Heard this argument on wfan yesterday...

[Jaydumo20]

Importance is totally different than how big an upset.

The Giants had a much better chance beating the undefeated Pats in a one game Super Bowl than the Knicks do to beat the Celtics. But the Knicks winning the series wouldn't be nearly as important or memorable.

Great point. That version of an upset hinges on "narrative" which makes the argument actually one worthy of discussion. @superjohn the Dallas example is a perfect argument for 'pure' upset. It doesn't have the historic cache but it was near impossible to imagine.

 

[Huskyforlife]

The Celtics aren’t even the best team in their conference, what are we even talking about.

 

[RJScootin]

The Celtics aren’t even the best team in their conference, what are we even talking about.

Boston is better than Cavs and would/will be favs if they play next round.

Its hard to compare a single game vs a 7 game series. I don't believe that Giants beat Pats in 7 game series (I'm a Giants fan).

Boston was -$1,000 going into series, that's a pretty lopsided series. I think this argument is much closer than most have given credit to. I'd still be shocked if Knicks win series or even another game.

 

[uconnblueinky]

If the Knicks beat the Celtics, Cavs and Thunder/Nuggets on the way to their first title in 50 years, it could compare to beating the 18-0 Patriots. But not until then

If the Cavs survive

 

[Hunt for 7]

Thanks for the convincing argument, Mr. Dunning-Kruger.

How many of these were 7 game series?

The List: Top upsets in sports history

The greatest moments in sports are often when an underdogs win over the favorite. Check out our list of top ten upsets in sports history.

www.espn.com

You think everyone's an idiot for thinking Buster Douglas beating Mike Tyson was a big upset? Hey, he just had to do it once, right?!?! How about the Mircale on Ice? Easy peasy, says this genius.

If I could I would give this post 100 likes. Two of the best BY antagonists going at it…….@nomar squarely taking the lead.

This is classic entertainment. Post less read more and enjoy the ruthlessness. Visiting the BY as a message board is akin to going to a fight and having a hockey game break out. Classic entertainment IMHO…..

 

[Jaydumo20]

Boston is better than Cavs and would/will be favs if they play next round.

Its hard to compare a single game vs a 7 game series. I don't believe that Giants beat Pats in 7 game series (I'm a Giants fan).

Boston was -$1,000 going into series, that's a pretty lopsided series. I think this argument is much closer than most have given credit to. I'd still be shocked if Knicks win series or even another game.

The upset is alive and well

 

[Hunt for 7]

Boston is better than Cavs and would/will be favs if they play next round.

Its hard to compare a single game vs a 7 game series. I don't believe that Giants beat Pats in 7 game series (I'm a Giants fan).

Boston was -$1,000 going into series, that's a pretty lopsided series. I think this argument is much closer than most have given credit to. I'd still be shocked if Knicks win series or even another game.

Wow after watching Boston choke as badly as they have the first two games. Being shocked if the Knicks win another game. Certainly not going to prognosticate as I am usually wrong when it comes to NBA games……but it would seem the Knicks have a pretty good chance of winning one more game. Maybe not the series but the odds certainly have shifted quite a bit.

Think it is important to remember that before last year this Celtic team kind of had a history of falling short. Now losing this series might be the worst example of falling short for this team but maybe last year was more the outlier than the other years.

I don’t see a lot of fire in Tatum eyes and as I think another BYer mentioned he was way at the end of the bench on the Olympic team for a reason……wonder why that was because from a skill standpoint he has to be top 7 in the league. Maybe top 5.

 

[champs99and04]

Great point. That version of an upset hinges on "narrative" which makes the argument actually one worthy of discussion. @superjohn the Dallas example is a perfect argument for 'pure' upset. It doesn't have the historic cache but it was near impossible to imagine.

Was Dallas winning those series' really that surprising? They won 57 games that year - same as the Lakers and one fewer than the Heat.

My theory is that the more invested people are in an underdog winning, the more likely they are to overstate how big of an upset it was. There are a lot of Giants fans on this board, which probably plays into the reaction you got.

(Personally, I wasn't shocked by it - that Patriots team, great as they were, had clearly peaked too soon and were running out of steam by Thanksgiving, whereas the Giants were on the opposite trajectory. Don't get me wrong, it was a huge upset, but I don't even know if we can safely call it the biggest Super Bowl upset of all-time. Denver over Green Bay in '97 and New England over St. Louis in '01 were pretty shocking as well.)

The Miracle on Ice, for example, has stood the test of time so well in part because it was a rare instance of everyone rooting for the same team.

