Bart Torvik conference rankings

shizzle787 · Nov 16, 2023

As I'm too cheap to buy a KenPom subscription and Sagarin is not updating his site, here is the up to the minute conference rankings according to Bart Torvik:
trank.php

1. Big 12 (.8965)
--------------------
2. SEC (.8321)
3. Big Ten (.8218)
4. Pac-12 (.8120)
5. Big East (.8110)
--------------------
6. ACC (.7396)
7. MW (.7380)
--------------------
8. A-10 (.6991)
9. WCC (.6869)
--------------------
10. AAC (.6330)
11. MVC (.6156)
12. Ivy (.5909)

Big drop off between Ivy (#12) and CUSA (#13).

A couple of observations:
1. The Big East is not the best league in the country. I could have told you this two weeks ago but some people are stubborn. We have been the #3 or #4 league almost every year for the past decade.
2. The Ivy League is making big strides. They are in the same stratosphere as the MVC and AAC (yikes!). They are also miles ahead of CUSA who is in the #13 spot.
3. The American got hit harder than I thought they would in realignment. The league is significantly behind the Atlantic 10 and WCC.
4. The ACC stinks again.

auror · Nov 16, 2023

When most people talk about Big East being the best, they were mostly referring to the conference with the best collection of top teams and ratio of tournament teams.

It was also with a romanticized version of Nova and St Johns.

These metrics on the other hand weight the middle and bottom equally. The bottom of the Big East is bad. Not ACC or AAC bad. But bad. It's measuring a different thing. Maybe a more accurate thing to the true question, but a different thing than what fans are really excited/talking about.

husky429 · Nov 16, 2023

All things considered, all those 2-5 teams are basically the same and will probably flip flop around all season.

The B12 is really solid. 10 top-50 teams on Kenpom. Big East only has 5.

Georgetown and Depaul are also really killing our rankings. If they were top-100 teams we'd probably be 2nd on this list.

superjohn · Nov 16, 2023

shizzle787 said:
As I'm too cheap to buy a KenPom subscription and Sagarin is not updating his site, here is the up to the minute conference rankings according to Bart Torvik:
trank.php

1. Big 12 (.8965)
--------------------
2. SEC (.8321)
3. Big Ten (.8218)
4. Pac-12 (.8120)
5. Big East (.8110)
--------------------
6. ACC (.7396)
7. MW (.7380)
--------------------
8. A-10 (.6991)
9. WCC (.6869)
--------------------
10. AAC (.6330)
11. MVC (.6156)
12. Ivy (.5909)

Big drop off between Ivy (#12) and CUSA (#13).

A couple of observations:
1. The Big East is not the best league in the country. I could have told you this two weeks ago but some people are stubborn. We have been the #3 or #4 league almost every year for the past decade.
2. The Ivy League is making big strides. They are in the same stratosphere as the MVC and AAC (yikes!). They are also miles ahead of CUSA who is in the #13 spot.
3. The American got hit harder than I thought they would in realignment. The league is significantly behind the Atlantic 10 and WCC.
4. The ACC stinks again.

Big East is the best, nobody cares about how horrible your worst couple of teams are.

shizzle787 · Nov 16, 2023

superjohn said:
Big East is the best, nobody cares about how horrible your worst couple of teams are.

We are both Big East homers, but the Big 12 is better.

Tyler2Rings · Nov 16, 2023

Kenpom 11/16

How Sway?! · Nov 16, 2023

The big 12 will get closer to the pack as the season goes on. UCF, Cincy will drag them down.

navery12 · Nov 16, 2023

How Sway?! said:
The big 12 will get closer to the pack as the season goes on. UCF, Cincy will drag them down.

Not so sure about that, every other P6 conference has multiple teams worse than UCF and Cincy that will also be dragging those conferences down

Huskyforlife · Nov 16, 2023

B12 is objectively the best right now. Top of the Big East compares to any conference, but the middle-end might be really bad. B10 is well rounded, but might only have 1 elite team. The SEC has the highest floor/ceiling imo.

CL82 · Nov 16, 2023

auror said:
The bottom of the Big East is bad. Not ACC or AAC bad.

I'd like to think that DePaul is as bad as any team in the country.

uh-no · Nov 16, 2023

sorry to say, but these ratings don't mean much 3 games into the season with most team only having games against patsies. kenpom himself says that it takes until mid-january or so when there is enough data to have a real view of the situation.

that said, it's probably not that far off from reality. It is probably slightly harder to go .500 in the B12 than the big east, and maybe so in the SEC. The ACC being at the bottom of this pile is absolutely correct, and the conference performance so far has proven that....even the games they've won have been by lackluster margins.

auror · Nov 16, 2023

CL82 said:
I'd like to think that DePaul is as bad as any team in the country.

The AAC now has UTSA which has never finished in the top 148 in the country. Ever. They're #274 right now.

The ACC has Louisville which has improved all the way up to #175. And Notre Dame is somehow actually worse.

