Board hate for Shirreffs | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Board hate for Shirreffs

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HuskyHawk said:
This is where we diverge. I see Verducci doing exactly this. I see the TEs wide open all the time, they never get the ball. I see secondary WRs open, they don't get the ball. I see RBs release and get open, and unless it was a called screen, they don't get the ball.

My complaint with Bryant is that he doesn't seem to be able to read defenses, and he doesn't throw to the open receiver. I don't think it's a solution for the coaches to call Mayala's number as a primary option x times per game. Even when it works, as it did on the seam route to Newsome against USF, it isn't the solution because we are too easy to defend unless the opponent has to defend everyone. It was amazing how much better the UCF true freshman was at that aspect of the game.

Here is another nit. What is with sticking your arm straight out immediately after the snap on every hand-off? He telegraphs that it's a running play way too early. It's maddening and really eliminates the play action. Can't they see this on film? Is someone coaching him to do that?
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BS is all heart, all effort and I love it. It just maybe that he cannot be coached past his ceiling. He doesn't have great field vision, has a slow delivery, needs to throw with two feet planted squarely and never extends passing plays by scrambling to throw, but rather scrambling to run. He also tends to force the ball on special plays into double coverage instead of finding option two. The kid is easy to love, tries his best, but it maybe this is all he can do.
 
Exit 4 said:
BS is all heart, all effort and I love it. It just maybe that he cannot be coached past his ceiling. He doesn't have great field vision, has a slow delivery, needs to throw with two feet planted squarely and never extends passing plays by scrambling to throw, but rather scrambling to run. He also tends to force the ball on special plays into double coverage instead of finding option two. The kid is easy to love, tries his best, but it maybe this is all he can do.
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I think that's probably fair. He's a gamer and I love his courage and effort. The word I think is missing is "dynamic". This team, such as it is, needs a little bit of flash. It needs plays like that crazy 3rd and long, run around for 10 seconds and complete a floater into the wind that UCF got to bail themselves out in the 3rd. That play turned the game as much as any. Utterly deflating for the D.

BS is doing a better job of not taking off running too early. But when he does need to move, even just to side-step the rush, he then can't seem to throw. We desperately need someone who can turn those situations into big plays.
 
SAMCRO said:
No one "hates" BS, and I'm betting all appreciate his effort, and not questioning his heart/desire. What most of the critics are saying, and I agree with this, is he's not a great QB. He can make the shorter, quicker throws most of the time, but struggles with the medium to long balls. He regularly overthrows open WR's, or doesn't notice open WR's all together b/c it appears he's decided where he's throwing the ball before the snap. He's serviceable, but he's not getting us over the hump.

With that said Diaco/Verducci are trying to fit square pegs into round holes. They're running the offence they WANT to have without having the personnel to execute it. As mentioned in earlier posts, if Diaco and Verducci would game plan to the players abilities we'd actually be okay (probably 6-2 or 5-3 right now - UH and USF were loses regardless, but Navy, SU, and UCF all winnable games)... but they don't... they have convinced themselves that we can line up behind our OL and knock the opposing DL off the ball to get 2-4 yards at will, or that we can consistently pass protect with a stationary pocket.... we can't... so stop trying to. What's more frustrating is they've actually demonstrated they can do it... going back to the 'almost' come back v Navy, we were creative, we mixed things up, we moved the pocket, and it worked... and then we got to the goal line and they wet themselves in the clock management and play calling department.

I really hope we get it together, but based on all I've seen so far I think we've got at best 1 winnable game left this year, and unfortunately it is Tulane (and coming off a loss at BC and riding a 5 game losing streak it will be in front of maybe 10,000 fans... at best).
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Well put on BS
 
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Honestly, I'm to the point, I think he's awful.

I understand the O-line isn't great, but he has had several plays with protection and made lousy reads and/or throws.

He can't run whatsoever.

He may be our best option. I just want to see if Williams can play.

