If Only We Could - Geno The Tease | The Boneyard

If Only We Could - Geno The Tease

RockyMTblue2

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Surprised no one brought this up yet. Geno Show Tuesday Night ad ran several times yesterday. In it he says: "I'd almost rather be in no conference." Well, Notre Dame FB pulls that off..what 12-14 times a season. We cannot. The conference play commitments of others would make that impossible I believe. But as fans, would we not be in pig heaven if it could be pulled off?
 

JoePgh

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Yes, that got my attention also. I wonder if he was operating off of his experience for this year, about which he said that he needed 5 cell phones to take the calls of everyone who wanted to play UConn this year (figuring that this would be the "down year" when UConn would be beatable).

But with the UConn rosters that are shaping up for the next couple of years, I think he will find it quite difficult to fill the current OOC schedule with quality opponents, never mind an additional 20 or so games in January and February when everyone else is playing conference schedules.

Where is it written that WCBB has to have the same conference affiliations as all the other sports? Why not try to organize a "virtual conference" consisting of the teams that have a consensus pre-season ranking of 1 to 30 for the current year, and let them all play each other in round-robin style for their entire regular season schedule? And then maybe go back to their regular conferences for the conference tournaments? I would think that it would be great for attendance, since the fans of all of those teams would appreciate seeing a steady diet of quality opponents, without the blowouts against other schools whose administrations really don't care about WCBB. And since WCBB doesn't make a significant financial contribution, why should the current conferences care if this is done?
 

Carnac

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I read something in an article last week that made me pause for a moment. It said that programs that play weak OOC schedules sometimes pay for it down the road because they fail to play ranked or "quality" teams that will properly prepare them for conference play, and it hurts their overall RPI. Unlike UConn that front loads their schedule with top 15 teams out of necessity because they only have one other conference member (USF) that is ranked, most other major programs have several ranked teams in their conference that will raise their RPI to a respectable or desired level during the season. We saw this the first two weeks of conference play around the country. A surprising number of top ranked programs lost in the first two weeks of conference play to unranked teams.

That theory made me pause for a moment to reflect on what UConn is doing in the AAC. They certainly aren't playing any conference games that prepare them for post season play, yet they continue to dominate the tournament field every year anyway. Critics that complain that UConn is in a weak or sub-standard conference fail to realize that being in a weak conference is more of a liability that an asset for that reason. Prior to playing Maryland, I predicted that UConn would win for this reason.

Up to that point, Maryland had not played enough teams that prepared them to play UConn. The Terps had only played two ranked teams: #23 Arizona State and #7 Louisville prior to taking on the Huskies. True, they kept the margin of victory to 6 points (87-81), but they had the Huskies on their home court the first game after the Christmas break; and should have been able to close the deal on a win. NONE of the teams they played prepared them for what they were going to experience against UConn.

And as for becoming an independent, Who in their right mind would want to schedule UConn in January or February when they are trying to prepare their team for post season play? Aren't you suppose to try and build momentum going into the post-season? Who in the AAC looks forward to playing UConn, and suffering a 30-50 point loss? :eek: A loss of THAT magnitude does absolutely nothing to build up a team's momentum or confidence. Players like to play in games they think they have a chance of winning.
 
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Yes, that got my attention also. I wonder if he was operating off of his experience for this year, about which he said that he needed 5 cell phones to take the calls of everyone who wanted to play UConn this year (figuring that this would be the "down year" when UConn would be beatable).

But with the UConn rosters that are shaping up for the next couple of years, I think he will find it quite difficult to fill the current OOC schedule with quality opponents, never mind an additional 20 or so games in January and February when everyone else is playing conference schedules.

Where is it written that WCBB has to have the same conference affiliations as all the other sports? Why not try to organize a "virtual conference" consisting of the teams that have a consensus pre-season ranking of 1 to 30 for the current year, and let them all play each other in round-robin style for their entire regular season schedule? And then maybe go back to their regular conferences for the conference tournaments? I would think that it would be great for attendance, since the fans of all of those teams would appreciate seeing a steady diet of quality opponents, without the blowouts against other schools whose administrations really don't care about WCBB. And since WCBB doesn't make a significant financial contribution, why should the current conferences care if this is done?
This is, indeed, the great tease. It appears that UCONN is stuck where they are, because the football program is minor league, and no major conference wants them. Since football seems to be the driver, UCONN basketball pays the price. It is, indeed, hard to watch the games where we are 40-50 points better than the opponent. Hard, also, for competitive players and the coaches. But it is what it is; a pre-season of sorts. Work stuff out ; get freshmen some court time ; get used to travel, etc. there are schools in the conference who could compete, but no one has really stepped up to the opportunity. Frustrating. Soon, it will be March.
 

