes).
 

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Agreed he is. Won’t it do him better to say we’re losing but getting development for next year. Rather than going full out and getting blown out.

I gotta think that in college sports, intentionally giving yourself less of a chance to win isn't going to sit well with most people. It might be logical, but it's not going to fly. This isn't the pros; the older kids have only a limited chance left and every bit as much a right to play as the freshman. Whoever earns it should play. What kind of a message would that be for prospective recruits?

His rotations are junk, I think we all know that. I'd argue that some of the younger guys have earned their time. DO has not. So I don't know why he gets so much burn.
 
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I mean look we get crushed on the boards with our big lineup ... Polley always outta position, Whaley gets the ball snatched from him, MD gets soned down low , and ppl just jump over Carlton n DO is slow so ppl just go around him .. what else KO can do but sit with dissatisfaction from his players.. only ppl fighting for boards is our guards n none of them are over 6-2 imo

KWINTIN be hustling but even he gets the same result n TL is too soft.. I just need us to play solid perimeter defense don’t help stay glued to ya man , I’m tired of seeing teams beat us from deep and have wide open shots
Our zone TL needs to be down low quick players at the top

Most ppl will say it’s a lost season but it’s not lost til we lose in our tournament so I’m always gonna have hope, hopefully KO will figure out the defense n limit teams to one shot , our offense is looking better JA is finding his spots, AA starting to regain confidence, Vital is hitting 38-40% of his 3’s n getting to the line, TL needs to just be effectively efficient, n our bigs to give us 20 n 12 boards

Looking forward to see these last 6 games
 
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To think, if we played these dudes they’d still be here
This is not a defense of Ollie. But Enoch is gone because his father thought he should be a showcase player. When he came in for 4 to 5 minutes, you could expect a missed layup, 2 or 3 fouls, a rebound and two blown defensive plays. THAT is why Enoch is gone. Durham was 1/2 step behind on every defensive play when he was in there.
 
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I wanted Polley to take more of Larrier’s minutes (because Larrier isn’t good at basketball), but even after getting into a lot of games, he still plays scared. It’s ok to play nervous and/or scared for the first few games of your freshman season. It’s a huge change from high school. But Polley looking scared on the court in February is not acceptable.
 
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I'll make it simple. This team should never again play a 3 guard lineup with Adams, Vital and Anderson all three in at the same time, unless we are nursing a lead and need FT shooting and ball handling in the last two minutes.

It causes several problems, including a lack of rebounding, forcing Larrier to defend the 4 (which he is bad at), and dysfunction among the guards. It also means that those younger bigs are on the pine more than they should be. Two of Carlton, Diarra, Whaley and Polley should be in almost at all times (minus when we give DO a couple of minutes).
You realize that Ollie is playing Anderson so that he can handle the ball and take the pressure off our two leading scorers, Adams and Vital, neither whom are point guards. You can't have Adams and Vital handling the ball all of the time and scoring half of our points per game. If we had a freshman guard or two or a freshman small forward that scores, they would be playing a lot over Anderson and getting plenty of minutes during blow outs.
 
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I wanted Polley to take more of Larrier’s minutes (because Larrier isn’t good at basketball), but even after getting into a lot of games, he still plays scared. It’s ok to play nervous and/or scared for the first few games of your freshman season. It’s a huge change from high school. But Polley looking scared on the court in February is not acceptable.
Polley has been given every opportunity to contribute and he has not delivered. He started 6 of the first 7 games and he seems to be lost right now. He has the second worst +/- among the regular players. He is averaging 3.7 rebounds per 40 minutes. In conference play, he is shooting 20%. He needs more practice, not game time to further erode his confidence.
 
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Our freshmen essentially play 2 positions as none of them are guards. It's pretty hard to have more than two of Whaley, Carlton, Williams, and Diarra on the floor at the same time. People would demand that Ollie be fired immediately if he tried a lineup with 3 of the freshmen bigs on the floor at the same time. And, some of the lack of freshman playing time has to do with foul trouble. When they get 2 fouls in the first half, they sit. In the past 5 games, the freshmen are averaging ~62 minutes/game. In the Temple blow out, they played 85 minutes. I don't know how the freshmen could play that many more minutes given that none of them are ball handlers.
Normally this would make sense but feels like most of our games are essentially over at half-time so we could have played Carlton, Polley, Whaley, Diarra & Williams in some combination with 2 guards for the entirety of the 2nd half's until they foul-out.....it's silly for Jalen to be playing the 3rd most minutes in the entire country, who cares if we lose by 40, 30 or 20. In the few games we actually had a chance to win then Jalen & Vital can play the whole game otherwise what's the point.....play Larrier at some 2, shooting is the only thing he can do anyway.

