Does Rivals Really Know?

[SJScout]

Why does rivals latch on to some kids and promote them to the end of the earth and many future college stars have to create their own hype. . .on the field!!!

 

[whaler11]

Relationships

 

[SJScout]

Had the chance to attend the Temple spring game yesterday and listen to Coach Addazio address HS players there for junior day. Smartest thing I've heard in a while "I don't recruit kids because Rivals tells me who to recruit". "Its based on what you do and the level of competition you do it on and wether or not your willing to be coached hard and loved hard". This also got me thinking about all of the kids who Rivals promotes based on how many events their parents shell out the money for the kids to attend. I have to admit, no longer believe half of whats on Rivals.

 

[uconndogs]

I've said this for years, Rivals follows and rates kids based on the interest kids get from programs, it is not the other way around. If Texas or PSU or FSU made me an offer (or if I convinced one of these retruiting services they had) then I would be a 4 star recruit.

It's s self fullfilling prophecy, because the elite programs get their first share of kids and if they are successful programs they should know how to assess talent. After the top 10 or 15 programs I don't think these rankings show much of anything. To argue that a 30th ranked class is better than a 50th is pointless to me.

And on an individualized basis these things can be way off. I'm not picking on DJ, but in what universe is he a USC 5 star recruit and Donald Brown and Jordan Todman 2 star recruits. All great athletes, but the better running backs hands down are pretty obvious once they got on the field.

 

[SJScout]

Being at many events and involved in this process in some way has allowed me to see whats called "the hype machine". Based on a kids parents shelling out ungodly money to take that kid to the rivals camps/ combines and 7 on 7s and the same guy then interviewing that kid at every event and posting it, a mediocre player now gets 10 offers in one spring period! Schools are following this as the bible and its shameful for those more talented kids who played their buts off but the parents cant afford to take them to rivals events so they can get hyped and blown up!

 

[johnhuskies95]

Rivals isn't perfect, far from it. However, there is no denying that the best teams in the country each year are the ones who have the highest ranked recruits year in and year out.

 

[uconndogs]

Which has next to nothing to do with any assessment that Rivals is doing.

 

[Dann]

if players don't get atleast 4 stars when they commit to uconn, i don't root for them.

 

[junglehusky]

This thread is news to Larry Coker.

 

[uconnbill]

Rivals is as good as any other service when it comes to ratings. Each service pushes some players ratings up depending on what school they commit too. Subscriber based ratings are all like this. Shame because much of the overall info is good.

 

[SJScout]

The stars , in many cases , mean nothing! Show me a kid who performs when the lights are on against top competition and leads his team to success. It doesn't hurt if the kid can give a firm handshake and look you in the eye. This is what always mattered (not a star next to a name) Not the same guy from rivals sticking a mic in the same kids face at every event (no pads on by the way) and then posting nonstop articles about that kid until lazy recruiters tend offer after offer, even as those who've watched this kid play, know that its pure hype and no substance and the kid will vanish in 2 yrs. I enjoy all of the scouting services, but the overhyping, on some level, can be a joke!

 

[uconnbill]

The stars , in many cases , mean nothing! Show me a kid who performs when the lights are on against top competition and leads his team to success. It doesn't hurt if the kid can give a firm handshake and look you in the eye. This is what always mattered (not a star next to a name) Not the same guy from rivals sticking a mic in the same kids face at every event (no pads on by the way) and then posting nonstop articles about that kid until lazy recruiters tend offer after offer, even as those who've watched this kid play, know that its pure hype and no substance and the kid will vanish in 2 yrs. I enjoy all of the scouting services, but the overhyping, on some level, can be a joke!

All the recruiting services do that. From Scout, to Rivals, to ESPN to 247. They all do it.

 

[huskypantz]

Not only is it a joke, but certain coaches have incentives in their contract to land top 25 recruiting classes or X number of 4-star kids. So you better believe that if Mack Brown, Saban, Meyer etc need one more kid to have 4 stars, a phone call with a little pressure or "inside info" can easily influence a recruiting guru. And don't let them tell you there's checks and balances - bottom line is that if Rivals stonewalls Texas then Texas is going to be less than forthcoming with information, and information is the lifeblood of the pay sites. So the largest subscription fan bases have the most power with the pay sites and the decided advantage in star rankings.

http://proxy.espn.go.com/ncf/blog/_/name/feldman_bruce/id/6045571

 

[UCHuskies08]

Rivals isn't perfect, far from it. However, there is no denying that the best teams in the country each year are the ones who have the highest ranked recruits year in and year out.

So you're saying the best teams get the best players? Revolutionary thinking, right there.

 

[traitor71]

This thread is news to Larry Coker.

Pretty much anything is news to someone that has been in a coma for a dozen years or so.

 

[SAMCRO]

Aside form the elite 5 star and some 4 star top 50-100 kids, which just about every service is consistent on, it's a crap shoot. That's where some of the 3 star to 4 star over rating occurs.