JordyG

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UConn basketball playing as an independent is a wonderful, glorious, fantastic dream that can't and will not happen. But man, I dream every night.
 

DefenseBB

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I read something in an article last week that made me pause for a moment. It said that programs that play weak OOC schedules sometimes pay for it down the road because they fail to play ranked or "quality" teams that will properly prepare them for conference play, and it hurts their overall RPI. Unlike UConn that front loads their schedule with top 15 teams out of necessity because they only have one other conference member (USF) that is ranked, most other major programs have several ranked teams in their conference that will raise their RPI to a respectable or desired level during the season. We saw this the first two weeks of conference play around the country. A surprising number of top ranked programs lost in the first two weeks of conference play to unranked teams.

That theory made me pause for a moment to reflect on what UConn is doing in the AAC. They certainly aren't playing any conference games that prepare them for post season play, yet they continue to dominate the tournament field every year anyway. Critics that complain that UConn is in a weak or sub-standard conference fail to realize that being in a weak conference is more of a liability that an asset for that reason. Prior to playing Maryland, I predicted that UConn would win for this reason.

Up to that point, Maryland had not played enough teams that prepared them to play UConn. The Terps had only played two ranked teams: #23 Arizona State and #7 Louisville prior to taking on the Huskies. True, they kept the margin of victory to 6 points (87-81), but they had the Huskies on their home court the first game after the Christmas break; and should have been able to close the deal on a win. NONE of the teams they played prepared them for what they were going to experience against UConn.

And as for becoming an independent, Who in their right mind would want to schedule UConn in January or February when they are trying to prepare their team for post season play? Aren't you suppose to try and build momentum going into the post-season? Who in the AAC looks forward to playing UConn, and suffering a 30-50 point loss? :eek: A loss of THAT magnitude does absolutely nothing to build up a team's momentum or confidence. Players like to play in games they think they have a chance of winning.
Not sure who you are trying to convince given how astute this forum is so let me call out "rubbish" on your last paragraph. The AAC is/was a POOR WCBB group having to follow the lead of the Men's programs who due to lack of interest of Power 5 had to cobble together their dance cards. With NO ONE truly worthy of WCBB postseason thoughts on an annual basis, the UConn games are a great bar and recruiting tool for all these other programs to aspire too. This has in fact improved many of the programs, most notable USF who is hoping to be considered an annual NCAA team. Temple shows promise based on what Staley started and Cardoza is continuing. The others are making some strides with great freshman and strong recruiting classes but are not there yet. All the best coaches on the way up want to measure how they do- think Geno in 90's vs Tenn, think ND, MD in 2000's and now Texas, Louisville, MSU and SC. To get better you need to play the top. I don't think any true character coach "ducks" Teams at any time of year. Just my view on seeing the elite teams who want to grow the game behave.
 

JordyG

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I read something in an article last week that made me pause for a moment. It said that programs that play weak OOC schedules sometimes pay for it down the road because they fail to play ranked or "quality" teams that will properly prepare them for conference play, and it hurts their overall RPI. Unlike UConn that front loads their schedule with top 15 teams out of necessity because they only have one other conference member (USF) that is ranked, most other major programs have several ranked teams in their conference that will raise their RPI to a respectable or desired level during the season. We saw this the first two weeks of conference play around the country. A surprising number of top ranked programs lost in the first two weeks of conference play to unranked teams.

That theory made me pause for a moment to reflect on what UConn is doing in the AAC. They certainly aren't playing any conference games that prepare them for post season play, yet they continue to dominate the tournament field every year anyway. Critics that complain that UConn is in a weak or sub-standard conference fail to realize that being in a weak conference is more of a liability that an asset for that reason. Prior to playing Maryland, I predicted that UConn would win for this reason.

Up to that point, Maryland had not played enough teams that prepared them to play UConn. The Terps had only played two ranked teams: #23 Arizona State and #7 Louisville prior to taking on the Huskies. True, they kept the margin of victory to 6 points (87-81), but they had the Huskies on their home court the first game after the Christmas break; and should have been able to close the deal on a win. NONE of the teams they played prepared them for what they were going to experience against UConn.