No one remotely questions his effort, he should have listened to the NCST coaches 4 years ago.


amory said:
He's fine. I like Shirreffs. But he's very much the QB of a 3-5 team. Is it his fault when we lose? No, but he's also not good enough to win us a game with his play.
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politics said:
This is what drives me nuts. Shirreffs has comp rate of 59.3 percent this year and is 60-plus for career. UConn had trouble topping 50 pct post-Orlovsky until BS took over.
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UConn has had a long line of very bad college QBs post DO, just because BS may be better than the majority of them does not make him good. Just because he is the tallest jockey does not make him tall.

BS is not UConn's only problem, but he is a huge reason this team has the record it does.
 
Why is tough as nails synonymous with being as dumb as a rock? Just leave it at that.
 
JSM1970 said:
He can't run whatsoever.
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This is the single most outrageously stupid and factually wrong statement you have made. He's run for 413 pre-sack yards and is among the most mobile QBs UConn has had.

Now, if you'd like to be a little more nuanced, and say he doesn't have the escapability or a slipperiness of a Tarkenton, Archie Manning or the kid from UCF, I will be the first to agree with you. But , don't say he can't run "whatsoever". North-south counts as much as east-west.

Here's the ncaa total offense leaders as of last week. He's 40th. I'd say he'd be more than a few spots higher with a freaking competent 21st century offensive coordinator and a line that wasn't 98th in sacks allowed. And I'll save you the trouble on the last number. BS has run into a couple of sacks, yes, but he's also been able to get out of far more than his share.

http://web1.ncaa.org/stats/StatsSrv...emicYear=2017&rptType=PDF&doWhat=showrankings
 
He can't run, I don't know what you're watching. He isn't fast or elusive whatsoever.

He isn't an accurate passer past 10 years and can make 1 read.

I would just like to see Williams get a chance, what is the harm? Best case is we go 2-2 with BS and have a losing record anyway.



politics said:
This is the single most outrageously stupid and factually wrong statement you have made. He's run for 413 pre-sack yards and is among the most mobile QBs UConn has had.

Now, if you'd like to be a little more nuanced, and say he doesn't have the escapability or a slipperiness of a Tarkenton, Archie Manning or the kid from UCF, I will be the first to agree with you. But , don't say he can't run "whatsoever". North-south counts as much as east-west.

Here's the ncaa total offense leaders as of last week. He's 40th. I'd say he'd be more than a few spots higher with a freaking competent 21st century offensive coordinator and a line that wasn't 98th in sacks allowed. And I'll save you the trouble on the last number. BS has run into a couple of sacks, yes, but he's also been able to get out of far more than his share.

http://web1.ncaa.org/stats/StatsSrv...emicYear=2017&rptType=PDF&doWhat=showrankings
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JSM1970 said:
He can't run, I don't know what you're watching. He isn't fast or elusive whatsoever.

He isn't an accurate passer past 10 years and can make 1 read.

I would just like to see Williams get a chance, what is the harm? Best case is we go 2-2 with BS and have a losing record anyway.
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Dude you lose your credibility when you talk about burning a redshirt 2/3 of the way through the season w/no conference title on the line.

Serious question: are you basing your observations from watching on TV or live at the game?
 
politics said:
Dude you lose your credibility when you talk about burning a redshirt 2/3 of the way through the season w/no conference title on the line.

Serious question: are you basing your observations from watching on TV or live at the game?
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Why not burn it? We've got another QB coming in to RS next year, and more on the way. BS is only a Junior, so what's the harm in letting Williams get real game experience? At a minimum, he's the backup next year, and you've got no experienced backup as we do with Anderson now. I don't really like that situation. Maybe the kid will be electric and invigorate the team and fans. What on earth do they have to lose?
 