 

[Edward Sargent]

No argument these Knicks were built to beat the Celtics. The Giants first win over Brady was gravy. The Giants surpassed my expectations just by being in the playoffs

 

[gtcam]

No argument these Knicks were built to beat the Celtics. The Giants first win over Brady was gravy. The Giants surpassed my expectations just by being in the playoffs

Only if the Celts run their 3 pt only offense will the Knicks beat them in the series. The Celts have an unbelievable road record and hopefully they can rebound. What frustrates me the most is that the Celtics always seem to be using the 4th quarter as a time to try and shoot themselves out of slumps - love both JT and JB but I feel that they need to stop allowing these two from taking over the game when they are in that "force the shot mode".
Bottom line - no excuses to lose both those large leads late in the game. Champions don't lose their cool. The Unicorn has been a bust this series.

 

[Deepster]

For anyone who thinks the Knicks win would be a bigger deal, I'd offer the following:

• Giants were a wild card team that won 3 road games to get to the Super Bowl (at TB, at Dallas and at Green Bay).
• Giants were 4-4 in the 2nd half of the season leading into the playoffs, losing 2 of their last 3. Including a final regular season loss to the PATRIOTS 38-35.
• Giants were middle of the pack on both offense and defense. Pats were scoring 37 pts a game. The score of the SB was 17-14.
• The Tyree catch alone is a huge deal in terms of upset material. That'd be like Brunson heaving a full court buzzer beater hook shot with his off hand.

 

[RJScootin]

For anyone who thinks the Knicks win would be a bigger deal, I'd offer the following:

• Giants were a wild card team that won 3 road games to get to the Super Bowl (at TB, at Dallas and at Green Bay).
• Giants were 4-4 in the 2nd half of the season leading into the playoffs, losing 2 of their last 3. Including a final regular season loss to the PATRIOTS 38-35.
• Giants were middle of the pack on both offense and defense. Pats were scoring 37 pts a game. The score of the SB was 17-14.
• The Tyree catch alone is a huge deal in terms of upset material. That'd be like Brunson heaving a full court buzzer beater hook shot with his off hand.

That final game of season in New England felt like a win and gave Giants a lot of confidence moving forward. That Giants defense was playing at an elite level at time of Superbowl, allowing 16 points per game in playoffs.

In AFC Championship Pats looked to be running out of steam beating Chargers 21-12

As the saying goes "on any given Sunday"

 

[ThetaZoo]

Only if the Celts run their 3 pt only offense will the Knicks beat them in the series. The Celts have an unbelievable road record and hopefully they can rebound. What frustrates me the most is that the Celtics always seem to be using the 4th quarter as a time to try and shoot themselves out of slumps - love both JT and JB but I feel that they need to stop allowing these two from taking over the game when they are in that "force the shot mode".
Bottom line - no excuses to lose both those large leads late in the game. Champions don't lose their cool. The Unicorn has been a bust this series.

Who's going to stop Tatum and Brown from playing hero-ball? Certainly not Mazzulla.

 

[The Viking]

The 2007 patriots outscored the 2nd highest offense by 130 points. Belichik was on a revenge tour if I recall after some scandal where he wanted to punish every team he played.
That Giants run was as incredible an upset run as we will ever see in NFL history. Beating Tampa on the road then winning at #1 Dallas and #2 Green Bay and then beating the 18-0 team that was about to go down as the greatest of all time.

 

[dennismenace]

Hats off for coming up with discussion games in this college bb dead period.

Thanks to the participants for all the caustic remarks, putdowns and insults by the BY for reminding me that this is the Don Rickles award winning forum for sarcastic, biting, belittling and demeaning remarks.

Good show!

Coffee and the BY to start the day off on the right foot.

 

[Scoe]

That final game of season in New England felt like a win and gave Giants a lot of confidence moving forward. That Giants defense was playing at an elite level at time of Superbowl, allowing 16 points per game in playoffs.

In AFC Championship Pats looked to be running out of steam beating Chargers 21-12

As the saying goes "on any given Sunday"

That week 17 game was actually in Giants stadium but your point still stands about gaining confidence from that game. Spags btw held things back a bit on defense.

The emergence by the rookies in the playoffs was huge in Bradshaw, Smith, and Boss. Steve Smith only played 5 games in the regular season, he was a clutch 3rd wideout, got the forgotten catch after the Tyree catch where it was 3rd and 11 and got the 1st down and got out of bounds. Ahmad Bradshaw only played 2 games in regular season as a rb, he was a beast in the Buffalo game to clinch a playoff spot, then was held out in the last regular season game. A much different offense with the rookies emerging at the right time.

While Giants played most of their starters that week 17 game, they didn't wanna show their hand either as Bradshaw and Smith were held out.

I remember that AFC championship game and Brady was awful he threw 3 picks, I'll never understand why Ladanian Tomlinson never went back into that game when he was standing on the sideline with a superbowl on the line. Phillip Rivers to his credit played that game with a torn ACL.