And as for becoming an independent, Who in their right mind would want to schedule UConn in January or February when they are trying to prepare their team for post season play? Aren't you suppose to try and build momentum going into the post-season? Who in the AAC looks forward to playing UConn, and suffering a 30-50 point loss? :eek: A loss of THAT magnitude does absolutely nothing to build up a team's momentum or confidence. Players like to play in games they think they have a chance of winning.
Let's just end this Maryland fallacy right now. Last year they lost in MSG by 10. Now they lose to a sick, weakened, inexperienced and short benched UConn team at home by 6 and this is improvement? Bah. To me Baylor showed far more in their loss to UConn than Maryland's ever will. Otherwise, Oh Wise One you have all the right of it.
 

JordyG

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Not sure who you are trying to convince given how astute this forum is so let me call out "rubbish" on your last paragraph. The AAC is/was a POOR WCBB group having to follow the lead of the Men's programs who due to lack of interest of Power 5 had to cobble together their dance cards. With NO ONE truly worthy of WCBB postseason thoughts on an annual basis, the UConn games are a great bar and recruiting tool for all these other programs to aspire too. This has in fact improved many of the programs, most notable USF who is hoping to be considered an annual NCAA team. Temple shows promise based on what Staley started and Cardoza is continuing. The others are making some strides with great freshman and strong recruiting classes but are not there yet. All the best coaches on the way up want to measure how they do- think Geno in 90's vs Tenn, think ND, MD in 2000's and now Texas, Louisville, MSU and SC. To get better you need to play the top. I don't think any true character coach "ducks" Teams at any time of year. Just my view on seeing the elite teams who want to grow the game behave.
Interesting. But no matter how high the bar or its use as a recruiting tool, the fact remains no one looks forward to a twice yearly butt whuppin. Yes many players have said how playing against UConn forced them to improve their games, but heed the word "forced". Not one enjoys eating the poison, and yes as Carnac said, it does nothing to improve your late season confidence and is a sure momentum stopper. That was C's point. Yeah steel sharpens steel and his thrust of the point, that even the most sharpened of swords in the WCBB drawer would hesitate before being bashed against a rock before the duel begins, is valid.
 
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It is the nature of college basketball that teams play in conferences, and no matter how much a coach might, in principle, want to play UConn, the fact is that teams don't have a lot of leeway once the conference schedule starts. It's unrealistic, at the very least, to think entire conferences will adjust their schedule so one particular member will be able to play UConn -- or any other non-conference opponent -- and do it enough times to allow UConn to round out a complete's season's worth of games.
 

JoePgh

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It is the nature of college basketball that teams play in conferences, and no matter how much a coach might, in principle, want to play UConn, the fact is that teams don't have a lot of leeway once the conference schedule starts. It's unrealistic, at the very least, to think entire conferences will adjust their schedule so one particular member will be able to play UConn -- or any other non-conference opponent -- and do it enough times to allow UConn to round out a complete's season's worth of games.
I agree that UConn couldn't do it by itself. My point was: why can't a deal be made among the schools that are regularly Top 25 WCBB contenders to have all of them avoid their regular season conference schedule and instead play each other? Is Duke or Notre Dame going to miss playing Clemson? Is South Carolina, Tennessee, or Mississippi State going to miss playing Arkansas or Alabama? Every conference has bottom feeders that don't offer the elite teams in their conference any serious opposition. So why not form a WCBB-only "league" from among the elite teams in all conferences?

I can't believe that there is any financial reason not to do this -- WCBB does not make a financial contribution to any conference, so there is no revenue to lose. And if attendance and TV ratings rise as a result of better games, there is a limited amount of money to be made.

If that were done, then January and February could be spent by all of these elite programs playing in a "league of their own", with no detriment and possibly a modest financial benefit to their home conferences.
 
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OTOH, I kind of like it when really good teams only meet late in the NCAA Tourney. Remember When UConn played ND for the championship when they hadn't played that season and both were undefeated? Great stuff!
 
