Can One Player Win a Championship All By Themselves?

[meyers7]

There’s a lot of ways to look at the question. If I had to win one game for all the marbles, I would have Paige running my team over Clark. It’s a close call to be sure, and it comes with the assumption that both players are healthy. But that’s my choice.

Sure, but which Bueckers, which Clark. Freshman Bueckers, Jr Bueckers (sitting on the sidelines)? Freshman Clark, Jr Clark against S. Carolina?

I assume you'd want a Bueckers that wasn't injured, correct? And that's the point.

You can't just pick a moment in time athlete when comparing athletes for greatness or GOATness. Heck I'd take any pitcher who pitched a perfect game. But not all or them are in the HOF......because it was just a moment in time. I know that gets away from injuries a bit, but it's kind of the same point. Gotta play to be great. (gotta win too, but that's another argument in another thread )

 

[oldude]

Sure, but which Bueckers, which Clark. Freshman Bueckers, Jr Bueckers (sitting on the sidelines)? Freshman Clark, Jr Clark against S. Carolina?

I assume you'd want a Bueckers that wasn't injured, correct? And that's the point.

You can't just pick a moment in time athlete when comparing athletes for greatness or GOATness. Heck I'd take any pitcher who pitched a perfect game. But not all or them are in the HOF......because it was just a moment in time. I know that gets away from injuries a bit, but it's kind of the same point. Gotta play to be great. (gotta win too, but that's another argument in another thread )

Well, if I have to choose, I’ll take freshman, sophomore or senior Bueckers over Clark….

 

[wingsfan055]

Didnt Geno answer this question recently. He mentioned DT. DT in her senior year carried the team to a Title that it had no business winning based on overall team talent.

 

[meyers7]

Didnt Geno answer this question recently. He mentioned DT. DT in her senior year carried the team to a Title that it had no business winning based on overall team talent.

I think it was more her Jr year. I don't know anyone who thought UCONN had a chance to win a NC the year after Bird, Williams, Cash, Jones left.

At least her Sr year, they had already won it with the same group. The problem that year was DT was hurting so much.

 

[JellyBean]

The best example that I can think of as to whether one player can lead a team to a championship is 1979's Larry Bird's Indiana State team against Magic Johnson & Greg Kelser's Michigan State team. Although Bird single-handedly led his team over a great Depaul team in the semi-finals that featured Mark Aguirre, Terry Cummings and Clyde Bradshaw, he was not enough to carry his team to victory in the finals. Much like Miss St ending UConn's undefeated streak in 2016, they had nothing left for SC. The same script was written for Iowa yesterday. The tank was emptied Friday night.

I loved Geno's comments about being able to coach Paige for an entire season. Yes, UConn will be blessed with talent next season, but Geno unabashedly expresses his feelings about what Paige brings to the table. Like Oldude, I am anxiously awaiting the Paige Beuckers Redemption Tour next season.

I also thought it was interesting to hear Sue Bird state that Paige knows that people have forgotten about her this past season. We know that Paige is a competitor and at times, she had that look of helplessness on the bench watching the games. The fact that she is able to slowly rehab (13-month period before an official game) has me feeling confident for the upcoming season.

Most projections of who are the top incoming freshmen usually has some misses and surprises. I'd say the class of 2020 was spot on. The top 5 in order was Paige, Angel Reese, Cameron Brink, Caitlin Clark and Karmilla Cardosa. After 3 years, Brink, Cardosa and now Reese have won a NC. In 2024, there will be a new addition to this club, and I am pretty certain it won't be Caitlin Clark.

I remember that game, like it was yesterday. Plus, YouTube has that game (Indiana State vs DePaul). Great game.

 

[Surly1]

If you often watched Caitlin play, Oldude, you'd have seen Caitlin's mid-range game, her running one-handers and all sorts of other shots to complement her three-pointers. She's every bit the match for Paige there.

I'll definitely agree Paige is the better defender, not because Clark doesn't play D, but because Paige had become excellent at it before her last injury.

As for your taking Paige over Caitlin every day of the week, I hope we have the real-life opportunity to compare them again. For now, it's what Clark does every game against what we hope Paige will be able to do again... my fingers are crossed.