I posted on this before, where a co-workers son was a HS RB. He sent him to every Rivals, etc... camp he could get to from the time he was going into his Sophomore year. He was invited to San Antonio to workout as a junior at the AA game, they flew to Tulsa and to Florida for different camps. The kid was given 3 stars on rivals (but had no rating on any other service) before playing a meaningful minute of varsity ball. He had letters from a handfull of B12's and B10's, interest from all of the MAC, some CUSA, some BE, some ACC schools, this was all before playing a meaningful minute of HS Varsity ball. He won camp "MVP" a bunch of times, was quick, strong, good hands, showed some wiggle in open field during these camps. When they put the pads on and game time came, he disappeared. He went down if a defender grazed him and struggled blocking when he needed to. By week 3 he was the back up RB, and they used him as a WR in the slot (probably the best place for him to be). His rating and initial interest all came from his camp performances, not from real football performance. They came out of these camps thinking (and being told) he has what it takes to be playing at a BCS school. He is now playing at a D3 school, having the time of his life, and getting his degree. Great for him and his Dad, they are happy, but the camps definitely had them believing somehting different (shame on them for buying into it)

I'm not saying most 3 star and 4 star players have this story, but I do think people would be surprised at how many do get inflated ratings based on their financial commitment to these camps sponsored by the rating services. I also think you'd be surprised how many schools do pull names of these rating services, if for nothing else, to send some mail or ear mark to look into.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

I agree with a lot of what was written here so far.

But can you imagine, the shear stupidity of giving your recruiting coordinator a bonus according to your recruiting class ranking by these services? Especially if the head coach thinks this is all just "stupid"?

(Sorry, I'm usually the one ripping people for bringing "him" into threads, but I couldn't resist this one.)

 

[SJScout]

Aside form the elite 5 star and some 4 star top 50-100 kids, which just about every service is consistent on, it's a crap shoot. That's where some of the 3 star to 4 star over rating occurs.

I posted on this before, where a co-workers son was a HS RB. He sent him to every Rivals, etc... camp he could get to from the time he was going into his Sophomore year. He was invited to San Antonio to workout as a junior at the AA game, they flew to Tulsa and to Florida for different camps. The kid was given 3 stars on rivals (but had no rating on any other service) before playing a meaningful minute of varsity ball. He had letters from a handfull of B12's and B10's, interest from all of the MAC, some CUSA, some BE, some ACC schools, this was all before playing a meaningful minute of HS Varsity ball. He won camp "MVP" a bunch of times, was quick, strong, good hands, showed some wiggle in open field during these camps. When they put the pads on and game time came, he disappeared. He went down if a defender grazed him and struggled blocking when he needed to. By week 3 he was the back up RB, and they used him as a WR in the slot (probably the best place for him to be). His rating and initial interest all came from his camp performances, not from real football performance. They came out of these camps thinking (and being told) he has what it takes to be playing at a BCS school. He is now playing at a D3 school, having the time of his life, and getting his degree. Great for him and his Dad, they are happy, but the camps definitely had them believing somehting different (shame on them for buying into it)

I'm not saying most 3 star and 4 star players have this story, but I do think people would be surprised at how many do get inflated ratings based on their financial commitment to these camps sponsored by the rating services. I also think you'd be surprised how many schools do pull names of these rating services, if for nothing else, to send some mail or ear mark to look into.

I do believe that this sums it all up! A parente financial commitment during the spring/summer shouldn't have this large of an impact on a kids chances of playing DI college football and I see this now on a daily basis. Game film along with the character of a kid should hold more value, as it always did for generations. Technology can make zombies of us all. I long for the days when coaches sat in your living room with mom serving coffee and danishes, not the same rivals guy deciding the futures of so many!

 

[EdgewoodNHV]

Rivals isn't perfect, far from it. However, there is no denying that the best teams in the country each year are the ones who have the highest ranked recruits year in and year out.

Don't tell that to Notre Dame.

 

[FAIRTIDES]

Rivals is as good as any other service when it comes to ratings. Each service pushes some players ratings up depending on what school they commit too. Subscriber based ratings are all like this. Shame because much of the overall info is good.

Sounds a little like judging diving/figure skating/gymnastics with Rivals acting as the Russian/East German judge.

 

[johnhuskies95]

So you're saying the best teams get the best players? Revolutionary thinking, right there.

According to some people on this board, recruiting rankings mean nothing. They do.

 

[uconnbill]

The ratings mean something to the fans, players, coaches of the players and their families. The coaches in college for the most part don't care. They have much more to worry about then what any writer says about a recruit.

 

[NateDogg11]

According to some people on this board, recruiting rankings mean nothing. They do.

Ummmm just look at the NFL Draft---Majority of 1st and 2nd rd picks are 4 or 5 star players. To say rankings mean nothing is stupid, the draft backs up they do. If you want to say they dont rank 2 and 3 stars properly then maybe you can make a good argument

By the way I did some research and Rivals charges $75 for their camps. I know its not free but thats not a ton of dough

 

[johnhuskies95]

Ummmm just look at the NFL Draft---Majority of 1st and 2nd rd picks are 4 or 5 star players. To say rankings mean nothing is stupid, the draft backs up they do. If you want to say they dont rank 2 and 3 stars properly then maybe you can make a good argument

By the way I did some research and Rivals charges $75 for their camps. I know its not free but thats not a ton of dough

I think you and I are in agreement.

 

[uconnbill]

Ummmm just look at the NFL Draft---Majority of 1st and 2nd rd picks are 4 or 5 star players. To say rankings mean nothing is stupid, the draft backs up they do. If you want to say they dont rank 2 and 3 stars properly then maybe you can make a good argument


This sorta of disagrees with your statement on four and five stars as early picks especially lineman