HuskyHawk said:
Why not burn it? We've got another QB coming in to RS next year, and more on the way. BS is only a Junior, so what's the harm in letting Williams get real game experience? At a minimum, he's the backup next year, and you've got no experienced backup as we do with Anderson now. I don't really like that situation. Maybe the kid will be electric and invigorate the team and fans. What on earth do they have to lose?
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Winning programs can redshirt, losing programs cannot afford redshirts. Look at Milton, he was fantastic for a true frosh. Williams should get reps with the first team the next few weeks and if he shows something, then he plays. If he doesn't show it in practice, then maybe you wait.
 
JSM1970 said:
He can't run whatsoever.
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politics said:
This is the single most outrageously stupid and factually wrong statement you have made.
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Rushing stats according to ESPN, I've plucked out just the QBs ...
RK PLAYER TEAM ATT YDS YDS/A LONG TD
8 Lamar Jackson, QB LOU 130 908 7.0 72 16
21 Quinton Flowers, QB USF 108 745 6.9 54 8
45 Nick Holley, QB KENT 136 631 4.6 67 8
69 Nick Fitzgerald, QB MSST 96 538 5.6 74 4
75 Trevor Knight, QB TA&M 78 526 6.7 62 9
79 Jalen Hurts, QB ALA 95 521 5.5 45 9
87 Ahmad Bradshaw, QB ARMY 105 496 4.7 60 4
90 Will Worth, QB NAVY 133 489 3.7 31 9
92 Brandon Dawkins, QB ARIZ 63 484 7.7 79 8
100 Anthony Maddie, QB NIU 68 465 6.8 75 6
106 J.T. Barrett, QB OSU 108 460 4.3 27 6
132 Greg Ward Jr., QB HOU 122 417 3.4 33 6
132 Jerod Evans, QB VT 85 417 4.9 55 3
150 Kevin Ellison, QB GASO 91 387 4.3 58 3
155 Tommy Armstrong Jr., QB NEB 81 380 4.7 37 6
162 Taysom Hill, QB BYU 93 372 4.0 39 5
163 Jesse Ertz, QB KSU 72 371 5.2 40 6
170 Dalton Sneed, QB UNLV 53 360 6.8 91 1
173 Greg Windham, QB OHIO 78 350 4.5 53 3
187 Lamar Jordan, QB UNM 61 333 5.5 52 1
203 Riley Neal, QB BALL 85 314 3.7 46 6
207 Garrett Smith, QB ULM 60 308 5.1 53 3
213 Hasaan Klugh, QB NCAT 56 303 5.4 39 4
215 Seth Russell, QB BAY 52 302 5.8 29 5
221 John Wolford, QB WAKE 68 296 4.4 37 5
223 Favian Upshaw, QB GASO 53 295 5.6 33 2
224 Joshua Dobbs, QB TENN 89 293 3.3 40 5
225 Eric Dungey, QB SYR 121 289 2.4 31 6
227 Tyree Jackson, QB BUFF 69 288 4.2 22 3
230 DeShone Kizer, QB ND 78 285 3.7 49 7
232 Justin Thomas, QB GT 80 284 3.6 58 3
233 Patrick Towles, QB BC 64 283 4.4 75 4
237 Bryant Shirreffs, QB CONN 130 280 2.2 35 2
238 Deshaun Watson, QB CLEM 71 279 3.9 23 1
241 Josh Allen, QB WYO 69 278 4.0 32 5

... I found a QB with an average lower than 2.2 yds/att
376 Troy Williams, QB UTAH 68 145 2.1 24 5
 
politics said:
Dude you lose your credibility when you talk about burning a redshirt 2/3 of the way through the season w/no conference title on the line.

Serious question: are you basing your observations from watching on TV or live at the game?
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If a player can help the team the coach has a responsibility to play him.

That's one reason I don't understand 2-10 leaving guys like Skanes on the bench. He raved about him and called him electric during camp.

So, apparently he doesn't see the need for an electric player on this year's team.
 
