Crazy Idea, let’s raid the ACC?

[NIT88]

During the latest B12 snub, it was interesting to learn more about Yormark’s push to close the gap with the B10 and SEC with elite basketball. With the ACC potentially crumbling, why not have the BE reform as a power conference and raid the ACC? I think an improved version of the old BE would be more valuable than the current B12.

Let’s say the B10, B12, and SEC expand to 20 teams each in the next round of realignment (obviously a complete guess): that leaves about 8 seats in the P3 (after FSU and Clemson leave) for the remaining 15 ACC teams. The leverage the BE has now is that we are a better basketball conference than the ACC. Why not get the BE to pouch 9 of the 15 ACC teams left to form a 20-team hoops conference and a 10-team football conference. We could look at adding Army and Navy for football to add some value with regard to rivalries. We could have the best basketball conference in the country (beat the B12 at its own game), and have comperable to better football than the old BE.

Imagine Duke and Carolina in the BE, some of our old BE brethren back (and hopefully revitalized), but also with schools like Marquette and Creighton that were not here in the old BE. Imagine THAT conference at MSG. Imagine 14 schools making the NCAA tourney. With about half of hoops championships over the last 25 years, the BE would be the new conference of champions.

Let’s stop begging, and talk to the BE about this. Here are hypothetical new BE members:

Duke
North Carolina
Pitt
Syracuse
Louisville (if they don’t jump to the B12)
Virginia
NC State
Georgia Tech
Wake Forest

***We won’t let BC in, but will let them beg.

I know this is crazy, but this basketball conference would OWN recruiting east of the Mississippi. Recruits would pick MSG in March and much less travel to the coast-to-coast travel of the other power conferences.

If the current B12 deal is $31 million per year, I have to think the reformed BE conference could get at least that with Fox already invested. No, we would not get B10/SEC money, but we could certainly shove the B12 aside as the new third best conference.

I am sick and tired, like everyone on this board, with mediocre schools telling us we don’t add value. Let’s form the only power conference that still has rivalries, and also has less than 2,000 miles of travel for golf. Let’s take back the BE, but make it better! In the new world of realignment, I think the hoops-only schools could get on board with keeping us, and forming such an elite basketball conference. With the uncertainty of who will get the remaining seats at the P3 if the ACC crumbles, I think this could be a win for ACC schools as well.

 

[NowInStorrs]

Why would the basketball only schools, who specifically left the Big East to control their own destiny away from football, agree to invite a bunch of football schools and form a weird hybrid conference again?

 

[NH Husky]

During the latest B12 snub, it was interesting to learn more about Yormark’s push to close the gap with the B10 and SEC with elite basketball. With the ACC potentially crumbling, why not have the BE reform as a power conference and raid the ACC? I think an improved version of the old BE would be more valuable than the current B12.

Let’s say the B10, B12, and SEC expand to 20 teams each in the next round of realignment (obviously a complete guess): that leaves about 8 seats in the P3 (after FSU and Clemson leave) for the remaining 15 ACC teams. The leverage the BE has now is that we are a better basketball conference than the ACC. Why not get the BE to pouch 9 of the 15 ACC teams left to form a 20-team hoops conference and a 10-team football conference. We could look at adding Army and Navy for football to add some value with regard to rivalries. We could have the best basketball conference in the country (beat the B12 at its own game), and have comperable to better football than the old BE.

Imagine Duke and Carolina in the BE, some of our old BE brethren back (and hopefully revitalized), but also with schools like Marquette and Creighton that were not here in the old BE. Imagine THAT conference at MSG. Imagine 14 schools making the NCAA tourney. With about half of hoops championships over the last 25 years, the BE would be the new conference of champions.

Let’s stop begging, and talk to the BE about this. Here are hypothetical new BE members:

Duke
North Carolina
Pitt
Syracuse
Louisville (if they don’t jump to the B12)
Virginia
NC State
Georgia Tech
Wake Forest

***We won’t let BC in, but will let them beg.

I know this is crazy, but this basketball conference would OWN recruiting east of the Mississippi. Recruits would pick MSG in March and much less travel to the coast-to-coast travel of the other power conferences.

If the current B12 deal is $31 million per year, I have to think the reformed BE conference could get at least that with Fox already invested. No, we would not get B10/SEC money, but we could certainly shove the B12 aside as the new third best conference.