If KO thinks winning a game in the NIT is going to save his job he's delusional..........the only reason he stays is $ otherwise based on performance after the prior 3 years he should have been gone after Arkansas, maybe that could have saved the season.
 
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You are missing my point. You can only play 2 of Diarra, Carlton, Whaley, and Williams at a time at best. And, Whaley and Carlton have been playing major minutes. Over the past 10 games, Carlton is averaging ~22 minutes per game. He would have played more, but he was limited by 4 fouls in 3 of the games. Over the past 12 games, Whaley is averaging 23 minutes per game, which as I pointed out, is why we have been crushed on the boards as he is not rebounding.

As for the end of blowouts, Polley, Whaley, and Williams did play at the end of the Wichita State game. Carlton got his 4th foul with >10 minutes to go in the game and he wasn't playing well as he had 1 rebound. Williams played instead with Polley and Whaley at times. Anybody who watched the game would have said play Williams over Carlton based on how they were playing.

I get it how people are down on Ollie, but criticizing him for lack of playing time for the freshmen is absurd. In the blowouts against Wichita St and Temple, the freshmen played 65 and 85 minutes and it is hard to play more than 2 of them at a time.
Williams over Carlton is a good choice. I did watch the game and Williams seemed to know what he was doing. Great Hustle on defense. He was always eyeballing the the court. He seems to have some BBIQ.
 

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You realize that Ollie is playing Anderson so that he can handle the ball and take the pressure off our two leading scorers, Adams and Vital, neither whom are point guards. You can't have Adams and Vital handling the ball all of the time and scoring half of our points per game. If we had a freshman guard or two or a freshman small forward that scores, they would be playing a lot over Anderson and getting plenty of minutes during blow outs.

Adams absolutely is a point guard. In fact, he’s a damned good one. He’s actually a terrible shooting guard. Ollie is to dense to have figured this out. If he wants to play Anderson, fine, do it so that one of the other two can rest on the bench. Our worst lineup is all three of them and anyone else. By far.
 
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There's no reason we can't play Whaley, Carlton and Diarra at the same time down 25. The notion that we can't have more than 2 of anyone in our front court when losing by 20-25 with 5-10 minutes to go is absurd.
 

intlzncster

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There's no reason we can't play Whaley, Carlton and Diarra at the same time down 25. The notion that we can't have more than 2 of anyone in our front court when losing by 20-25 with 5-10 minutes to go is absurd.

But what's the point of that? To get them experience on the wing? They need experience in the post. You can't stick all three down there at once.

I guess you could try to develop Whaley into a three, but idk about that.
 
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But what's the point of that? To get them experience on the wing? They need experience in the post. You can't stick all three down there.
Wait, our guys play in the paint? I thought their job was to set picks for Adams and then watch him go 1 on 3. Why do they have to stay in the paint? Are their feet stuck to the floor? Are they not allowed to move on offense? To create space and places to attack the rim by moving without the ball?

To answer your question, since Ollie is married to the "pick and watch Adams drive", run Carlton up to the top of the key to set the pick, put Diarra on the baseline and Whaley on the wing. But they guys have to cut to the rim and Adams has to be willing to pass the ball.

But they aren't married to those spots. The ball needs to move and our guys need to move without the ball. Against a zone the three could be playing in the shape of a triangle from the foul line down to the baseline, moving and interchanging spots so that the defense has to account for them.

Against man, you can set a double pick instead of one which would clear up the lane so that Adams isn't going 1 v 3 all the time. If we had more motion in the offense, more picks off the ball, screening for the screener is very effective when doing it with bigs, if you get a mismatch with a small 3 on Whaley in the paint, then clear out to the other side of the paint and let him go to work, if the double comes, look for the pass. There are multiple options. This wouldn't be the first time a team went big instead of small.

There are all sorts of things you can try and do. More importantly, these guys can get some time on the court playing defense playing with eachother, communicating, rotating, boxing out, closing out shooters. It's time on the court. I've yet to read a logical argument that the team will be WORSE off by playing these guys more.
 

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