Can UConn "toughen up"?

[bags27]

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

 

[Los24]

I agree, this is the one true area that concerns me for a NC. This is how MSST won. It's a combination of things with physical play being the root. Last year I think they mentally struggled in the MSST game in terms of adjusting to the (level and type of) play and some players being somewhat intimidated to the style.

However, it also disrupted their offensive flow where they frankly get so many easy looks/baskets. I wrote in another thread the UCF game was way more beneficial than the USF game. That said, we also can admit most teams win in single digits most nights, UCF plays a style that leads to low scoring and despite our concerns, the game was never really close in the second half.

 

[oldude]

I have a slightly different take on this subject. It’s not necessarily playing a more physical brand of basketball, but how you respond to a team that plays a more physical brand of basketball.

As a number of BY’ers, as well as Geno, have pointed out, UConn’s defense vs UCF was good the entire game, holding the Knights to only 44 pts. Also worth noting that UConn did not foul much at all, sending UCF to the line just 3 times in the game.

In the 1st half, where UConn fell short was shooting the ball. The Huskies missed countless open shots as well as a bunch of free throws. Some have suggested, and I agree, when you’re faced with an aggressive defense, sometimes you rush shots and the pressure builds until it’s like there’s a lid on the basket.

If UConn just made a reasonable percentage of those shots in the 1st half, they’re up 20+ and nobody’s really concerned. In the 2nd half, with no warmup, the Huskies shoot 64% and pull away from the Knights.

 

[CMC'72]

It’s not necessarily playing a more physical brand of basketball, but how you respond to a team that plays a more physical brand of basketball.

Triple like, to quote JordyG.

 

[bags27]

I have a slightly different take on this subject. It’s not necessarily playing a more physical brand of basketball, but how you respond to a team that plays a more physical brand of basketball.

As a number of BY’ers, as well as Geno, have pointed out, UConn’s defense vs UCF was good the entire game, holding the Knights to only 44 pts. Also worth noting that UConn did not foul much at all, sending UCF to the line just 3 times in the game.

In the 1st half, where UConn fell short was shooting the ball. The Huskies missed countless open shots as well as a bunch of free throws. Some have suggested, and I agree, when you’re faced with an aggressive defense, sometimes you rush shots and the pressure builds until it’s like there’s a lid on the basket.

If UConn just made a reasonable percentage of those shots in the 1st half, they’re up 20+ and nobody’s really concerned. In the 2nd half, with no warmup, the Huskies shoot 64% and pull away from the Knights.

Great point, oldude. Making open shots and also bunnies while possibly anticipating a hit is part of playing tougher, I think, but not the way I thought of it above. I really appreciate this insight.

 

[ricky]

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

Agreed Collier is finesse for sure but usually scores after a big hit. She loves it that way. She was ready to throw down after that horse color tackle and it wouldn't have taken much. But she made the shot anyway. She makes more big shots after contact than most make all game.
Collier is finesse

 

[eebmg]

To me, it's all about mental toughness. Embrace that no matter how the game is called or how poorly the shots are falling or even a poor patch of play, we can reset. I never really understood why player's argue to refs. If both sides are being called evenly, great. If it is an issue of unfairness, leave it to the bench to fight for you. Nothing is as intimidating to the opposition as handling anything they can throw at you without complaint.

 

[huskeynut]

If you watch a UConn game in person you will see that UConn is a physical team under the boards. They bang just as good, if not better than UCF.

Gabby and Pheesa get hit every time they go down low. And so does Lou and Z. Let's not make more of the UCF game than needed.

 

[UcMiami]

Like the OP but especially like oldude's response. None of the five returning starters are dealing with anything that they haven's seen for at least the last year and a half - not sure if Z dealt with the same level during her Duke years, but think when it got physical she probably just drifted further from the basket during those years.

What I saw in the first half was more a team sleep walking through the game - the number of times a Uconn player allowed a ball to slip through their hands or dribbled one off their foot was not 'standard' - passes were lazy and slow, open players were ignored in favor of contested shots or stupid drives, and of course the shots didn't fall. It was a mess and I thought it had little to do with UCF or the refs. I thought Danger had one of her worst halves of basketball specifically because she did nothing as the PG to right the ship and was as out of sync as everyone else.