I am sick and tired, like everyone on this board, with mediocre schools telling us we don’t add value. Let’s form the only power conference that still has rivalries, and also has less than 2,000 miles of travel for golf. Let’s take back the BE, but make it better! In the new world of realignment, I think the hoops-only schools could get on board with keeping us, and forming such an elite basketball conference. With the uncertainty of who will get the remaining seats at the P3 if the ACC crumbles, I think this could be a win for ACC schools as well.

I see the end result being similar to what you’re saying but I think it goes down a little different.
I believe the ACC is on much better footing than some folks are saying. I don’t think any ACC teams meet B1G expansion criteria. Since Nebraska, all their adds have been in major media markets. Oregon and Washington went in at half price probably to appease LA teams. If anything maybe Ga Tech (Atlanta).
Maybe FSU goes to SEC with OK St or Clemson. Louisville was brought in to appease them so I can see them jumping to B12 but who really cares? B12 equals Franken-conference.
What’s left in ACC easily has more football pedigree than B12 with some great rivalries. That ACC should look at grabbing some hot properties including basketball onlies and wrap up the Northeast Corridor. Would get much more attention than bringing the likes of UCF, Kansas State, and Utah into MSG. And easily the best hoops in the country.
I think UConn is well positioned and would be wise to be patient in navigating this process.
Also there’s much more parity than appears. Northern Illinois is the lowest revenue and lowest expense AD in the MAC and they just took down mighty Notre Dame. There will be lots of talent outside the P2. And this notion of paying college athletes will eventually run off the rails. What are they going to do when a 19 year old kid underperforms? Fire him?
I hear FSU got $15M in nil tied to their current team. Are people going to put up that money when programs perform like they are. And we’re talking about immature thinkers. Jealousy can easily throw a monkey wrench into any notion of team culture.

 

[NIT88]

I see the end result being similar to what you’re saying but I think it goes down a little different.
I believe the ACC is on much better footing than some folks are saying. I don’t think any ACC teams meet B1G expansion criteria. Since Nebraska, all their adds have been in major media markets. Oregon and Washington went in at half price probably to appease LA teams. If anything maybe Ga Tech (Atlanta).
Maybe FSU goes to SEC with OK St or Clemson. Louisville was brought in to appease them so I can see them jumping to B12 but who really cares? B12 equals Franken-conference.
What’s left in ACC easily has more football pedigree than B12 with some great rivalries. That ACC should look at grabbing some hot properties including basketball onlies and wrap up the Northeast Corridor. Would get much more attention than bringing the likes of UCF, Kansas State, and Utah into MSG. And easily the best hoops in the country.
I think UConn is well positioned and would be wise to be patient in navigating this process.
Also there’s much more parity than appears. Northern Illinois is the lowest revenue and lowest expense AD in the MAC and they just took down mighty Notre Dame. There will be lots of talent outside the P2. And this notion of paying college athletes will eventually run off the rails. What are they going to do when a 19 year old kid underperforms? Fire him?
I hear FSU got $15M in nil tied to their current team. Are people going to put up that money when programs perform like they are. And we’re talking about immature thinkers. Jealousy can easily throw a monkey wrench into any notion of team culture.

Excellent points. I do think, though, that if the ACC wants to shore up basketball on the emEast Coast if they lose teams, most of those teams are in the Big East (besides UConn). That may be where the. Ig East has leverage.

 

[WestCoastHusky]

Why would the basketball only schools, who specifically left the Big East to control their own destiny away from football, agree to invite a bunch of football schools and form a weird hybrid conference again?

In the new era, it is not far fetched that the Big East could lose its power status if it is not aligned with some football playing schools somehow.

 

[Platt81]

Why would the basketball only schools, who specifically left the Big East to control their own destiny away from football, agree to invite a bunch of football schools and form a weird hybrid conference again?

Only hypothetical I could see is if there’s some P4 break off where the teams are left behind when it comes to the tournament. Then they would maybe have to pivot back to a hybrid conference.

 

[hank970]

Why would the basketball only schools, who specifically left the Big East to control their own destiny away from football, agree to invite a bunch of football schools and form a weird hybrid conference again?

Because, according to the original poster, travel for golf teams would be optimized. That's a major priority for any power conference.

 

[ScottVib]

The other problem nearly all of the added schools plus UConn have more market value than any of the other Big East institutions.

If those schools were going to move to a new conference in a "raid" it would be that conference forming new and selecting whom they wanted (if anyone) out of the Big East.