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Palatine said:
That's one reason I don't understand 2-10 leaving guys like Skanes on the bench. He raved about him and called him electric during camp. So, apparently he doesn't see the need for an electric player on this year's team.
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Being "electric" and being able to withstand weekly D1 physicality coming out of high school are two different things - no?.
 
huskymedic said:
Being "electric" and being able to withstand weekly D1 physicality coming out of high school are two different things - no?.
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Umm...like the 170 pound kid playing for UCF last week? Who played against that *top* Hawaii competition in HS? :rolleyes:

Donovan Williams: Height / Weight: 6-4 / 215. Played HS ball in Virginia.
 
tiger8mush said:
Rushing stats according to ESPN, I've plucked out just the QBs ...
RK PLAYER TEAM ATT YDS YDS/A LONG TD
8 Lamar Jackson, QB LOU 130 908 7.0 72 16
21 Quinton Flowers, QB USF 108 745 6.9 54 8
45 Nick Holley, QB KENT 136 631 4.6 67 8
69 Nick Fitzgerald, QB MSST 96 538 5.6 74 4
75 Trevor Knight, QB TA&M 78 526 6.7 62 9
79 Jalen Hurts, QB ALA 95 521 5.5 45 9
87 Ahmad Bradshaw, QB ARMY 105 496 4.7 60 4
90 Will Worth, QB NAVY 133 489 3.7 31 9
92 Brandon Dawkins, QB ARIZ 63 484 7.7 79 8
100 Anthony Maddie, QB NIU 68 465 6.8 75 6
106 J.T. Barrett, QB OSU 108 460 4.3 27 6
132 Greg Ward Jr., QB HOU 122 417 3.4 33 6
132 Jerod Evans, QB VT 85 417 4.9 55 3
150 Kevin Ellison, QB GASO 91 387 4.3 58 3
155 Tommy Armstrong Jr., QB NEB 81 380 4.7 37 6
162 Taysom Hill, QB BYU 93 372 4.0 39 5
163 Jesse Ertz, QB KSU 72 371 5.2 40 6
170 Dalton Sneed, QB UNLV 53 360 6.8 91 1
173 Greg Windham, QB OHIO 78 350 4.5 53 3
187 Lamar Jordan, QB UNM 61 333 5.5 52 1
203 Riley Neal, QB BALL 85 314 3.7 46 6
207 Garrett Smith, QB ULM 60 308 5.1 53 3
213 Hasaan Klugh, QB NCAT 56 303 5.4 39 4
215 Seth Russell, QB BAY 52 302 5.8 29 5
221 John Wolford, QB WAKE 68 296 4.4 37 5
223 Favian Upshaw, QB GASO 53 295 5.6 33 2
224 Joshua Dobbs, QB TENN 89 293 3.3 40 5
225 Eric Dungey, QB SYR 121 289 2.4 31 6
227 Tyree Jackson, QB BUFF 69 288 4.2 22 3
230 DeShone Kizer, QB ND 78 285 3.7 49 7
232 Justin Thomas, QB GT 80 284 3.6 58 3
233 Patrick Towles, QB BC 64 283 4.4 75 4
237 Bryant Shirreffs, QB CONN 130 280 2.2 35 2
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I can play this game too. Sacks allowed rankings (per game)

Louisville 45
USF 38
Kent State 118 (Holley a running QB, btw seems like an Edelman clone)
Miss State 45 (tied w/Louisville)
TAMU 29
Bama 53 (?!?!?!?!?!)
Army 3 (obv pure runner)
Navy 80 (also an outlier b/c running QB)
Arizona 29
No. Ill. 11
TOSU 29 (tie)
Houston 74
Va Tech 29 (tie)
Ga. Southern 24
Nebraska 7
BYU 74
KSU 78
Tenn 83
Syra 106 (Dungey avg. gain 2.4, BS 2.2)
Buff 16
ND 101 (bye bye Kelly)
Ga. Tech 29 (option team like Navy, Army)
BC 16
UConn 98

give BS even moderately better protection (or throw to a tight end once in a while on a quick hitter) and he's in the middle of that chart.