Deacon, I have to side with oldude on this. Caitlin is the best long-range, step-back shooter in the game. Her court vision has improved where she's equal or if not has exceeded Paige. I would state that Azzi is a better catch and shoot 3-pt shooter, but they may be due to Clark usually having the ball in her hands. However, I strongly disagree that Clark's mid-range and pull-up jumper is equal to Paige's. There is not another player close to Paige in this regard. It is aching of beauty and form. Not to mention I am shock when she misses.

The other reason I would prefer Paige over Clark is Clark's penchant for turnovers. In the last 3 games of the tourney, she forced a lot of passes that gave away possessions. This happened to be one of UConn's undoing this season. One of the major reasons that Geno always wants Paige on the court is how she protects the ball and manages the flow of the game.

The one area that I would like to see Clark improve for next year is to be more judicious in making the "mouth-drop" pass. There are times to pick your moments. However, she has so many plusses that I almost hesitate to mention finding an area of improvement for her.

Picking Paige over Clark is not a slight. I am an absolute fan of her and the difference between the two is minimal. If anything, I'd like to see a more selfish Paige and look forward to many epic battles between the two of them in the WNBA.

 

[baggerbob]

To be a 3 tier scorer you have to be able to take it to the rim.There is no way Paige drives to the rim like Caitlin..not even close..Paige may have been at Clark's level 2 years ago but Clark showed the world how good she is during this tournament ..next year it will be 3 years since Paige won the NPOY award and last year missed half the year an missed all of this year..Clark has improved every year and stands alone in WCBB..Paige has a lot to prove next year to get to Clark's level..not to mention most people believe it takes 2 years to get back to what a player was before tearing an ACL.. Besides..for Paige to show she is equal to Caitlin she has to stay on the court..the last 2 years she hasn't been able to

Come back in 2 years when Clark is in the WNBA, you don't continually take it to the rim there. Not even Stewie, EDD, A'ja, JJ or Parker continually do that. Four of those 5 are a 3 tier scorers.
On top of that they all play great defense, something Clark will have to learn.
Iowa just tries to outscore you, and plays limited defense.
They also have a defensive 3 second rule which would have changed the Iowa defense against South Carolina.

 

[Mandoo]

It's amazing to me how some here who had started to recognize Clark's greatness have now, because LSU shot lights out against the Hawkeyes, retreated to earlier stances, and feel Paige has an edge on Caitlin as a point guard and leader of her team.

Please tell me Clark hasn't been amazingly good at knowing when to take over games all season, against a tough schedule? Has anyone ever had a better NCAA tournament (maybe Sheryl Swoopes?)?

What Paige did vs. NC State was absolutely wonderful in '22, but it didn't touch what Caitlin just did vs. South Carolina. Clark assisted 10 baskets by her teammates, and finally carried the load down the stretch when it became apparent she had to. And yesterday, LSA simply blitzed the Hawkeyes off the court in the first half and Caitlin was famously dogged by foul trouble.

I've watched Clark play many games over the past three years and she's getting better and better at managing her own game and that of the team. As a reminder, she has been doing that with lesser quality teammates than Paige has had around her.

I saw that Clark was not a great percentage shooter. Likely better from 3 than from 2. Great on assists and rebounds, she ALWAYS has the ball.

 

[The deacon]

I saw that Clark was not a great percentage shooter. Likely better from 3 than from 2. Great on assists and rebounds, she ALWAYS has the ball.

I've stayed away from this thread for a couple of days because it had become too much Paige vs. Caitlin. Paige might be my favorite college player ever, so it hurts to keep stating the very obvious reality that she hasn't been on the court enough to even compare with Caitlin at this point. Some day again, maybe? As I've said often, I'm hoping, as we all are. But those of you who say you'd take Paige over Caitlin now aren't being logical. Perhaps Paige at her very best, but will we ever see that again? Again, we can hope...

By the way, Mandoo, Caitlin shot 39 percent from three and 47 percent overall from the floor (plus 84 percent from the free throw line). Those are very respectable numbers, especially considering the defensive pressure she usually encounters.

Enough from me...