And I didn't think Uconn played a more physical brand of basketball in the second half, they just played much smarter and in a much more coordinated way.

These games happen occasionally for Uconn, like once or twice a year (Tulane, anyone?) We are spoiled that they are so infrequent and that usually the rot is only evident for part of a game, and that Uconn is so much better than most of their competition that even if it is present for most of a game they still win.Only rarely does Uconn have a 'St John's' game or a 'Stanford' game.

 

[Carnac]

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

Be careful in desiring a player to change their style and manner of play. Most of these girls have been playing competitive basketball for 10 years or more. They've developed a style and manner they are comfortable with.

Asking or mandating that they all of a sudden get tough, or add a rough edge to their game may be bridge too far. You're asking them to perform outside their normal comfort zone, which may effect their concentration and or focus. It may be difficult for a "finesse" player to turn into a bully or an enforcer, and maintain their level of production and effectiveness.

Most players will respond in kind with rough and aggressive play when compelled to do so. From peer pressure if nothing else.

 

[HuskylnSC]

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

It's called hack a Husky

 

[LasVegasYank]

If she's not already in foul trouble, send in Gabby Loscutof.

 

[bags27]

If she's not already in foul trouble, send in Gabby Loscutof.

I'm an old Philadelphia Warriors fan and when we'd see Red sent in Jungle Jim we'd know there'd be 6 fouls in 10 minutes.

 

[bramos]

If she's not already in foul trouble, send in Gabby Loscutof.

Nice reach..Jungle Jim Loscutoff , Univ of Oregon and Boston Celtic. Physical and fierce competitor. and had fun playing. Gabby could be a direct descendant.

 

[Bronxjeff]

The game continues to evolve through the years to accommodate developing styles of play, mainly more athletic play.

I think it’s interesting to note that of the original 13 rules of the game, number five was way tougher on minimizing contact than today:

5. No shouldering, holding, pushing, tripping, or striking in any way the person of an opponent shall be allowed; the first infringement of this rule by any player shall count as a foul, the second shall disqualify him until the next goal is made, or, if there was evident intent to injure the person, for the whole of the game, no substitute allowed.

Two fouls in a row and you are playing four on five!

I responded on another thread that I believe the UCF team kept their physical play within acceptable levels and actually gave us a pretty good game. It does seem that refs often favor the underdog, but you have to allow for human nature and our own perceptual bias.

 

[BroadwayVa]

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

Tough? Can you tell me one player Tougher than KLS?? Mentally and Physically--gimping on a bad wing, Vomiting between plays---I'd take an arm y of her.
Morally, spiritually--it hurts the mind and soul, of some, to have the RULEs so violated--

Uconn, this particular team saw this "game" at least 3 or more times last season--and worked hard to win. That my friends is toughness. They will see this again and again. It is well known, take Uconn out of "sync" and the game gets closer. Close for many team is a victory.
You can bet today and tomorrow and some Sat Geno will be using his practice player as "abuser", bump, push, pull, tackle, --he has in the past used a pad for his frosh to take a layup while being hit. I would believe he'd used the punch pad in many ways.
Molly is a tough young woman, make no mistake--her confident issue is apparently on the wane.

 

[paisan]

To me, it's all about mental toughness. Embrace that no matter how the game is called or how poorly the shots are falling or even a poor patch of play, we can reset. I never really understood why player's argue to refs. If both sides are being called evenly, great. If it is an issue of unfairness, leave it to the bench to fight for you. Nothing is as intimidating to the opposition as handling anything they can throw at you without complaint.

I disagree..you need to respond if the play gets dirty. To me that's like saying just be nice to the bully and h will leave you alone.

 

[BroadwayVa]

I have a slightly different take on this subject. It’s not necessarily playing a more physical brand of basketball, but how you respond to a team that plays a more physical brand of basketball.

As a number of BY’ers, as well as Geno, have pointed out, UConn’s defense vs UCF was good the entire game, holding the Knights to only 44 pts. Also worth noting that UConn did not foul much at all, sending UCF to the line just 3 times in the game.