Oh, by the way, UConn is tied for first with Paul "triple-option master" Johnson's Georgia Tech for fewest Red Zone TD passes in the country -- 1 (in 23 red zone trips) . Such passing juggernauts as Army, Navy, Georgia Southern have more. Y'all wanna pin that on BS, too?
 
politics said:
I can play this game too. Sacks allowed rankings (per game)

Louisville 45
USF 38
Kent State 118 (Holley a running QB, btw seems like an Edelman clone)
Miss State 45 (tied w/Louisville)
TAMU 29
Bama 53 (?!?!?!?!?!)
Army 3 (obv pure runner)
Navy 80 (also an outlier b/c running QB)
Arizona 29
No. Ill. 11
TOSU 29 (tie)
Houston 74
Va Tech 29 (tie)
Ga. Southern 24
Nebraska 7
BYU 74
KSU 78
Tenn 83
Syra 106 (Dungey avg. gain 2.4, BS 2.2)
Buff 16
ND 101 (bye bye Kelly)
Ga. Tech 29 (option team like Navy, Army)
BC 16
UConn 98

give BS even moderately better protection (or throw to a tight end once in a while on a quick hitter) and he's in the middle of that chart.

Oh, by the way, UConn is tied for first with Paul "triple-option master" Johnson's Georgia Tech for fewest Red Zone TD passes in the country -- 1 (in 23 red zone trips) . Such passing juggernauts as Army, Navy, Georgia Southern have more. Y'all wanna pin that on BS, too?
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Credit to BS, many of those sacks are his runs for losses. So our yards lost per sack are quite low compared to others.
UConn 8 games 21 sacks 119yrds 2.63
 
On the last possession against UCF, yes. Those were as bad as reads and throws you'll see in a football game.

politics said:
Oh, by the way, UConn is tied for first with Paul "triple-option master" Johnson's Georgia Tech for fewest Red Zone TD passes in the country -- 1 (in 23 red zone trips) . Such passing juggernauts as Army, Navy, Georgia Southern have more. Y'all wanna pin that on BS, too?
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HuskyHawk said:
Umm...like the 170 pound kid playing for UCF last week? Who played against that *top* Hawaii competition in HS? :rolleyes:

Donovan Williams: Height / Weight: 6-4 / 215. Played HS ball in Virginia.
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C'mon... each kid is different (and the comment was clearly talking about Skanes - not Williams).
 
I'd love to see BS' pass chart for the year. I don't imagine that is out there for public consumption anywhere like this one for Baker Mayfield.
01.jpg
 
just looked at the final drive sequence JSM referred to earlier. First off, the dropped TD pass was on the previous possession, so my bad there.

All four plays on last sequence were from the 21, so technically not in red zone. But that's a quibble.

Noel is targeted on downs 1, 3 and 4. (this is an issue in an of itself, and I'm not sure if BS should be taking all the blame there) .Down 2 was ill-advised screen to Newsome.

Down 1 was an overthrow. Down 3 was a good play by the DB. Down 4 is also an overthrow.

But Down 4 sort of crystallizes things. First, Levy gets beat by 93. Newsome makes a bit of an attempt to pick him up, but releases. 93 gets a clean shot at BS, which he takes in BS's gut as BS is releasing the ball.

So all this talk about checkdowns and reads is all wonderful in theory. But when you don't have time to throw, well. . . .
 
FDNY99 said:
I'l name 2 who were just as good...and they both brought the team to bowl games..Tyler Lorenzen and Zach Frazer.
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Both those guys were better than this guy.
 
huskymedic said:
C'mon... each kid is different (and the comment was clearly talking about Skanes - not Williams).
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I know, but this is a thread about the QB. I think burning the RS on Skanes would be silly because (a) we have adequate depth and quality of play at WR and (b) there is nobody who could really get him the ball. But Williams? When he and BS are the only QBs on the roster next year? When our QB play has been pretty poor? When he is physically capable? What the hell are we getting from that extra season of eligibility? We could be an FCS program by then.
 
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