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I agree that UConn couldn't do it by itself. My point was: why can't a deal be made among the schools that are regularly Top 25 WCBB contenders to have all of them avoid their regular season conference schedule and instead play each other? Is Duke or Notre Dame going to miss playing Clemson? Is South Carolina, Tennessee, or Mississippi State going to miss playing Arkansas or Alabama? Every conference has bottom feeders that don't offer the elite teams in their conference any serious opposition. So why not form a WCBB-only "league" from among the elite teams in all conferences?

I can't believe that there is any financial reason not to do this -- WCBB does not make a financial contribution to any conference, so there is no revenue to lose. And if attendance and TV ratings rise as a result of better games, there is a limited amount of money to be made.

If that were done, then January and February could be spent by all of these elite programs playing in a "league of their own", with no detriment and possibly a modest financial benefit to their home conferences.
Have to think this would be just the rich getting richer. And no one wants to be the tail end of tha virtual league.
 

BigBird

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...And as for becoming an independent, Who in their right mind would want to schedule UConn in January or February when they are trying to prepare their team for post season play?

Who? Let's start with a school that wants to put people in the available seats. Schools get a 3-4 thousand person bump in attendance when they host UConn. Multiply that by ticket costs and ancillary spending, and it's well worth doing. An extra hundred grand is not to be ignored.

Anyone looking to improve their SOS would schedule UConn without hesitation. This is a team that will be very good to excellent every year.

A program on the recruiting trail can use a game with UConn as a recruiting lever. "Come to Wassamatta U, and be part of the team that beats UConn."
 
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I know these ideas are all theoretical, but the biggest stumbling block is going to be the NCAA. As long as the AAC has women's basketball, we have to keep the basketball team where our other sports are. Furthermore we have to play a conference schedule so that we can have a conference tournament and get the auto bid to the NCAA tournament.
 
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Replace D-I BB conferences with mini-leagues, plus a promotion / relegation system (English football style).

To set it up the first time, pick out the top 16 teams based on some combination of the previous year's human ranking, computer ranking, NCAA performance, whatever. Put them in a league together that takes the place of the normal conference schedule. Then do the same thing with the next 16, and the next 16 after that.

After those three, set up regional leagues in a series of tiers based on their performance the previous year for the rest of the D-I teams.

After that initial setup year, it'll work based on your performance in your league. The bottom two or four teams in the top league get demoted the next season to the second tier league. The top two or four teams in the second tier league get promoted to the first tier league.

Rinse/repeat for all other tiers. Because the league schedule is only a part of the year's total schedule (as conference schedules are now), that leaves plenty of available games to play your traditional conference rivals if you want.

Well, I'd find all that fun, personally. But, back to the real world, eh? ;)
 
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I agree that UConn's conference schedule should be more challenging. However, the upside of the weak conference schedule is the extended training and playing time for talent that is sitting on the bench. This allows those young folks to get real time practical game experience and build skills.
 
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UConn didn't decide to switch conferences. First Notre Dame, then Rutgers and Louisville. Then the Catholic schools didn't want them. The alternative was to start a new conference. The teams are getting better, but they have a long way to go before reminding people of the Big East. Don't blame UConn; blame the football conferences that keep poaching teams from other conferences: Texas A&M, Colorado, Nebraska, Maryland, Rutgers and on and on.
 
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UConn didn't decide to switch conferences. First Notre Dame, then Rutgers and Louisville. Then the Catholic schools didn't want them. The alternative was to start a new conference. The teams are getting better, but they have a long way to go before reminding people of the Big East. Don't blame UConn; blame the football conferences that keep poaching teams prom other conferences: Texas A&M, Colorado, Nebraska, Maryland, Rutgers and on and on.
So... UCONN didn't understand that fielding a competitive football program was the key to being in a competitive conference? Blaming others for your problems usually results in you taking no action to fix your problems.
 
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So.... UCONN didn't understand that fielding a competitive football program was the key to being in a competitive conference? Blaming others for your problems usually results in you taking no action to fix your problems.

I graduated from UConn in 1964. I went to a lot of football games and guess what? They lost every game beaten by the likes of Rhode Island and Maine. The State of Connecticut nor the University itself since I could remember has ever supported a strong football program. Edsall came the closest but they could not compete with an Oklahoma. Every response is a token response and not a full commitment.

It has been 56 years since I began as a freshman and went to games. I have not seen any undefeated seasons since that time.
 

Huskee11

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Yeah steel sharpens steel and his thrust of the point, that even the most sharpened of swords in the WCBB drawer would hesitate before being bashed against a rock before the duel begins, is valid.

