zls44
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Is that a risk you'd take?
Either WVU Are Stupid, Or Resigned To Staying Another Year
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Is that a risk you'd take?
If there was an injunction in place that called for the specific performance asked for by the Big East, helping WVU violate that injunction can carry potential liability for such third parties that are helping WVU (in this case, the Big XII and ESPN). By televising a Big XII game featuring WVU, while WVU was under such an injunction, ESPN would almost certainly be aiding the Mountaineers in violating it.
HuskyHawk
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But right now there is not. Both sides are asking for equitable relief, but neither has been granted what they seek. At present, if WVU broke the contract and played for the Big XII, the BE can seek money damages, and that's it. Neither party has the power of a court order compelling or excusing specific performance of the contract. So WVU could take the chance. The problem is that the schedules need to be set soon, or WVU may find itself shut out from playing anywhere.
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Exactly. I can't recall ever a situation like this. Not to say it hasn't happened somewhere, at some level of athletic competition. But from what I can tell sitting in my chair, there's nothing right now to stop the Big 12 and the Big East from both putting out 2012 calendar year schedules for ALL varsity sports......such that both conferences have scheduled West Virginia sports.
The schedules are going to need to come out, there's some wiggle room right now in scheduling, but not much.
This is why I've said repeatedly that with more cutthroat leadership, the big east could really shaft West Virginia. Until it's officially ruled upon, there's a chance, however remote that no injunction is put in place, and WVU goes ahead and plays all of their games in the big 12 and the thing just plays out in the courts. Best case scenario for the Big 12, that's for sure. Highly unlikely.
As for the big east, if I'm leading this thing, I've got two schedules ready to go right now - for all sports - for the big east. One with WVU, and one without. and I've already filed for forbearance of the 8 team minimum rule for football with the NCAA, in case you go with the schedule with only 7 conference teams in 2012.
It seems to me, that as soon as that forbearance of the 8 team minimum can be secured from the NCAA, the big east is free to say "screw you" to west virginia, and simply not schedule them in any sports, and in that case, with an injunction in place, West Virginia is now in limbo with every single sport for two years.
I doubt that Marinatto is the kind of guy to do something like that though, even if WVU deserves it, and that may be the only thing that saves them.
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Basically - here's my interpretation of where things are at right now - what I'm saying is that if the Big East can get approval to go ahead with a 7 team football conference in 2012, which would not be unprecedented, and based on circumstances, I don't see how the big east would be perceived to be doing anything underhanded in that both the big 12 and West Virginia University have repeatedly and expressly made the intentions clear that WVU would be scheduled for the big 12 in 2012 regardless of consequence.......
as long as the 7 team forbearance is granted......there's nothing to stop the big east from putting out a 2012 schedule for all sports that does not include West Virginia athletics, and in the case of the court ruling in favor of an injunction, it would be up to west virginia to convince the big east to put them back on the schedule, otherwise have no sports scheduled for the year.
Good lord, what the hell was Oliver Luck smoking.
as long as the 7 team forbearance is granted......there's nothing to stop the big east from putting out a 2012 schedule for all sports that does not include West Virginia athletics, and in the case of the court ruling in favor of an injunction, it would be up to west virginia to convince the big east to put them back on the schedule, otherwise have no sports scheduled for the year.
Good lord, what the hell was Oliver Luck smoking.
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I think that would be a big mistake on the Big East's part. The heart of their argument is that failure to comply with the notice provision will cause irreparable harm that cannot simply be remediated with cash. If they can get dispensation from the NCAA and successfully create a full schedule with 7 teams (i.e. filling all of the WVU slots with other opponents), a court may well find that there are no damages for which a payment wouldn't be sufficient compensation. In that case they'd probably let WVU go and proceed with the trial on purely financial grounds. How Pittsburgh and Syracuse would react to that is anyone's guess.
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You're right, I"ve thought about this. Posturing the way I"ve described would simply make it easy for a judge to allow WVU to play big 12 football in 2012, and would be a mistake. WVU will be on all the big east bball and olympic schedules for 2012. Football is the issue. I doubt WVU football is left out in the cold, but I can see a very real possibility that they will have an astronomical bill to pay just to play in 2012, regardless of conference affiliation.
HEre's why I think this:
2012 football schedules need to be published. In short order. The insanity of all this that WVU has put themselves in position around football, is that West Virginia can very well show up on both the Big 12 and Big East 2012 football schedules when they are published......I can't even imagine what would happen in that case, and I don't think that even the big 12 is dumb enough to do that right now, but the big east has every right to put out that schedulee......
SO - the more realistic thing right now is that both conferences need need to be planning to put football schedules that do NOT have West Virginia on the schedule in 2012,and need to be doing it right now! I think that the longer this drags out, this scenario is very much possible.
and that means contracted pay outs to 1-time home opponents from teams in each conference. ( cost : approx $450-500k is the going rate per game for a 1-AA opponent based on our Texas Southern scheduling issues last year) So if everybody goes that route - 16 games (7 BE, 9 B12) = approx. $7.2 -$8million). BUT --if schools are going to schedule 1-A opponents 1-time, the cost per game is going to go way up, and remember that only one 1-AA game a year counts towrad post season bowl eligibility, so a lot of teams will look at the possibility of scheduling one time 1-A oppoents. .
So, I think that has to happen, the longer this drags out, and in that case, once the courts decide where WVU is going to be, they'll play the games in that conference, but they'll be stuck with the bills from both conferences, and some teams out there will get a big pay day from WVU for simply scheduling a game, while other programs will actually play the games.
