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Message: [QUOTE="superjohn, post: 5328623, member: 1522"] Ben was in the tier of guards with Jamal Crawford, Cuttino Mobley, Michael Redd, Jason Richardson, Monta Ellis... They could all put up a lot of points but didn't give you all that much when it came to other things. Good scoring guards but nowhere near Hall of fame players. With zero all-star appearances and zero all-nba teams he would've had to all of a sudden become a perennial all-star getting like 6 all-stars under his belt, and a couple all NBA selections. Now Brandon Roy was a guard who was on the early path to being a Hall of Famer when injury ended things for him far too soon. [/QUOTE]