Now THAT is well said!!
 
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UConn didn't decide to switch conferences. First Notre Dame, then Rutgers and Louisville. Then the Catholic schools didn't want them. The alternative was to start a new conference. The teams are getting better, but they have a long way to go before reminding people of the Big East. Don't blame UConn; blame the football conferences that keep poaching teams from other conferences: Texas A&M, Colorado, Nebraska, Maryland, Rutgers and on and on.

Well, maybe, but you have to ask yourself a really important question, or at least it was important back then: Why did no one want UConn? IIRC, by the time other universities were leaving the Big East and the Catholic schools wanted to go their own way, the die was cast. IIRC, it also was not just the lack of a good football program, but also actions and attitudes of certain Connecticut politicians and UConn athletic leadership. By the time it all came down, those factors had caused other leaders, in other places, to decide they didn't need UConn. The university leadership, prior to and at the time the Big East dissolved, was not blameless, IMHO.
 

Carnac

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Who? Let's start with a school that wants to put people in the available seats. Schools get a 3-4 thousand person bump in attendance when they host UConn. Multiply that by ticket costs and ancillary spending, and it's well worth doing. An extra hundred grand is not to be ignored.

Anyone looking to improve their SOS would schedule UConn without hesitation. This is a team that will be very good to excellent every year.

A program on the recruiting trail can use a game with UConn as a recruiting lever. "Come to Wassamatta U, and be part of the team that beats UConn."

Bigbird, I was being cynical, and thinking like a coach. You're thinking like a AD. From a coach's perspective, I don't want my team to take a 40-50 point "ass-wuppin" in the days/weeks winding down to the post-season tournaments. I want to build momentum going into March, preferably with a win streak. A huge point loss to anyone, is mentally deflating, and destroys any confidence that may have been built up to that point. THAT is where I was coming from with that observation. You know how effective a player that lacks confidence is.

If I play UConn, I want it to be in November, so that I have plenty of time to BUILD on that loss. You want to get better and show improvement as the season moves along. There are lessons that can be learned from playing UConn. The team can see up close and personal what near perfection looks like, and the results from reaching and playing at the level UConn has attained.

All of your points are valid. I can't argue with any of them from the point of view you're looking at it from. The added revenue from the bump in attendance cannot be ignored. The improvement in SOS cannot be argued. Being able to market that UConn is on your schedule could be a selling point for ticket sales and recruitment purposes. BOTTOM LINE: Unless you're a top 10 program with top level talent that can keep the MOV respectable, you're going to get blown out. For the reasons you mentioned, I'd play them, but not after the Christmas break. Like Geno breaks down freshmen early in the season, then builds them back up from mid January on, to get them ready for the post-season, is the same thing I'd try to do with my team.
 
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UConn basketball playing as an independent is a wonderful, glorious, fantastic dream that can't and will not happen. But man, I dream every night.

There are no independent programs in NCAA Division I basketball as of the 2016–17 season.
 

BigBird

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Bigbird, I was being cynical, and thinking like a coach. You're thinking like a AD. From a coach's perspective, I don't want my team to take a 40-50 point "ass-wuppin" in the days/weeks winding down to the post-season tournaments. I want to build momentum going into March, preferably with a win streak. A huge point loss to anyone, is mentally deflating, and destroys any confidence that may have been built up to that point. THAT is where I was coming from with that observation. You know how effective a player that lacks confidence is.

If I play UConn, I want it to be in November, so that I have plenty of time to BUILD on that loss. You want to get better and show improvement as the season moves along. There are lessons that can be learned from playing UConn. The team can see up close and personal what near perfection looks like, and the results from reaching and playing at the level UConn has attained.

All of your points are valid. I can't argue with any of them from the point of view you're looking at it from. The added revenue from the bump in attendance cannot be ignored. The improvement in SOS cannot be argued. Being able to market that UConn is on your schedule could be a selling point for ticket sales and recruitment purposes. BOTTOM LINE: Unless you're a top 10 program with top level talent that can keep the MOV respectable, you're going to get blown out. For the reasons you mentioned, I'd play them, but not after the Christmas break. Like Geno breaks down freshmen early in the season, then builds them back up from mid January on, to get them ready for the post-season, is the same thing I'd try to do with my team.

Darned good response. Agree all the way.
 

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