Jaydumo20 · Nov 16, 2023

superjohn said:
Big East is the best, nobody cares about how horrible your worst couple of teams are.

I think you may be partially joking but I agree anyway. They may not definitely be the best, but there is a possibility that 3 of the top 5 teams are out of the big east. That has to matter. But then I guess it does come down to whether or not you rank the best bottom feeders as well. I don't.
(Also, at this time last year there was an unranked UCONN team and an unranked Marquette team as well as a #1 UNC, so it's hard to say this early)

kobe · Nov 17, 2023

HooperScooper · Nov 17, 2023

kobe said:

Doesn't help when the school you root for is at or near the bottom of that top ranked conference.

shizzle787 · Nov 23, 2023

Thanksgiving morning update:

1. Big 12 (.8765)
2. Big East (.8563)
3. Big Ten (.8349)
4. SEC (.8259)
-----------------------
5. Pac-12 (.7729)
6. ACC (.7566)
7. MWC (.7317)
-----------------------
8. Ivy (.6594)
9. A-10 (.6354)
10. MVC (.6325)
11. AAC (.6105)
12. WCC (.6039)

shizzle787 · Nov 23, 2023

This might be the Ivy League's best season in half a century. Possible two-bid league if Princeton rips through the league and loses to somebody in the league tournament.

BlueMAB · Nov 23, 2023

@kobe you have been a fun poster for awhile but you’re coming dangerously close to being a Rutgers clone.

“Our team sucks but at least our conference is good!”

Let us know when Cinci gets a trophy for Kansas’ success.

Glenn · Nov 23, 2023

if you use Lunardi's brackets as a basis, Big12 seems strongest and then the BE, with the SEC about the same. All teh big conferences have 6-8 teams, but the BE and B12 does better in the top 4 seeds. The ACC is no longer a strong conference--as we know.

	NCAA brackets
	1	2	3	4	1 to 4	rest	total
BE		3			3	3	6
B10	1			1	2	6	8
b12	1	1	1	1	4	4	8
acc			1	1	2	3	5
sec	1		1	1	3	5	8
pac	1				1	4	5

Fan1978 · Nov 23, 2023

shizzle787 said:
As I'm too cheap to buy a KenPom subscription and Sagarin is not updating his site, here is the up to the minute conference rankings according to Bart Torvik:
trank.php

1. Big 12 (.8965)
--------------------
2. SEC (.8321)
3. Big Ten (.8218)
4. Pac-12 (.8120)
5. Big East (.8110)
--------------------
6. ACC (.7396)
7. MW (.7380)
--------------------
8. A-10 (.6991)
9. WCC (.6869)
--------------------
10. AAC (.6330)
11. MVC (.6156)
12. Ivy (.5909)

Big drop off between Ivy (#12) and CUSA (#13).

A couple of observations:
1. The Big East is not the best league in the country. I could have told you this two weeks ago but some people are stubborn. We have been the #3 or #4 league almost every year for the past decade.
2. The Ivy League is making big strides. They are in the same stratosphere as the MVC and AAC (yikes!). They are also miles ahead of CUSA who is in the #13 spot.
3. The American got hit harder than I thought they would in realignment. The league is significantly behind the Atlantic 10 and WCC.
4. The ACC stinks again.

The big east is the best if you drop depaul and Georgetown. Best at top and best depth.

Poe · Nov 23, 2023

What the hell DePaul, 20 years and counting of dragging down the conference.

Guess that loss to us in the second round of the tourney really demoralized them for years to come.

AdamaNation · Nov 23, 2023

Drop DePaul go get vcu or Dayton!!!

Fan1978 · Nov 23, 2023

Glenn said:
if you use Lunardi's brackets as a basis, Big12 seems strongest and then the BE, with the SEC about the same. All teh big conferences have 6-8 teams, but the BE and B12 does better in the top 4 seeds. The ACC is no longer a strong conference--as we know.

NCAA brackets
1
2
3
4
1 to 4 rest total
BE
3
3
3
6
B10
1
1
2
6
8
b12
1
1
1
1
4
4
8
acc
1
1
2
3
5
sec
1
1
1
3
5
8
pac
1
1
4
5

This has a last year bias. Big 12 was best last year but its a new year. Big 10 sucks in tournament. Providence pounding Wisconsin says it all.

How Sway?! · Nov 23, 2023

Who would have thought itd be two original B12 teams dragging the conference down and not the newbies. Still, the time when all B12 teams were in tournament contention is over

InTheRed · Nov 23, 2023

WingU-Conn said:
@kobe you have been a fun poster for awhile but you’re coming dangerously close to being a Rutgers clone.

“Our team sucks but at least our conference is good!”

Let us know when Cinci gets a trophy for Kansas’ success.

I would like this twice if i could. Syracuse fans used to say that, but now their conference stinks too.

Bart Torvik conference rankings

shizzle787

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