 

[Sea Goat]

I submit that big BB schools are selling themselves short. BB's MM alone grosses $1.1b/yr now. We need to direct those proceeds to the performers (the schools), not the NCAA. If it could be done in FB with the CFP, it can be done in BB. Accomplish that and UConn will be the Alabama or Georgia of BB.

I have said forever that UConn gets a seat at any college BB table. We just need a table! We need a group of great BB schools (UNC, Duke, Kansas) to join us in this effort. I mention these three specifically because they're in the "poor cousin" conferences of the so-called P-4. They'll be lucky to make 1/2 of what P-2 members make. This is only possible if the BB powers (the schools) take control of BB as the FB powers took control of FB via CFP.

 

[stamfordhusky]

Why would the basketball only schools, who specifically left the Big East to control their own destiny away from football, agree to invite a bunch of football schools and form a weird hybrid conference again?

They wouldn't. Less than zero chance of this happening.

 

[NIT88]

They wouldn't. Less than zero chance of this happening.

It’s a completely different environment than it was when the BE broke up originally. Then, it was chaos with tons of movement and all if the conferences changing. Now, almost everything is settled, except for a few slots. I think the BB only schools could see a hybrid in a different way now. They already did by taking us back.

 

[NIT88]

It’s a completely different environment than it was when the BE broke up originally. Then, it was chaos with tons of movement and all if the conferences changing. Now, almost everything is settled, except for a few slots. I think the BB only schools could see a hybrid in a different way now. They already did by taking us back. If Syracuse, Pitt, etc. come back now and the ACC crumbles, where are they going to go now in the future? With the best basketball conference in the nation and no spots left in the SEC or B10, where else would anyone want to go other than the new, hybrid, BE conference? There would be no ACC to defect to?

 

[Kolumbo]

Crazy how Big East Football programs are now in the AAC, ACC, BiG Ten, Big XII and Indie. The original split was 11 years ago which is a long time in CR years. I've always thought the ACC might be interested in something like a SJU/Army and Georgetown/Navy addition. And UConn of course.

It is a crazy idea, and I think far more likely would be the ACC members inviting a few Big East Basketball programs or a merger between the ACC and Big East. The ACC programs are not going to give up ACC name and there are a few Big East programs they would probably like to leave behind. So much hinges on the ACC. They hold onto the 2031 GOR with a GI Joe Kung- grip or there's total chaos.

 

[ScottVib]

I think the BB only schools could see a hybrid in a different way now. They already did by taking us back.

They took UConn back because they needed too. UConn was the highest value program that the Big East could potentially add ahead of an upcoming TV negotiation. They also protected themselves by putting massive exit fees to handcuff UConn to the conference long enough to ensure they got the new TV deal. As long as the league/basketball schools has no involvement and makes no decisions based on football they don't care. That said, once you invite a critical mass of football schools (as happened in the 90s in the original Big East), suddenly football interests matter; which is what those schools want to avoid. It was football interests that threatened to force the basketball schools to associate with Tulane and ECU and thus prompted them to leave the original conference, otherwise the hybrid conference would've lived on.

Ultimately... the schools invitees you listed (in most cases) have the stronger basketball brands; they would be more likely if for some-reason they all left the ACC (or the league was dissolved) to create their own conference and then decide if they wanted any of the Big East basketball schools, leaving behind any that didn't add value or were too far afield for the regionality they wanted (if the ACC disappears it's likely UNC and UVA at a minimum from that list would be able to find a new P2 + Big XII home).

 

[John]

the idiot basketball schools in the conference would never agree to that.

 

[baggerbob]

the idiot basketball schools in the conference would never agree to that.

And the previous football schools would never join again unless they had control of approving all media deals.
It was the Catholic Schools majority that wouldn't approve the ESPN offer that caused the breakup of the old Big East.
So getting back together will never happen with the basketball schools in charge.

 

[Sea Goat]

And the previous football schools would never join again unless they had control of approving all media deals.
It was the Catholic Schools majority that wouldn't approve the ESPN offer that caused the breakup of the old Big East.
So getting back together will never happen with the basketball schools in charge.

It was back when the BE was run by the third straight former administrator from PC... How we let a small Catholic college with little marquis value and no football (or baseball!) run the old BE is beyond me.

 

[baggerbob]

It was back when the BE was run by the third straight former administrator from PC... How we let a small Catholic college with little marquis value and no football (or baseball!) run the old BE is beyond me.

And at the time the Big East was by far the better overall conference. In football and basketball.The records in the 80's and up through 2001, the Big East football, and basketball was better then the ACC, SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and the Pac 10. They would have been the ones to add schools at that time.