In the 1st half, where UConn fell short was shooting the ball. The Huskies missed countless open shots as well as a bunch of free throws. Some have suggested, and I agree, when you’re faced with an aggressive defense, sometimes you rush shots and the pressure builds until it’s like there’s a lid on the basket.

If UConn just made a reasonable percentage of those shots in the 1st half, they’re up 20+ and nobody’s really concerned. In the 2nd half, with no warmup, the Huskies shoot 64% and pull away from the Knights.

Uconn has previously, last season, been taken out of "sync", ie in the CF game rushed shots, took bad shots, shot too soon in the position, all due to CF 's great game play of helter skelter, foul at every opportunity, allow no easy shots, accept the foul not the shot---The second half, they had time to understand what was happening to themselves--and got mentally back into "their game".

 

[Blueballer]

UConn didn't play great in the first half of the UCF game, but played well in the second half. Geno was all smiles at the end, while still treating himself to a half-time pasting of his club. A win-win, I guess.

The claim is that UCF played physical ball, the referees swallowed their whistles, and UConn just whined (at least in the first half). In fact, any half-way decent team more than 7 players deep would be nuts not to hold, lean on, and hack UConn, just daring the refs to make the call. (What the Patriots did to the Rams in the 2002 Superbowl, what the Falcons did to the Patriots last year.)

This is a team built on finesse. No team in WCBB comes close to its "show time" when it's allowed to play its game, as it did against USF. This is not a team that naturally gets physical. Compare it to the 2012 team with Kelly Faris, Stef Dolson, KML, and of course Kiah Stokes. That team could punch you in the mouth while shaking your hand and wishing you good luck in the game.

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid). We thought Batouly would play hard underneath, but, if so, certainly not this year. Kyla has the build, but so far not the will. Meg might be, but is still working on establishing herself. Molly is only right now beginning not to play scared, but I suspect she will end up tough.

If UConn is to be ready to play tough, those male practice players need to lay it on the starters sometimes. UConn might consider the UCF game fair warning.

From where I was sitting it was a more than just a claim. I don't see a problem going forward as long as Kantner remembers it isn't a football game.

 

[Roger G]

One thing I saw at the USF game that those watching on TV probably didn't get a chance to see was Katie Lou pushing Flores in the corner up high. It seemed that she pushed Flores' arms back into her face, as if saying, get out of here kid, you're bugging me. Flores turned to the ref as if to say, didn't you see what she just did to me? It was a move by KLS that said to me, she ain't getting pushed around.

But in the UCF game, I basically agree with Old Dude. They missed a lot of shots. I predicted it in the prognostications thread, though I thought they would be able to get more transition buckets or at least easy buckets in the paint. But how many times do you see when a player is hitting everything in sight one game that the next game they seem to be just a tad overconfident which leads to a touch less focus and suddenly they can't get anything to fall. I know how often that has happened to me. And they were coming off the USF game in which everything seemed to be falling for everyone. Hence, a monumental collapse in shooting quality follows. So, as Old Dude said, we wouldn't be talking about UConn's toughness if they were making shots like they usually do.

 

[Bigboote]

Can this team become more physical? Kia, Crystal and Z are, I think, up for playing hard if necessary. I'd keep Gabby out of it: she fouls too much. Pheesa and Lou are pure finesse (Pheesa is too mellow and no matter how tough Lou is, she's a play-by-the rules kid).

I'd say Z is not comfortable banging yet. She was strictly a perimeter player at Duke and she still looks uncomfortable to me banging in the middle.

With respect to Collier, finesse and lack of physicality are not mutually exclusive. How do you think she gets so close to the basket when being closely guarded by bigger players? It's not by being passive; she's quite physical and comfortable with hard contact.

 

[Hope]

UCF has players who can get into the paint and "stop-and-pop." Nowhere as good as Courtney Williams, but a determined player with a good jump shot is almost impossible to stop.

Crystal and Lou have demonstrated some good "short-jumpers" recently. They need to do this more often.