BOth conferences need to planning for that, b/c the Big EAstw/o WVU would only have 7 teams, and can't really afford to lose the extra game for each team, and the big 12 teams could likely afford to simply leave an open date, but they won't - because they can't leave the slots open because they won't have enough inventory to meet their broadcasting requirements with 9 conference teams, each with one empty date and stand to lose a TON of money in that case. They can argue with their media rights, that an empty date is the fault of the courts, but it's a terribly weak argument, much stronger if they've at least got a game to broadcast than a completely open date.
Sure would be interesting to know if the big east has petitioned the NCAA yet on issuing a forbearance on teh 8 team minimum for a 1-A/BCS qualification for 2012 based on circumstances and if anybody's been contacted from each conference about 1-time games.
HEre's why I think this:
2012 football schedules need to be published. In short order. The insanity of all this that WVU has put themselves in position around football, is that West Virginia can very well show up on both the Big 12 and Big East 2012 football schedules when they are published......I can't even imagine what would happen in that case, and I don't think that even the big 12 is dumb enough to do that right now, but the big east has every right to put out that schedulee......
SO - the more realistic thing right now is that both conferences need need to be planning to put football schedules that do NOT have West Virginia on the schedule in 2012,and need to be doing it right now! I think that the longer this drags out, this scenario is very much possible.
and that means contracted pay outs to 1-time home opponents from teams in each conference. ( cost : approx $450-500k is the going rate per game for a 1-AA opponent based on our Texas Southern scheduling issues last year) So if everybody goes that route - 16 games (7 BE, 9 B12) = approx. $7.2 -$8million). BUT --if schools are going to schedule 1-A opponents 1-time, the cost per game is going to go way up, and remember that only one 1-AA game a year counts towrad post season bowl eligibility, so a lot of teams will look at the possibility of scheduling one time 1-A oppoents. .
So, I think that has to happen, the longer this drags out, and in that case, once the courts decide where WVU is going to be, they'll play the games in that conference, but they'll be stuck with the bills from both conferences, and some teams out there will get a big pay day from WVU for simply scheduling a game, while other programs will actually play the games.
BOth conferences need to planning for that, b/c the Big EAstw/o WVU would only have 7 teams, and can't really afford to lose the extra game for each team, and the big 12 teams could likely afford to simply leave an open date, but they won't - because they can't leave the slots open because they won't have enough inventory to meet their broadcasting requirements with 9 conference teams, each with one empty date and stand to lose a TON of money in that case. They can argue with their media rights, that an empty date is the fault of the courts, but it's a terribly weak argument, much stronger if they've at least got a game to broadcast than a completely open date.
Sure would be interesting to know if the big east has petitioned the NCAA yet on issuing a forbearance on teh 8 team minimum for a 1-A/BCS qualification for 2012 based on circumstances and if anybody's been contacted from each conference about 1-time games.
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Carl Spackler wrote:
It seems to me, that as soon as that forbearance of the 8 team minimum can be secured from the NCAA, the big east is free to say "screw you" to west virginia, and simply not schedule them in any sports, and in that case, with an injunction in place, West Virginia is now in limbo with every single sport for two years.
I doubt that Marinatto is the kind of guy to do something like that though, even if WVU deserves it, and that may be the only thing that saves them.
I doubt it, too. The Big XII certainly looks like it needs a back up plan, because WVU and 2012 is not the answer. Having said that, I think that WVU will have to honor its commitment to the BE, and then see if the Big XII takes them in 2014, which may not be a certainty! Texas and OK are the key university's in this melodrama, and I don't think that either has a long term commitment to keeping the Big XII afloat after 2016, which makes WVU's position even more tenuous. WVU may may end up the biggest loser, and no one will really care!
It seems to me, that as soon as that forbearance of the 8 team minimum can be secured from the NCAA, the big east is free to say "screw you" to west virginia, and simply not schedule them in any sports, and in that case, with an injunction in place, West Virginia is now in limbo with every single sport for two years.
I doubt that Marinatto is the kind of guy to do something like that though, even if WVU deserves it, and that may be the only thing that saves them.
I doubt it, too. The Big XII certainly looks like it needs a back up plan, because WVU and 2012 is not the answer. Having said that, I think that WVU will have to honor its commitment to the BE, and then see if the Big XII takes them in 2014, which may not be a certainty! Texas and OK are the key university's in this melodrama, and I don't think that either has a long term commitment to keeping the Big XII afloat after 2016, which makes WVU's position even more tenuous. WVU may may end up the biggest loser, and no one will really care!
CL82
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I don't think so, at least not in anyway that would give them any legal exposure, especially if they are playing a Big 12 team with which they have an existing contract.
Yeah, given my sense of the minimal exposure, especially since there would be a lot of hype surrounding the game. That's free exposure that probably means more eyeballs on the game.
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I have been watching this thread and I starting to lean towards WVU is stupid....Why on earth is the B12 placing themselves at risk?
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http://www.herald-dispatch.com/sports/x1883873770/WVU-exit-to-Big-12-far-from-set-in-stone
As much as WVU athletic director Oliver Luck vacillates between denigrating the Big East and pontificating on joining the Big 12. ...
As much as WVU officials, athletes and fans want to believe the Big East is in their rear view mirrors and the future is now for Big 12 membership. ...
There's a good chance it won't happen.
Not in 2012 and, perhaps, not ever.
As much as WVU athletic director Oliver Luck vacillates between denigrating the Big East and pontificating on joining the Big 12. ...
As much as WVU officials, athletes and fans want to believe the Big East is in their rear view mirrors and the future is now for Big 12 membership. ...
There's a good chance it won't happen.
Not in 2012 and, perhaps, not ever.
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